Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Lord of the Rings - help needed (vanity)

Posted on 06/24/2005 7:13:06 AM PDT by hispanichoosier

I need help with LOTR. Two friends and I were discussing the books and movies last weekend. Friend 1 observed that the relationship between Frodo and Sam (in the movies) had homosexual overtones. Friend 2 retorted that the relationship is based on the master/servant relationship of old England and that Friend 1 was looking at it through American eyes, where rugged individualism is more prized. I--caught in the middle--had to admit that I thought that Sean Astin overplayed Sam at times but was great overall.

So, was Friend 1 right about the gay overtones, or was Friend 2's explanation correct? I'm rather at a loss over the whole debacle.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; The Hobbit Hole
KEYWORDS: aragorn; bilbo; fanboy; frodo; gandalf; lord; rings; sam; thisthreadisgay; tolkien
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 61-8081-100101-120 ... 261-265 next last
To: RosieCotton

What was wrong with Haldir?


81 posted on 06/24/2005 8:23:50 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies]

To: HairOfTheDog

I am so out of it in so many ways!!! (too niave also, I guess).. have a good one.. lots work here & then pooch walk with my friend & his two dogs before the "week-end" stuff commences


82 posted on 06/24/2005 8:24:23 AM PDT by DollyCali ("Thank you for your ANSWERS". POTUS to press at end of Presser 28 April 05)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 77 | View Replies]

To: Alouette
to wolf pups, it is playing

Good point.

83 posted on 06/24/2005 8:27:12 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Working Class Zero with wall-to-wall carpeting.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 80 | View Replies]

To: hispanichoosier

if you had read the books you would have known that they are merely friends..as master and servant nothing more.


84 posted on 06/24/2005 8:27:33 AM PDT by mistress_of_tantra (It is too damn hot to think of anything witty....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: hispanichoosier

If you read the books, you'll see Sam was not overplayed, and the books have ZERO - NADA - homosexual tones of any kind.

When I was a teenageer and young adult, I read and re-read LOTR numerous times. Drew maps. Learned runes. The whole thing, could recite parts of the books.

Have the extended versions of the movie.

IMO, Frodo was miscast. In the book, he was not a squeamish, delicate youth. He was a stolid man of 50.

Aragorn was also miserably miscast. Mr. "No Blood for Oil" was not kingly. Theoden was kingly. Mr. "No Blood"s eyes are too close together, his voice not commanding, his presence too self absorbed, and his persona more of a loser/loner than a descendent of the line of kings. Especially his voice was bad.

Just a couple of thoughts.


85 posted on 06/24/2005 8:32:03 AM PDT by little jeremiah (A vitiated state of morals, a corrupted public conscience, are incompatible with freedom. P. Henry)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: hispanichoosier

At least Samwise never took Frodo's car keys away from him when Frodo started to display self-destructive behavior. That would definitely have sexual overtones which would (in my humble opinion) require some overzealous prosecutor to charge Samwise with battery.


86 posted on 06/24/2005 8:32:53 AM PDT by flada (Y2K? What are you selling, chicken or sex jelly?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: hispanichoosier
Friend 1 has personal isssues.

Tolkien, a committed Roman Catholic, would have abominated the suggestion.

Ian McKellan who, sadly, is homosexual, said fairly emphatically that no homosexuality was implied in Frodo and Sam's relationship.

Dan
Biblical Christianity BLOG

87 posted on 06/24/2005 8:32:54 AM PDT by BibChr ("...behold, they have rejected the word of the LORD, so what wisdom is in them?" [Jer. 8:9])
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: RosieCotton; Mamzelle

It seemed to me that he just made up a character and gave it the name "Haldir," in order to fit into scenes that were also made up. Bad taste, imo.

And Aragorn was considerably weaker than the character in the book ... modern, conflicted, and all that.


88 posted on 06/24/2005 8:33:08 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Working Class Zero with wall-to-wall carpeting.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick; RosieCotton

I'll concede that Aragorn was more "modern and conflicted" in the movies... but there was self doubt in the book that was part of his character, even if it was expressed differently.

I don't get complaints with Haldir though... In his scenes at Lothlorien, his lines and attitude seem right out of the book. The only major deviation I can see is the plotline deviation that brought him to Helm's Deep. Is that what you two mean?


89 posted on 06/24/2005 8:38:23 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 88 | View Replies]

To: HairOfTheDog

That's what I mean, yes.


90 posted on 06/24/2005 8:44:03 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Working Class Zero with wall-to-wall carpeting.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 89 | View Replies]

To: little jeremiah
eyes are too close together, his voice not commanding, his presence too self absorbed, and his persona more of a loser/loner than a descendent of the line of kings

But compared to Viggo "The Lights Are On But Nobody's Home" Mortenson, the Aragon character is the second coming of Robert E. Lee. I was just boggled by the interviews I saw; you could practically see in his eyes and out his ears.

(/trashy celeb bashing)

91 posted on 06/24/2005 8:46:01 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Working Class Zero with wall-to-wall carpeting.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 85 | View Replies]

To: Ragtop
"Peter Jackson, Fran Walsh and Phillipa Boyens, who adapted the novels into the screenplay, though wanting to capture Tolkiens prose, were also very aware of the way audience may interpret it. For the movies, they actually toned it down quite a bit."

Thanks for informing us. Many don't have childhood friends. Many don't have familiar brothers to speak of. Personally, I loathe "male bonding", but I do value that it exists without polluted sexual predation.

Perhaps we'll have a rebirth of friendships likened to the bond that J.R.R. Tolkien had with his long lost mates--a romantic fellowship without the strain of perversion.
92 posted on 06/24/2005 8:46:53 AM PDT by SaltyJoe ("Social Justice" begins with the unborn child.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick

OK - Well, I'd catagorize that as a PJ/writers complaint and not a complaint about the way the character was played.

I know it didn't happen, but I liked it as film. It was a cool moment, those guys showing up. ;~D


93 posted on 06/24/2005 8:52:22 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 90 | View Replies]

To: AppyPappy
Why do all friendly male relationships have to be about homosexuality?

Because homosexual men are so narcissistic. EVERYTHING has to be about THEM! They just dominate the attitudes about male relationships, so those that are strictly NON-sexual are tainted with those attitudes.

94 posted on 06/24/2005 8:53:33 AM PDT by SuziQ
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: HairOfTheDog

In my case, it's that there's a difference between being noble, rather proud, and suspicous of outsiders...and just being a snoot.

Movie Haldir was a snoot.

Bringing elves to Helm's Deep wasn't in the books, but it didn't bother me as much as it maybe should. ;-)


95 posted on 06/24/2005 8:53:47 AM PDT by RosieCotton (The poets have been mysteriously silent on the subject of cheese. - G.K. Chesterton)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 89 | View Replies]

To: HairOfTheDog

No, not a complaint about the acting at all. The acting was overwhelmingly excellent, in the context of the script.


96 posted on 06/24/2005 8:55:20 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Working Class Zero with wall-to-wall carpeting.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 93 | View Replies]

To: Tax-chick; little jeremiah
We call Viggo 'Mumbly Joe' when we see him interviewed. In Aragorn character, he could at least annunciate ;~D
97 posted on 06/24/2005 8:55:50 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 91 | View Replies]

To: RosieCotton; Textide
Sam ended up with Rosie Cotton.

;o)

98 posted on 06/24/2005 8:56:13 AM PDT by SuziQ
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: SuziQ

I like that part...

Though I do like the book Sam more than movie Sam, even though Sean Astin wasn't bad.


99 posted on 06/24/2005 8:57:07 AM PDT by RosieCotton (The poets have been mysteriously silent on the subject of cheese. - G.K. Chesterton)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 98 | View Replies]

To: HairOfTheDog
We call Viggo 'Mumbly Joe' when we see him interviewed.

He does tend to talk quietly without moving his mouth.

100 posted on 06/24/2005 8:58:12 AM PDT by ecurbh
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 97 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 61-8081-100101-120 ... 261-265 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson