FEDERAL AGENTS DEMAND CUSTOMER LISTS FROM MORMON FOOD STORAGE FACILITY

Liberty News Online ^ | 12/9/11 | OathKeepers.org

[Kartographer]

Oath Keepers has learned that federal agents recently visited a Later Day Saints (Mormon) Church food storage cannery in Tennessee, demanding customer lists, wanting to know the identity of Americans who are purchasing food storage from the Mormons.

This incident was confirmed, in person, by Oath Keepers Tennessee Chapter President, Rand Cardwell. Here is Rand’s report:

“A fellow veteran contacted me concerning a new and disturbing development. He had been utilizing a Mormon cannery near his home to purchase bulk food supplies. The man that manages the facility related to him that federal agents had visited the facility and demanded a list of individuals that had been purchasing bulk food. The manager informed the agents that the facility kept no such records and that all transactions were conducted on a cash-and-carry basis. The agents pressed for any record of personal checks, credit card transactions, etc., but the manager could provide no such record. The agents appeared to become very agitated and after several minutes of questioning finally left with no information. I contacted the manager and personally confirmed this information.

[Notwithstanding]

No, no actually. You pulled one sentence out of context. IN fact, those who sell in bulk have to keep track of the bulk buyers for IRS reasons (and in some states for sales tax reasons).

So you are wrong.

[Notwithstanding]

The IRS requires businesses to submit that information all the time.

[standing man]

As a non Mormon I was able to see that the focus of the article was the information that was being asked, not who it was being asked of. Perhaps it doesn't concern you that the dept of homeland security defines someone who stores food as a potential terrorist, but that is the salient point here not your Mormon bias.

[Notwithstanding]

When the IRS determines there has been a violation, they seek records to audit what really happened.

I suggested that this situation could be related to such an IRS violation, in which case it is very normal for the government to seek details about all transactions.

I don’t like the IRS rules at all, but under the law as it stands we are all subject to IRS investigation.

[The Toll]

Makes perfect sense to me that this would happen. Homeland Security’s only terrorist concerns are now all focused on the “domestic” nature thanks to the new administration.

There really isn’t any domestic terrorists so this enormous agencies’ assets have to do SOMETHING with their time. Doing things like this, or making up terrorists charges against old white men in North Georgia over castor beans seems to be the new plan.

This is simply about the administration using Bush’s Homeland Security creation to crack down on white folks. Obama gets off on it!

[SoJoCo]

Doesn’t that legislation just passed by the Senate which allows for holding terror suspects without trial identify the stockpiling food as one indicator of a possible terrorist?

[Triple]

“These Executive Orders don’t define what specifically constitutes a national emergency” -PT

I am under the strong impression, backed by research from a few years ago, that the USA has been officially under a declared state of national emergency since about 1933.

This declaration is usually made by the president through executive orders, but there have been a few variations over the years. For a while the state of emergency had to be renewed on at least an annual basis (Clinotn and Bush years) - and it was done so through executive order like clockwork.

[Triple]

“These Executive Orders don’t define what specifically constitutes a national emergency” -PT

I am under the strong impression, backed by research from a few years ago, that the USA has been officially under a declared state of national emergency since about 1933.

This declaration is usually made by the president through executive orders, but there have been a few variations over the years. For a while the state of emergency had to be renewed on at least an annual basis (Clinton and Bush years) - and it was done so through executive order like clockwork.

[tacticalogic]

Except that Costco and Sam's do require you to inform the cashier if you are purchasing it for resale purposes and you are required to provide the valid state tax information with your membership application. If they had no responsibility whatsoever, then they wouldn't be required to collect that information with your membership and they wouldn't require you to inform the cashier.

I believe the only thing that happens if you don't inform the cashier is that you get charged sales tax. If you're buying it for resale, then you're responsible for collecting the sales tax on the final sale, not Costco. You don't have to tell them it's for resale, but if you don't it's going to cost you the sales tax when you buy it.

[tacticalogic]

The IRS requires businesses to submit that information all the time.

Really? I'd like to know how the businesses are managing to comply with that requirement. I buy things for cash all the time, and they don't ask me for my name, so how are the going to report it?

[OB1kNOb]

I dont' have time now, but plan to read the info on the following link to see if it substantiates the government's ability to regulate via Executive Order our ability to store/hoard food and goods. If anyone else that can shed any knowledge of this matter, please share your info.

What Do Executive Orders Say About Storing?

From my initial quick scan of the link above, it appears to revolve around Executive Order 10998--Federal seizure of all food supplies and resources, public and private and all farms and equipment

Here is what the analysis at the link concludes:

Bottom line, even though federal legislation does not directly address anti-hoarding, goods can be seized if national circumstances are felt to warrant it whether or not amounts stored are deemed excessive in your state's eyes.

[PapaBear3625]

IN fact, those who sell in bulk have to keep track of the bulk buyers for IRS reasons (and in some states for sales tax reasons).

There are circumstances where bulk purchases by a business has IRS ramifications in how they maintain inventory, and "bulk sale" of the assets of a business to another business also has aspects requiring a Form 8594, in the context of a private individual buying large amounts of stuff for personal use, I have not seen any requirement to maintain records of larger-than-usual purchases of food and such.

If you can point to an actual IRS regulation, I'd be interested in seeing it.

Also, when proclaiming somebody wrong, it is generally polite to accompany the proclamation with at least a link to the contrary evidence. It leads to fewer pointless arguments. So please back up your position with at least one reference supporting it.

[tacticalogic]

I'm one of those bigoted douches who puts some of the Mormon beliefs up there with the Scientologists and Muslims. And the Mormons brought a lot of the persecution upon themselves. A lot of folks were not too fond of some of the stunts they pulled in the 1800s.

Well, like it or not, you're probably sharing a pigeon hole with them as far as the Obama administration is concerned. It's labeled "bitter clingers".

[af_vet_rr]

As a non Mormon I was able to see that the focus of the article was the information that was being asked, not who it was being asked of. Perhaps it doesn't concern you that the dept of homeland security defines someone who stores food as a potential terrorist, but that is the salient point here not your Mormon bias.

That's just it - you don't know who questioned this canning company, you don't know what questions were asked other than a list of customers, and you don't even know what the name of the company is so that you can verify if it even exists. Right now this is like something you'd see on Alex Jones website, complete with details that can't quite be verified and probably have some kind of hazy connection to some FEMA-related executive order that George W. Bush signed in the wake of 9/11 or Hurricane Katrina.

We're not an agricultural/rural society anymore - there's around half a million or so family farms left, the rest are corporate. If there is some Orwellian plot to control the food, they will do so at the distribution centers. They can also make things even more difficult for small/family farms and probably cut the number of such farms in half within a few years if they wanted to, leaving our agricultural industry in the hands of a few large companies that push their products through those easily controlled distribution centers I mentioned.

This isn't the 1930s where Stalin wanted to commit geneocide against a specific group of people and had to deal with millions and millions of peasants on farms that could feed and sustain themselves without the use of electricity, fuel, etc., for years to come. If the government wants to control the food supplies, they can do so easily at the distribution centers. We're in a society where people get in trouble if they lose power for a week or get snowed in and can't get to Safeway or McDonald's.

[af_vet_rr]

And to be honest, there are two things that are incredibly troublesome that nobody seems to care about, and these things are not only easily verified, unlike this story, they are in our face. Just so happens that one involves Tennessee.

One is the TSA getting involved at weigh stations and bus stations:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2799740/posts

The other is Congress wanting to allow the military to put American citizens arrested within the United States under military control:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2814517/posts

[driftdiver]

Those are State taxes and issues, not federal.