[Celtjew Libertarian]

A few grists of thought for the mill.

[dennisw]

This film will be shown worldwide. So what will those audiences get from it as far as anti Semitism?

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

Bump for an insight.

[anniegetyourgun]

"For this reason the Father loves Me, because I lay down My life so that I may take it again. " John 10:17

The scriptures are replete with the evidence that the death of Jesus was volitional and purposeful. Neither the Jews nor the Romans were even able to lay hands upon Him until the appointed time. He died for the sin of ALL mankind for ALL time in ALL ages.

This fixation on "who killed Jesus" points to our continued belief that somehow we have something to do with the eternal plan of God. How arrogant of little man.

[FITZ]

Maybe Nazis shouldn't be shown as Germans. People might get the wrong idea about Germans.

[R. Scott]

Actually, God killed His Son if you believe in the Judeo-Christian religions.
It was preordained that He would die. He had to die to fulfill the prophecies.
If the Christ had not died a terrible death, Christianity would still be a small sect of Judaism.

[Salman]

We Jews are understandably touchy on this issue, but I gave Mel Gibson the benefit of the doubt, and so I saw one good movie.

I still have a problem with all the children in the theatre. Reading about it is OK for children, seeing it is quite another thing.

[conservativecorner]

Gibson thinks and I agree that we all sent Jesus to the cross by our transgressions and inequities. In the movie Gibson makes a cameo appearance when he nails Jesus to the cross. It's more than just a scene in the movie. It's Mel's public confession that he knows Jesus suffered and died at the hands of not only the jews and romans but all mankind.

[E. Pluribus Unum]

Jesus was an anti-Semitic Jew, don'tcha know?

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

Take a look at the politics of most of the critics. They're on the political left. And among the views held on the political left is support of affirmative action. Many on the left support slave reparations. Many blame American actions for the acts of 9/11.

In short, most of the left believe in collective guilt. They may not call it that, but penalizing members of certain groups and rewarding others for misdeeds in the past is collective guilt.

Leftism can best be understood as the political implications of the perspective of journalism.

Given a free, competitive journalism whose profits depend critically on circulation (if expenses are 90% of revenue, a 10% increase in revenue would double your profit), journalism should be expected to be dominated by the most facile and demagogic reporting--it's only natural.

And collective guilt is precisely a facile and demagogic excuse for lovingly retelling stories of past evils. A natural topic for cheap excitement. And as the example of reparations for slavery illustrates, the collective to which guilt is assigned need not exclude the target audience; the putatively guilty find it impossible to ignore the accusation.

So naturally, collective guilt is a component of the perspective of journalism--and the politician who sails down the propaganda wind of (so-called "objective") journalism--the leftist--is attracted to collective-guilt mongering. Link to this thread on the leftist perspective of journalism.

[Agnes Heep]

One thing a lot of people don't take into consideration is the political climate of first century Judaea. Jews there tended to see Roman occupation as intolerable, and there was always a radical element of the population or some isolated "prophet" ready to lead an insurrection against Roman rule. The leading political figures among the Jews were pragmatic enough (and probably self-interested enough) to appreciate the disaster that would fall upon the province if any one of those insurrections gained sufficient force to invite Roman retaliation. (Lest anyone doubt this, let him witness what happened between 66 and 70 a.d. when it actually took place--the entire province was overthrown, millions of Jews were either killed or sold into slavery, and Jerusalem was razed to the ground.)

Whatever may be said about the ministry of Jesus, it seems beyond dispute that, at least for a short time, he succeeded in exciting the public imagination, to the point where a popular uprising might well have been fomented. Under the circumstances, can anyone blame the leading Jews (or any Jew at all, for that matter) for wanting him out of the way?

[Blood of Tyrants]

As Mel Gibson said, "There were only two groups there. The Romans and the Jews. There weren't any Norweigans, there weren't any French. It had to be one of them."

But that is beside the point. The Old Testement in the Christian Bible is the same book the Jews read, containing the Torah, Chronicles, Kings, the books of Samuel, Psalms, Job, the major and minor prophets, etc. (the Christian bible does not contain the books of the Macabees). All through the Old Testement, there are prophesies that predict that the Jews of 2000 years ago would reject the Messiah that was sent to them.

Since we believe that Jesus WAS the Messiah, i.e. the divine son of God, he willinglly gave himself up. No one killed him without his consent. The Jews gave Jesus over to the Romans for execution, just as was prophesied.

John 19:11, Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above."

The people who would use "The Passion of the Christ" as an excuse to persecute Jews are NOT Christians, probably won't see the movie, and if they do, they won't get it.

If you go see it, do so with an mind open to the possibility that biblical prophesy is right and the Jews chose wrongly 2000 years ago.

http://www.jewsforjesus.com/

[Just mythoughts]

So what?


Interesting question, I suppose the question stems with a lack of knowledge and awareness of the prophecy penned by King David called in modern time Psalms 22. As it is written Christ taught this Psalms while hanging upon that cross.

You don't believe Christ you don't believe the OLD Testament.

[veronica]

Did Jews Kill Jesus? So What?...

So Mel Gibson thinks Vatican II is an abomination. Isn't that one of the issues here? Shall the Church return to pre-Vatican II days? It's a question that affects both Christians and Jews.

[missyme]

What's the Christian Bible? I don't think anyone in this generation can relate to people from 2000 years ago, people relate to G-d, his promies, his word his hope for the future and eternal life...When it's all said and done you either face G-d and give him 2 reasons on how you lived your human life.

1. G-d I obeyed all your commandments of TORAH never strayed...Please judge me accordingly.

2. G-d I was a full blown SINNER, I did not obey any commandments of TORAH, with all my heart I asked your son
Jesus Christ to enter my heart and my life and forgive me for my SINS. Please judge me accordingly...

[tang-soo]

This is from my study sheet used during service last week ...

Who killed Jesus?

1) The Roman Soldiers

2) Pilate

3) Chief priests and elders

4) Judas Iscariot

5) Satan

6) Us

7) God The Father

If you are shocked by the final answer, please read Isaiah 53 here.

[WKB]

Peter Speaking to the Jews said this:

Acts 3:12 When Peter saw this, he said to them: “Men of Israel, why does this surprise you? Why do you stare at us as if by our own power or godliness we had made this man walk?
Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified his servant Jesus. You handed him over to be killed, and you disowned him before Pilate, though he had decided to let him go.
Acts 3:14 you disowned the Holy and Righteous One and asked that a murderer be released to you.
Acts 3:15 You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are witnesses of this.

[Mike Darancette]

How can any one person or group be held to account for fulfilling God's Will? The death of Jesus at that specific time, place and method was prophesied.

[GreatOne]

Very nicely said. It was the religious establishment, who happened to be Jewish, that killed a fellow Jew for what they perceived to be heresy. This "Jews killed Christ" bit, even though an historical tragedy, is plain silly and stupid.

[philosofy123]

and even then, by those relatively few Jews who called for Jesus's death (Jews were already rather widely dispersed through the Roman Empire at that time, even if the Diaspora had not yet occurred) -- is un-American. More than blaming children for the actions of parents, it is blaming people of today for what their potential fifty-plus-times-great-grandparents may or may not have done and said. It goes against the American belief of individual responsibility.

Our contemporary brain do nut understand that logic of punishing the children for the sins of the parent, indeed for the sins of the great great great great grand parents! But, if you reflect on the Semitic culture from the desert, and their barbaric tribal way of life, you would find that historically, people from the Mid East did just that. As a matter of fact in the bible, you read that the Jews cried out "his blood will be on us, and our children after us"! This illustrates how the thinking of that time that if some body wronged you, and you are unable to extract revenge from him, you may extract revenge on his children.

To make this discussion even more controversial, I would like to take you back to the first creation. God created Adam, and Eve, then they sinned, and then God was upset at their sins, and considered even their children, and children children to be sinners. Obviously God has a tribal desert mentality as well? Or, the bible was written by desert Semite type writers?

[ambrose]

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