Are revolvers ideal or out-dated for personal defense? Not many gun enthusiasts debate this, they rather speak of comparison between 9mm vs .45 but its still worth a discussion. Posted on 07/16/2020 7:32:42 AM PDT by w1n1
Are revolvers ideal or out-dated for personal defense? Not many gun enthusiasts debate this, they rather speak of comparison between 9mm vs .45 but its still worth a discussion.
Chris Baker from Lucky Gunner asked that question a while back and came up with some really good points about revolvers while attending a defensive revolver training class.
The class was conducted by Darryl Bolke and Wayne Dobbs of Hardwired Tactical. Other instructors to help lighten the teaching load were Chuck Haggard and Claude Werner. Each instructors taught different topics related to the defensive use of revolvers.
Some of the sentiments were:
“…the guys at the revolver roundup came across as being a lot more pro-revolver.
The prevailing sentiment…was that the revolver are kind of like the every man gun.
It should be the go-to firearm for the average civilian who wants something for personal protection and semi-autos are probably best reserved for more dedicated shooters.
People who say revolvers never malfunction never shoot their revolvers.
These perspectives might seem pretty incompatible on the surface, but I think there's a lot of merit to both of them.
-this paradox of how revolvers can be seriously flawed but also maybe the ideal self-defense tool for most people.
-He is quick to point out, however, that the revolver is not without its flaws.
-It never ceases to amaze me just how many people are under the impression that revolvers are incapable of malfunctioning.
The fact of the matter is that even though revolvers can be very reliable, they’re also prone to some pretty serious issues that don’t affect semi-autos. Just in the past year, had I’ve had plenty of revolvers malfunction on me and I’ve also seen people on the range have problems, too.
Problems like…
A frozen cylinder from debris under the extractor star or from out of spec primers.
An extractor rod backing itself out preventing the cylinder from opening.
Multiple light primer strikes...Read the rest of revolvers perfect or outdated.
As a long time instructor, I dont disagree with anything you just stated regarding revolvers. I didnt think we were talking about leaving revolvers in the cocked state. Stay safe FRiend.
Not taking sides on a discussion which I was first aware of in the 80’s. The same stupid back and forth will all be repeated today. Well it is easier and more soothing to talk about equipment rather than fighting. I accept that advocating one position or another comes from a noble motive. I you think that round count is actually decisive, then you could save someone’s life by getting him to carry a semi instead of a wheelgun. It is however a misdirection.
The wise and noble sounding ones will say that only hits count and will repeat, “Go to the range! Get to the range, More range time,” ad nauseum, but they evidently have never paid attention to what people actually do when they are at the range, and never explain why constant repetition of bad habits is a good thing.
Anyway, you mentioned that it took 12 rounds to put the guy down and this is based on a fallacy. I agree that one should keep shooting till he is down, so please don’t feel I am correcting you. NO handgun wound except to the base of the brain or spinal column produces immediate incapacitation. The rounds are simply not moving fast enough. It takes time. Rifle rounds are another matter of course.
How does a round to the torso actually cause incapacitation? If we think about it we will realize that our expectations are influenced by movies and TV.
An off duty cop was at the teller when a robber came in. Cop pulled his backup nine and the bad guy jumped on him. Cop put the first round through the man’s heart and bad guy fought for another 90 seconds! Then he ran out of the bank and died outside in the parking lot a few feet from the door. He was NOT on drugs, and there is nothing atypical about the encounter. He died from blood loss. Simple as that.
I know that nothing I will say can stop this pointless discussion, but if there is anybody listening to me, I suggest Marc “Animal” McYoung at
http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com.
Here is an article by the FBI on this:
http://gundata.org/images/fbi-handgun-ballistics.pdf
I hope everyone understands the simple maxim, “A gunfight is more fight than gun!”
My revolver can shoot subsonic ammo without any of the cycling issues that my semi has.
or you are under serious a serious siege.
Nothin’ more reliable than a wheel gun...
Time not rounds.
It takes time for a handgun wound to take effect. That’s how many rounds they shoot.
My 101 lb. wife had one of those and was pretty handy with it. She eventually traded it in for a semi-auto, but I wish we still had it. It was beautiful. Somehow, my wife was even more beautiful holding it...
Shot my brother’s S&W Governor using 45 ACP a few weeks ago. Very impressed by the alloy used in frame weight reduction. Still sufficient to help with recoil, but makes it good to handle for an old timer.
I think I see what you are saying, but I dont think anyone, police or otherwise, are thinking about how long its going to take for that wounded perp to bleed out. They are addressing whether there is still a threat. If there is, they keep shooting.
This would have been during the period CHP went from .38 to .357 rather than .45. They may not have desired the latter and asked for something in between. 1930’s - 40’s - 50’s?
When did your namesake debut?
I think you don’t question the method or statistics, but the construct and validity of the measure itself.
That’s valid as hell.
In some ways it’s like comparing 12 guage 00 with an AR.
Two different jobs.
I carry a sig p230 .380 most of the time. I figure I can hit a man in the face at 20ft every trigger pull. And I’m inclined to take it with me everywhere.
But I carry the .357 when in the woods fishing or camping.
It also rotates with my .40 Model 96 (Border Marshal Special) as my nightstand gun.
I keep a Mossberg tactical under my bed in case antifa shows up for a visit.
There is no perfect gun for every job.
I love it when folks assume they can speak for me. Not really. Not sure why you want to try to argue over the ‘best’ gun for man killing. You havent told me anything I dont already know except everything about how you defend your home and self. Not sure I can say thats a good defensive strategy. Me? I lost all my guns and several boating accidents over the years, the most recent one being fairly recent. Cheers.
In about 1980 I was 18 and had a pretty good job. Cool store, small chain I think called Gibson’s. Really good sporting goods section. Had 2 Pythons. One blued, the other nickel. Nickel was 20 bucks more than the blued if I remember correctly. Looked at them for mo’s. The bluing was the best I’ve ever seen. And the trigger was as smooth and light as any production revolver I’ve ever held.
One day I went in and the nickel one was gone. Still didn’t buy. Next time I went in the Blue was gone. Never saw another one in there. 385.00 at that time.
BTW. Just a couple of years ago I found out it was one of my friends who bought the Nickel. Still has it. Been offerd a lot of money for it but he won’t sell.
You prefer to roll over on your back and pi$$ straight up. But to each his own. 2aProtectsTheRest, unless you're confronted. Orwellian pap.
The Colt Python is the Bentley of revolvers.
The .44 Magnum cartridge was the end result of years of tuned handloading of the .44 Special. The .44 Special, and other large-bore handgun cartridges, were being loaded with heavy bullets, pushed at higher than normal velocities for better hunting performance. One of these handloaders was Elmer Keith, a writer and outdoorsman of the 20th century.
Keith settled on the .44 Special cartridge as the basis for his experimentation, rather than the larger .45 Colt. At the time, the selection of .44 caliber projectiles for handloaders was more varied, and the .44 Special's brass was thicker and stronger than the dated .45 Colt case. Also, the .44 Special case was smaller in diameter than the .45 Colt case. In revolvers of the same cylinder size, this meant that the .44 caliber revolvers had thicker, and thus stronger, cylinder walls than the .45. This allowed higher pressures to be used with less risk of a burst cylinder.
Keith encouraged Smith & Wesson and Remington to produce a commercial version of this new high-pressure loading, and revolvers chambered for it. Smith & Wesson's first .44 Magnum revolver, the Model 29, was built on December 15, 1955, and the gun was announced to the public on January 19, 1956 for a price of US$140 ($1330 in 2020 dollars) Julian Hatcher (technical editor of American Rifleman) and Keith received two of the first production models. Hatcher's review of the new Smith & Wesson revolver and the .44 Magnum cartridge appeared in the March 1956 issue of the magazine. Smith & Wesson produced 3,100 of these revolvers in 1956.
By the summer of 1956, Sturm, Ruger became aware of this project and began work on a single action Blackhawk revolver for the new .44 Magnum cartridge. A popular rumor says a Ruger employee found a cartridge case marked ".44 Remington Magnum" and took it to Bill Ruger, while another says a Remington employee provided Ruger with early samples of the ammunition. Ruger began shipping their new revolver in late November 1956.
The .44 Magnum case is slightly longer than the .44 Special case, not to make more room for propellant, but to prevent the far higher pressure cartridge from being chambered in older, weaker .44 Special firearms, thus preventing injuries and possible deaths.
The .44 Magnum was an immediate success, and the direct descendants of the S&W Model 29 and the .44 Magnum Ruger Blackhawks are still in production, and have been joined by numerous other makes and models of .44 Magnum revolvers and even a handful of semi-automatic models, the first being produced in the 1960s. The film Dirty Harry, prominently featuring the S&W M29, contributed to that model's popularity (as well as the cartridge itself).
Ruger introduced its first long gun, a semi-automatic carbine called the Ruger Model 44 chambered for .44 Magnum, in 1959. Marlin followed soon after with the lever action Model 1894 in .44 Magnum. Having a carbine and a handgun chambered in the same caliber is an old tradition; the .44-40 Winchester was introduced by Winchester in a lever action in 1873, and Colt followed in 1878 with a revolver in the same caliber. The .38-40 Winchester and .32-20 Winchester were also available in both carbines and revolvers, allowing the shooter to use one type of ammunition for both firearms.
So you would be forced to shoot them.
And in almost every state in the US, you would have been charged and in some of the states almost certainly convicted on the grounds that as long as you are outside and they are inside, your life was not in danger and that makes it a bad shoot.
The courts do not look favorably on Rambos and cowboys.
One should know in detail the self defense laws of the area in which he operates as well has how they are enforced, as some prosecutors are creative in their interpretations of the law.
And the best self defense of all is to avoid situations that are likely to force you to shoot. Rambos are not treated as heroes by the courts, plus the lawyers will own you after it is all over.
Or going to prison.
Yes.
And cheap to shoot, especially reloaded. Revolver probably heavier, less recoil and
And possibly more accurate, not that important in concealed weapon, but important out a ways if you are shooting magnum loads out a ways. And revolver possibly more accurate because it eliminates tendency to spray and pray. Force each round to count.
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