Ok - show the government what we can do.
WALL
Thread going downhill in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1...
I don't understand amnesty's attractions, but I do understand our fecklessness and inability to articulate positions that are easily demagogued as 'mean-spirited'. I do understand that, having judged the other options unpalatable, Bush and others fall on amnesty as the only answer.
Shelby Steele's essay on "White Guilt" in Opinion Journal explained the impulse well. And it is a paradox of Bush, so tough in many ways but helpless when it comes to facing down the evils of multiculturalism and racial/ethnic/religious issues. The man who takes on Saddam and the Taliban is the same man who peddles the soft-hearted lie that Islam is a religion of peace. as the Governor of Texas, Bush consistently battled the hard-edged elements in his own party - Tom Pauken, members of the religious right, etc. "Compassionate conservative" was that triangulation that telegraphed he was a man who wouldn't do those punitive things.
There is a simple solution to our immigration woes. It is simple and workable, just not very easy. It will create hardship cases, whining, protests, and all sorts of counter-currents from those who prefer illegal immigration to legal immigration only. But it will be the one and only thing that will end illegal immigration in the massive levels that we've experienced in recent years: ENFORCE THE LAW. RIGOROUSLY.
But enforcing the law requires being punitive, in many cases against job opportunity seekers. So we surrender to illegal immigration by granting the lawbreakers citizenship rather than a ticket to the home country, for the same reason Steele mentions in how we fight 'minimalist' wars. It is a failure of the Will.
That failure leads to a conclusion that will create a policy far worse than our current policy of neglect and the other alternative of levels of increased law-enforcement and deportation. These real alternatives, and not the strawman of mass deportation, are the real comprehensive solutions, for you cannot have "comprehensive immigration reform" without immigration law enforcement, and you cannot have immigration law enforcement without deportation. (And our deportation system is broken).
Amnesty on the other hand, is abdication and surrender. It will not stop future illegal immigration, only induce it further. It will not make America a fairer place, only create an imported underclass of poverty-wage Americans (Latino poverty rates have been going up as latino immigration skyrockets, see David Frum's articles.) It will make America poorer, less able to control its future, and unwittingly will tie our politics to the interests of millions of dual-citizen Mexicans. And in the end, even the cheap-labor-lobby will lose, to the higher taxes and burdens all Americans will pay for this.
There is a cure: It starts with rejecting moral relativism and the axioms of "White Guilt"; recovering moral clarity that right is right and wrong is wrong, gets us out of the 'world-turned-upside-down' situation where malefactors (like terrorists) have right to dictate to us. (Consider the preaching bile of the Iranian Prime Minister.) Once we chase away the ghosts of the Guilt (Success Guilt, Male Guilt, White Guilt, etc.) we can then act with Moral steadiness. We should establish that the United States has the moral right to deport persons here in violation of immigration law.
America can and should act in the best interests of America and Americans. That is an important principle and fact to introduce, in this debate and many others as well. Being gun-shy on being selfish with respect to our own country, culture and citizens is the root of our problems. It is the heart of this impulse to do exactly the wrong thing, i.e., amnesty.
We must honor the great American tradition of having a majority Euro-white heritage.
We need to snap out of the white guilt trip that is meant to turn every white nation on earth into a white minority. Every other race of people has several countries populated by majorities of that race.
The Census Bureau recently announced that the US will be white minority by 2050, and that was before all of the mass immigration talk.
Ping - need your immigration suggestions again if you wish to add them.
Then set up stations at the border. All employers, and all illegals would have 30 days to check in. Businesses would have to request workers and show proof that the job had been offered to Americans. "Guests would be required to show proof of insurance and they and family members accompanied would be required to have a criminal and health check.
The "guests" would be required to be productive for America and not be eligible for benefits, including SS. A "Guest worker tax" equivalent to SS amount would be deducted. This would vary, dependent on how many children would require public school education.
Limit their work visit to two years at a time. Under no circumstances would I give them an edge on citizenship. One would have nothing to do with the other.
Finally,I would require registration but exempt the elderly already on SS . I don't want to be a nation that pushes the old people in wheelchairs to the middle of the bridge and let's them roll home.
PATROLLED WALL
POINT #5 ASSIMILATION
- End the myth of Birthright citizenship
- End the diversity quota
- Make English the official language of the United States
When caught the illegal should be tagged with a micro-chip. In this manner we could track them if they return again. The micro-chip can be activated at anytime and have a GPS locator.
Wall.
National Data Base with finger prints, picture and dna
Employer liability.
Stop access to regular free public school education at 14k each.
Stop giving anchor baby birth certificates.
Have a worker program where they come and work then leave.
Deny entrance to those that broke our laws or remove them.
More walls.
On immigration, here is a link to the article I wrote:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1059957/posts
Relevent part included here, specific policies to follow:
We need both the carrot and the stick to end the current inducements to illegal immigration. What is the best way to do this?
1. Massively improve our lax, inefficient and hapless enforcement of immigration law.
2. Change the immigration laws themselves to end 'chain migration' and 'anchor babies' that encourage forms of illegal entry and behavior.
3. Give a reasonable incentive for decent prospects for employers and immigrants wanting to work together, in a way that doesnt open the immigration 'floodgates'.
In the following sections, we present proposals that would do all of the above. But if we did all this, it would beg the question of whether indeed we needed the guest worker program. Only if we wanted more cheap (but legal) labor.
PROPOSALS - IMPROVING ENFORCEMENT:
According to FAIR: "The CIR [Jordan commission] recommended additional barriers to illegal employment, including a computerized registry to verify work eligibility and the full use of already-existing (but seldom invoked) penalties against employers who knowingly hire illegal aliens." - http://www.fairus.org/ImmigrationIssueCenters/ImmigrationIssueCenters.cfm?ID=1169&c=12
1. Create verifiable documentation for use in employment to stop documentation fraud. Set up a national database for document verification so document fraud is tracked down and stopped. Require employers to verify employment and hold employers responsible for hiring illegal aliens. " It is remarkable to note that in 2002, [only] 13 businesses nationwide were fined by the Immigration and Naturalization Service for knowingly employing illegal aliens. ... One simple change could put teeth into the law. Employers should be required to confirm that the Social Security number presented by a worker has in fact been issued to that worker. A computerized database, much like the nationwide instant-background check used to verify gun buyers, could handle that job easily. Such a database already exists, but it is seldom used. " - Jay Bookman A program called the Basic Pilot program has been working which verifies identifications. It is currently a voluntary program, it works, and it can be extended as a required program for the Government and private employers. Documentation fraud is a common way for illegal aliens to get employment even in Government, and verification against that is a certain way to cut down on documentation fraud by illegal aliens: "In July 2003, a federal grand jury indicted 44 people for the use of fake ?green cards? to gain employment at the U.S. Air Force Academy. In October 2003, about 60 illegal alien workers were found to be working on a construction project for a new federal courthouse in Miami. Numerous cases of illegal alien workers have been uncovered working with fake identity documents at U.S. airports as a result of ?Operation Tarmac.? Even the U.S. Army has been duped into enlisting illegal aliens using phony immigration documents. See, for example, Deseret News, October 5, 2003; The New York Times, July 16, 2003; Rocky Mountain News, September 2, 2003; and The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, November 7, 2003." http://www.fairus.org/ImmigrationIssueCenters/ImmigrationIssueCenters.cfm?ID=2314&c=13
1b. We should also develop and make the social security ID card a tamper-proof and fraud-proof form of identification, to reduce the abuse and fraud. Tom Tancredo has included this idea in his reform proposals.
1c. The Federal govt should discourage the issuance of driver's licenses to illegal aliens. HR. 3235, the Responsible and Secure ID Act, introduced by Rep. Duncan Hunter, would withhold federal transportation funding from states issuing driver?s licenses to illegal aliens. States should put some form of visa/citizen status on driver's licences, and ensure that the expiration date of driver's licenses doesnt extend beyond the expiration date of valid visas. H.R. 655 would bar Federal agencies from accepting for any identification-related purposes a state-issued driver's license, or other comparable identification document, unless the document issued to a nonimmigrant alien expires at the same time as the alien's authorized period of stay in the United States. This is needed both for homeland security purposes, and because issuing drivers licenses to illegal aliens hampers enforcement of immigration law. http://www.fairus.org/Legislation/Legislation.cfm?ID=2284&c=66
2. Pass laws and use verifiable documentation to end immigration benefit fraud as well. It is rampant (see the GAO, http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d0266.pdf)
3. Increase alien detention space so that aliens ready for deportation are held in detention and not released to the streets where they merely evade deportation. Increase bail requirements for aliens to be released during deportation processes.
4. Abolish the EOIR (Executive office for Immigration Review) and the BIA (Board of Immigration Appeals); their work is redundant and these agencies are part of a system not designed to deport aliens that deserve to be deported, but designed to frustrate the enforcement of immigration law. What is wrong with EOIR? EOIR routinely grants "green cards" (lawful permanent resident status) to illegal aliens, and allows convicted criminal aliens to remain in the United States. As Michelle Malkin suggests in her book "Invasion": "Attorney General John Ashcroft should abolish the Executive Office for Immigration Review and the Board of Immigration Appeals and transfer their functions to existing law enforcement officers within the immigration bureaucracy. ... Restoring integrity to the immigration process will require closing the loopholes and black holes into which so many fugitive absconders, criminal aliens, and unwelcome guests have disappeared. " - Michelle Malkin INS and Border Patrol Counsels could replace this byzantine process and administrative removal orders could be given administratively.
5. Fund the FBI's enforcement of immigration law so that it is a priority for the agency. In particular, increase funding to enforce laws against employing illegal aliens.
6. Increase funding and manpower of U.S. Border Patrol. Increased border vigilance has in the past lowered crime and improved border security; we need more of it. If needed, assign US. military troops to help the Border Patrol regain control of our border. Use practical technology where helpful - fences, UAVs, motion detectors - to manage the borders so there are less border crossings.
7. Give incentives and rewards to private citizens who turn in or report illegal aliens who are subsequently deported.
8. Encourage local law enforcement to enforce immigration law as well. H.R. 2671, the Clear Law Enforcement for Criminal Alien Removal Act, would give state and local law enforcement agencies the authority and resources needed to detain criminal illegal aliens within the course of their regular duties. It would also create a new grant program for the purchase of equipment for housing and processing illegal aliens.
9. Abolish 245(i) and other provisions of stealth amnesty that have been put there through law or court rulings. Criminal aliens should be deported without exceptions. For example, a loophole that gives women citizenship or LPR status for "spousal abuse" is an open invitation for fraud; men's lives have been destroyed by false allegations designed by illegal aliens to gain citizenship they wouldnt otherwise be entitled to. End that loophole in 204(a)(1)(A)(iii) of the immigration act. Hardship cases where felons are allowed to remain here because their dependents are here is also an open invitation to flout rules.
10. Do not accept nor allow the use of foreign ID or "matriculas" for use in banking, to obtain any Government aid or as an ID for any purpose.
CHANGING THE INCENTIVES FOR ILLEGAL ALIENS AND IMMIGRATION:
"There are many reasons immigration has returned to the high levels not seen since the beginning of the 20th century. One key factor is chain migration (the process whereby an immigrant who becomes a U.S. citizen is allowed to sponsor family members for obtaining immigrant visas). Other reasons are: illegal immigration; the amnesties which have allowed immigrants to make the transition to legal status and obtain green cards without leaving the country;and immigration law violators. Setting aside the problem of illegal immigration for a moment, the current system of legal immigration is not in accord with national needs, fuels undesirable population increase and cries out for major reform." -Jack Martin http://www.afsa.org/fsj/jun01/martinjune01.cfm
1. Granting automatic citizenship to the children of illegals born in the US must end. Children born here of foreigners should not automatically become US citizens, unless at least one parent is a legal US resident or citizen. Illegal aliens, those on temporary visas (under 1 yr) and diplomats would all be exempted from this as being foreigners "not under the jurisdiction of the United States". The 14th amendment is clear that people under the jurisdiction of the US born here are citizens. But it was not intended to apply to illegal aliens or other aliens in our country having kids, and illegal aliens are under the jurisdiction of their country of citizenship not ours. H.R. 1567 would amend the Immigration and Nationality Act to deny citizenship at birth to children born in the United States to parents who are not citizens or legal permanent resident aliens.
2. Restrict Federal public assistance to non-citizens except emergency health care. Per federal law (Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act), no one can be turned away for basic emergency services. Amend it so labor and non-life-threatening health services are not a Federal requirement unless there is legal residency status. This misuse of hospitals by illegal aliens is expensive and self-perpetuating.
3. Repeal aspects of the 1965 immigration laws that distort our immigration patterns and reward 'least likely to success' immigrants in the legal permanent residency lottery.
A. End family sponsorship and 'chain migration'. Do not let adult parents and siblings of immigrants from getting in on family sponsorship. Family sponsorship should be restricted to the sons, daughters and spouses of citizens and permanent residents. These changes were a key part of the proposal of the Jordan commission on immigration. They should be adopted.
B. Place hard limits on immigration. Just as there are limits for employer sponsored categories, there should be a total hard limit of legal immigration. It should be not more than .2% of population per year, or about 700,000 per year. Lower limits are both possible and desireable.
3c. "Prioritize skilled workers over unskilled workers: The CIR recommended reducing the ceiling for employment-sponsored immigration, ending unskilled immigration, and ending the diversity visa lottery."
3d. We should use only the temporary worker visa for the unskilled workers, ie, discourage the use of a permanent employer sponsorship for the unskilled worker. We should set fees on the temporary worker visa program so that extremely low-wage employment is discouraged in this program. Guest workers should not bring their families unless the pay for the employment is more than twice the poverty-level wage. The reason for this is to discourage a 'race to the bottom' that hurts the wage rates of Americans on the bottom rung of the economic ladder. It should not be our policy to import workers simply to undercut those Americans most in need of employment opportunities.
3e. We should also end the 'diversity' visa programs that encourages 80% of immigration to come from the third world, while excessively discouraging European immigration. This is related to the previous 2 points, as the 'diversity' visa program in effect is a discouragement of the potentially most skilled immigrants and encouragement of least skilled immigrants from 3rd world countries. This is counterproductive to the most effective immigration policy. H.R. 775, the Security and Fairness Enhancement for America Act, introduced by Rep. Bob Goodlatte (R-VA), would repeal this problematic program, which suffers from fraud and abuse by illegal aliens. http://www.fairus.org/Legislation/Legislation.cfm?ID=2288&c=66
3f. A simple replacement for this would be to restrict immigration so that no more than 20% of our immigration comes from any one country.
3g. "Simplify immigration categories: The CIR supported the basic set-up of our current immigration system, which divides immigrants into categories, but recommended that the categories be simplified to three: nuclear family members, professional and skilled workers, and refugees/other humanitarian admissions." http://www.fairus.org/ImmigrationIssueCenters/ImmigrationIssueCenters.cfm?ID=1169&c=12
3h. Require all future immigrants to declare their future intent to bring in family upon arrival. This way, families can immigrate in a controlled, orderly fashion without the current deceptions being used against the American public
4. Language: Change bilingual education to be a fast-track to English proficiency in the schools. Restore English-speaking requirements for citizenship.
5. Prohibit affirmative action preferences for non-citizens in Govt contracting. (Actually we should simply end affirmative action preferences period.)
6.Forbid any social security benefits to be paid out to illegal aliens who used fraudulent documents to obtain employment. This is simply a common-sense matter of not rewarding those who have broken the law from benefitting from their fraud. This also would add to the strain on the social security system. H.R. 1631 (Dana Rohrbacher sponsor) would prohibit illegal aliens from cashing into the Social Security system for any period of time during which the alien is not allowed to be employed.
7. Compile biometric information on Illegals, and declare that they will be permanently ineligible for citizenship.
Guest worker provisions:
1.We should punish those countries that are the soure of illegal immigration, by adopting a rule where if the country is the source of excessive illegal immigration, the legal immigration quota is commensurately reduced. Any country participating in this program cannot be responsible for allowing more than 10,000 of their citizens a year to be caught breaking our immigration laws. They can evade this limit by working with us by jailing those caught breaking our immigration laws. For example, with this provision we could induce Mexican law enforcement to help find and jail "coyotes" who assist illegal border crossers and get help and commitment from Mexico to battle illegal immigration from their side.
2. No temporary worker or his/her family and/or offspring shall qualify for any non-emergency public assistance program.
3. Instead of the employment having to be at least 125% of poverty wages to have the family join, make it 200% of poverty wages. This will make the need for public assistance for families less.
BAD IDEAS
The bad idea category is any form of amnesty to illegal immigration. This is the way to go if you want an uncontrolled system of immigration, But while Republicans oppose blanket amnesty many have signed on to feel-good legislation that amounts to mini amnesties. 'amnesty' is a term that could also be applied to the McCain version of the guest worker program, with an explicit visa category for illegal aliens.
This includes the use of 245(i) amnesties, which should be abolished not extended. It also includes the attempt to grant amnesty to ag workers through a massive expansion of that guest worker program. "Amnesty recipients under S. 1645 would need only to work 360 hours of agricultural work (the equivalent of 45 eight hour days) within seven years to receive a green card." And this uses an expansive definition of an agricultural worker to include landscapers. So an illegal alien landscaper for a mere season in the last 7 years need only make a claim, with poor documentation that is wide open to fraud, and they are amnestied, along with their entire family. These bills will only make our illegal immigration population larger, as it will induce many to come to America first and then try to get amnesty second. Do we want that? Indeed a question may be asked: If a new guest worker program is proposed, isnt it redundant with an agricultural guest worker program?
The DREAM Act (S.1545, cosponsored by Orrin Hatch) would allow illegal aliens to attend state universities at in-state tuition rates, while unfairly denying those benefits to U.S. citizens and legal immigrants from other states. The bill would also grant amnesty to college-bound and other illegal aliens as well as provide legal status to the family members of these illegal aliens through chain migration. There is no upper age limit on eligibility. Nor shuold we add to in-state costs of legal residents by letting the children of illegal aliens get in-state tuition rates.
CONCLUSION
Thus the formula for success is a balanced and complete reform, not one that adds just another visa to the pile. A small guest worker program, vigorous enforcement of law, and end chain migration and anchor babies. then we would have a saner policy: more space for the 'workers only' migrants, no flood of illegal aliens, and a manageable labor influx that doesn't hurt American workers.
In the House, elements of these reforms are being proposed. Tom Tancredo has pushed a bill in the House that embodies most of these principles.
In the mid-1990s, the Jordan Commission looked into our policies on immigration and came to the same broad conclusions. They said: "The credibility of immigration policy can be measured by a simple yardstick: people who should get in do get in; people who should not get in are kept out; and people who are judged deportable are required to leave." - Jordan Commission on Immigration Reform These goals should be in our minds as we go about fixing the broken immigration system.
IMO .. stop funding the social programs for the illegals
1 end the anchor baby policy
2 end welfare benefits for non-citizens
3 end subsidized health care for non-citizens
4 swift and harsh jailtime for employers of illegals
5 build a 1951 mile wall from the Pacific to the Gulf
6 allow non-citizens to cross into Mexico with impunity
7 overthrow the current Mexican regime and install a non-corrupt, capitalistic government
#1 Secure the border! Build that 3 tier fence along the entire length of the border. Add more checkpoints? Fine! Add at least those 6,000 new Border Patrol agents, probably more.
#2 Remove the incentive to enter illegally. Impose severe fines on companies found to employ illegal immigrants. $50,000 per illegal? $100,000? Heavily tax money earned illegally before it is sent back other countries.
#3 LASTLY, establish the Guest Worker program. Set up offices in the US and in Mexico and other countries. US companies must show they tried and could not hire a citizen or legal resident before registering with a Guest Worker office here. Potential guest workers register with an office in their country. Workers and jobs are matched and temporary work visa's issued. Cross the border legally.
There is only one reason why some are so insistent that the legislation be "comprehensive" and deal with the border and the guest worker program together. That is because they know the guest worker plan they want to pass would never pass on its own. They hope the opponents of the guest worker program would want the border security enough to vote for the bill anyway.
Plug the leak first! Then start bailing!
I hate to risk appearing less than brilliant or informed, but I don't see any signs that either the President or the majority in the Senate give a tinker's dam what any of us think, although some members of the House do seem to care. My personal experience in phone calls to the offices of my REPUBLICAN Senators (Frist and Alexander) was pretty much, "Get lost, chump." They've lost me as a voter.
I'll be back at some point later to add my 'two cents.'
Thanks for this effort. Cooler heads and rational minds WILL win the day at FR.
(Be prepared to herd cats. ;)
I suggest a triple heavy-duty chain link fence, with the middle one being ELECTRIC.
That way, the outer fences protect stupid people from stumbling upon the electric fence and getting hurt.
But if someone is dumb enough to challenge the middle fence, he or she will get a nasty shock, strong enough to render dizzy or unconscious but not enough to kill.
***Of course the fences would have trip alarms to notify border patrol in case someone touches or otherwise tries to climb.
**I'm not sure if the electric fence could be compromised by someone wearing a rubber insulated suit. If anyone knows such matters, post away.
Thanks for this thread. Makes more sense when a person doesn't have to sift through all the other junk to get to the ideas.