Mother Theresa and Hillary

Freep | 1/24/2016 | Charles O'Connell

[CharlesOConnell]

There was once a group of Catholic nuns called Hawthorne Sisters, led by an African-American woman who starved to death. They would teach young Black children all day, run a laundry at night, the sister worked herself to death sacrificing even the small amount of food the other sisters were allotted.

Mother Theresa told of taking a bag of rice to the mother of a starving Hindu family, the woman could hardly get the words of thanks out her mouth as she poured half the rice into another bag, excused herself, took the second bag next door to a Muslim woman whose family were starving even worse.

Agnes became such a wrinkled, misshapen little old woman because she decided to pursue beauty of soul above everything else, to "do something beautiful for God".

I thought this picture was photoshopped to enlarge Hillary on the right side. She must have looked like a giant to little Mother Theresa, the way adults look to toddlers.

God is perfectly happy within Himself, He doesn't need anything from us, there's nothing we can do to make Him richer, happier or more beautiful.

It's we who need to become more like Him.

Agnes found out how.

[CharlesOConnell]

[Joe Boucher]

Ouch, that’s gotta hurt.

[Tax-chick]

There was once a group of Catholic nuns called Hawthorne Sisters, led by an African-American woman who starved to death. They would teach young Black children all day, run a laundry at night, the sister worked herself to death sacrificing even the small amount of food the other sisters were allotted.

Do you have more information, perhaps a source, for this?

The Dominican Sisters of Hawthorne, founded by Rose Hawthorne (Mother Alphonsa), daughter of the novelist, are a going concern. Their primary ministry is the care of cancer patients.

[CharlesOConnell]

It was the late Father Benedict Groeschel on an EWTN series, he was once sharper than a tack, they kept him on the air too long after he’d been run over, died and was resuscitated, had the neurological effect of a stroke, he said something unwise on the air that I know is true because I saw it personally twice, “some kids act seductively toward adults”, he was toast, you can’t find his stuff.

[Tax-chick]

Ah. Perhaps he had the Dominican Sisters of Hawthorne confused with another order. The Sisters of the Holy Family seems like a good possibility.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henriette_DeLille

[wbarmy]

And this is how someone gets totally flamed;

Mother Theresa told of taking a bag of rice to the mother of a starving Hindu family, the woman could hardly get the words of thanks out her mouth as she poured half the rice into another bag, excused herself, took the second bag next door to a Muslim woman whose family were starving even worse.

Did either of those families, the Hindu or Muslim family, seek out Christ after her gift, or did they both die and go to hell? Because she was so busy feeding their bodies and attending to their physical needs, she never pointed out their spiritual need.

[Mrs. Don-o]

You’re presuming a lot there.

[Tax-chick]

You're presuming a lot there.

For example, that the referenced people had never previously been exposed to the claims of Christianity.

That they would have converted if Mother Teresa had provided, along with rice, the contention that they must believe in Jesus or go to Hell.

[wbarmy]

I am not presuming anything. I do not know.

But historically, there is not much evidence she proselytized at all.

And social gospel people very seldom proselytize, claiming over and over that Jesus said we were to care for the poor, but forgetting that the first thing is getting out the Gospel. Feeding the poor does nothing, if Jesus Christ is not magnified.

[married21]

I don’t know about Mother Theresa herself, but her order has a home for unwed mothers in LA. The sisters there include Christian prayer with the mothers as part of what they do.

[Tax-chick]

They have a similar home in Charlotte.

[wbarmy]

Which is excellent. But in India I never saw any evidence they brought that to their ministries. And Mother Theresa herself had some strange theological beliefs.

Ministries which minister and provide the Gospel are excellent. Just like the old AA used to do, and the old Salvation Army soup kitchens.

[georgia peach]

Your question baffles me.You are assuming that God does not work in hearts by Himself; that people have to be preached to to “get” Him.The cross on her chest and the love in her eyes spoke to them.

How do you know what was said to these starving people? What a negative thing to say.I’ll assume back at you..you are anti-Catholic.

[georgia peach]

Jesus is not magnified by her always visible cross?

[wbarmy]

Jesus talked to everybody, He didn’t just stand there looking majestic. The Apostles talked to everybody they didn’t just stand around waiting for someone to notice their changed demeanor.

We are “commanded” to go into the whole world and preach the gospel. Preaching requires using the voice.

Lifestyle evangelism is code-word for “too scared to tell someone about Jesus”.

And there are millions of crosses on millions of steeples and millions of doors. But the only way to get people through those doors is to invite them, verbally.

[Mrs. Don-o]

I think it's possible to have a reasonable discussion of different points of view about proselytism vs. evangelization. Perhaps we can have that discussion.

You'll notice I posited a difference between "proselytism" and "evangelization," a difference which for the most part did not emerge until the late 20th century when laws in some countries started to proscribe the former, but not the latter, as a form of fraud or abuse.

(If anyone wants to jump in and say, "Hogwash, proselytism IS evangelization, check my dictionary here," please don't. I'm trying to differentiate between words in order to differentiate between our practical and moral evaluation of two distinguishable things. These are distinctions which did not emerge, on the legal level anyhow, until recent decades. There's some useful definition offered here, in an article which makes a distinction between "licit" and "illicit" proselytism; what they're calling "licit" proselytism, most of us would just call "evangelization.")

Long story short, there is an emerging concern that some missionaries, either explicitly or implicitly, make aid contingent upon a positive response to religious creedal statements. of the choice is --- to put it rarher brusquely --- "Say Amen and get badly needed aid, or object and get passed by," this is coercion and is objectionable on both moral and, increasingly, legal terms.

[wbarmy]

You can make that discussion, but I will ask you that question. Suppose, you are in a situation where you desperately need medical aid to help a child. Will you tell the hospital, Muslim operated and owned, that you are now a Muslim to get free medical care?

If somebody wants aid so badly they will fabricate a religious decision to get it, then more power to them. But if a NGO wishes to only give aid to those who accept their creedal position, that is THEIR RIGHT. It is their money and they can choose who to bestow it on.

[georgia peach]

and you know that she didn’t .This conversation amazes me in it’s condemnation of one who gave her whole life to the poor...for love of God.

[Mrs. Don-o]

OK. And if the government wishes to regulate NGO's to prevent abusive proselytization, that is their right.

In the hypothetical case you made of the Muslim hospital which would, even in a life or death situation, help only those who made a Muslim profession of faith, it is the hospital which would be guilty of illegal proselytization, and should lose their license to operate.

I think that is a legitimate use of law.

It is illegal, I believe, in the USA, or at least in most states, for hospital ER's to turn away people in life-or-death situations based on color, creed, nationality, or even ability to pay.

[wbarmy]

I will let her words speak for herself;

While she worked with the poor, Mother Teresa was adamant that any type of evangelism was unnecessary. In her book, Life in the Spirit: Reflections, Meditations and Prayers, she says: "We never try to convert those who receive [aid from Missionaries of Charity] to Christianity but in our work we bear witness to the love of God's presence and if Catholics, Protestants, Buddhists, or agnostics become for this better men - simply better - we will be satisfied. It matters to the individual what church he belongs to. If that individual thinks and believes that this is the only way to God for her or him, this is the way God comes into their life - his life. If he does not know any other way and if he has no doubt so that he does not need to search then this is his way to salvation." (Pages 81-82)