Pardon Graner

Pardon Graner

Now that the media has inundated the world with all the sordid images and details of the "Abu Ghraib Prison Abuse Scandal", and now that Spc. Charles Graner has been found guilty of these so-called "abuses", we should all feel better, right? After all, America has done all she can to prove to the Arab street just how sensitive and caring she is, right? Pardon my French, but this is a bunch of BS! I don't know what kind of goods we're being sold, but I ain't buying and neither should you. War is hell and bad things happen in war. Just ask Army Spc. Matt Maupin.

Matt Maupin, of Batavia, Ohio, is still missing in Iraq. The last time this American soldier was seen he was kneeling in front of a group terrorists on the same kind of sick and sadistic videotape we've seen broadcast on the Arab propaganda network Al-Jazeera. In uniform, supposedly under the protection of the Geneva Convention, in the hands of the very same monsters Spc. Charles Graner and his crew at Abu Ghraib prison have been condemned for being mean and insensitive to. So where is the international outcry over the whereabouts of Spc. Matt Maupin? Where is the condemnation by the United Nations of these non-uniformed terrorists who buried Army Sgt. Elmer Krause and four civilian contractors in a shallow grave after attacking their convoy?

What this author finds so outrageous and disturbing is that so many in the world, Americans included, appear to be more concerned with the rights of non-uniformed terrorists and public relations than actually defeating this evil enemy and bringing THEM to justice. While American casualties are more in line with the War with Mexico, the very fact that we appear to be fighting a "politically correct" war grants some validity to leftist claims that Iraq is another Vietnam. The fact that Army Spc. Graner is going to jail for the mistreatment and abuse of some terrorists, including a non-uniformed Syrian who by his own admission was in Iraq to kill Americans, confirms this. Vietnam should have taught us that we cannot win a "PC" war. Stringing up a few of these guys caught in the act to the nearest light pole is what should be done.

The Geneva Convention was designed to ensure civil treatment of POWs and civilians during a time of war. In other words, while war is a very bad thing, nations do go to war for various reasons. The civilized world felt it necessary to lay out some ground rules for all to follow. However, the Geneva Convention specifically prohibits the taking of hostages and furthermore, does not apply to those that fail to "conduct their operations within the laws and customs of war". In other words, these hostage-taking headcutters, including the non-uniformed Syrian, are not protected by the Geneva Convention. Sadly, this simple fact does not come into play as it is much more fashionable to portray the United States as the bad guy in this current conflict.

While our nation has allowed itself to be distracted by the tsunami disaster in Asia, we will be faced with a similar disaster in Iraq if we allow that country to fall into the hands of the terrorists and Saddam Hussein. Abandoning the people of Iraq, as the naive anti-American leftists here in America would have us do, would be tantamount to unleashing a tsunami on those in Iraq desirous of freedom. We cannot allow political correctness to dictate how we fight the War on Terror. We certainly didn't when we defeated Germany and Japan in World War II. It is up to patriots across this great country to maintain a vigilant state to ensure that this mistreatment of our own soldiers does not happen again. I invite all of you to contact President Bush, your elected officials, and the Army Court of Appeals, urging them to do the right thing and pardon Spc. Charles Graner. Maybe he was a bit overzealous in his treatment of the prisoners at Abu Ghraib, but at least they still have their heads.

wow, the folks at DU agree with you...amazing how liberals are so quick to throw our troops under the bus.

I spent eight years in the Marine Corps; I left the Corps as a Sergeant. Yeah, I generally want to throw the s**tbirds under the bus. I have no use for insubordinate trash like Graner. I am astonished that a so-called "conservative" thinks that "good order and discipline" are "nice to have" things in the military.

BTW, almost all the folks I pinged to this post are presently on active duty, or have served--and they all disagree with you.

When those who actually have served or are presently serving tell you you're wrong on this issue, it would be a very good idea to rethink your premises, noob.

Kinda reminds me of their stance against this war...he'd still be filling mass graves.

Wrong. My only complaint with the Iraq war was that we took far too long to go about actually doing it--it is something that we should've done many years earlier.

One can simultaneously (a) support this war and (b) expect our soldiers to conduct themselves as soldiers, not as brigands. Indeed, if you wish to win wars, a disciplined army is essential. I cannot fathom why some wish to reward (and thus encourage) severe breaches of discipline within the military, unless they intend to ensure that we lose wars.

I wonder how much key info Graner and Co. pulled out of these terrorists?

None. The prisoners under the charge of Graner and his buddies, skank hos, and subordinates weren't terrorists; they were petty criminals. You would already know that fact if you'd read the Taguba Report--which again raises the question of when "willfully stupid ignorance" became "a legitimate point of view."

How many American lives were saved?

Zero. How much damage was done to the good order and discipline of the US Army? Lots.

Vet

Sorry you choose to be personal.

If you read your post 38, it is a reflection of your original post, talking about something you have zero knowledge of.

Sitting in your easy chair and directing a war thousands of miles away indeed must be stressful. My view is that if you are not there and had nothing to do with the affair, dont second guess those that are there. Very easy to condemn others as you and others have done. Having served in the military means nothing when you rant on and on with no facts to substantiate your diatribe.

Service? Most likely before you were born so that childish characterization will not wash either. Turn your venom towards the enemy, not towards someone that is there while you sit at home.

"I wonder how much key info Graner and Co. pulled out of these terrorists? How many American lives were saved?"

After having sat through over 50+ hours of testimony, marked and read hundreds of exhibits, and examined hundreds of pages of more documents that were not given to the court that were produced during the investigations, there is NO credible evidence that this posse was given any instructions to do anything of the kind. Unless you believe that the colonels and the generals were coming to visit this young corporal personally to tell him to beat up these prisoners, all of the middle-echelon leaders .. the Staff Sergeant and the Sergeants .. who have already pled guilty and been sentenced stated that no such instructions came from anyone in the chain of command. The only ones that Graner could point to specifically who told him that it would be helpful for him and his gang to "soften them up" came from low-ranking .. E-4 and below .. personnel who had NO standing in his chain of command.

Secondly, not one of the detainees who were abused .. against, it should be noted, a written SOP/rules of engagement specifically laying out what could and could not be done to detainees .. were there for intelligence purposes. Every one had been picked up and was being incarcerated for "common crimes": theft, assault, attempted rape (Iraqi-on-Iraqi), and .. in the case of one female who was forced to strip so this "fine upstanding young soldier" and his buddies could get some nude photos .. prostitution. So, for no more purpose than their own enjoyment, they successfully disobeyed standing orders against maltreatment for no reason at all. Testimony came out that specifically stated that Graner was, in general, someone who didn't obey orders or regulations: he had been repeatedly called to the carpet for uniform violations, wearing unauthorized patches on his uniform, haircut violations, and disrespect to senior NCOs and officers. Simply put, he did what he wanted to do when he wanted to do it, and d@mn the leadership.

Third, he repeated violated the posted directives in the confinement area that no cameras were permitted in the cell areas, in the hard site, or within Abu Ghraib prison. He also violated procedures by allowing his girlfriend, Lynndie England .. a person who had no standing as either an MP or an MI .. to enter the secured areas for no more reason than to have their pictures taken together.

Fourth, the pictures quite clearly show someone who was enjoying his work. Despite his right to not testify, when the trial began, his attorney stated that he was so confident of his legal standing that Graner wanted to testify to tell his side of the story. Needless to say, he did not do so .. at least, until the sentencing portion of the case when he made an UNSWORN statement, which is not evidence, merely a "here's who I am, don't punish me for what I did" kind of statement.

Finally, discipline is the cast-iron rod that holds units together. This was an undisciplined vigilante posse who decided that, because they could do these things, they would. (Sounds familiar, doesn't it? Isn't that what Clinton said for his excuse?) From almost Day 1 in the military, you're trained to obey orders, but you're also told that YOU .. personally and individually .. only have to obey legal orders. Probably the only thing that Graner truthfully said in the proceedings was that he knew that these were illegal and, in his words, immoral orders. Yet he said that he obeyed them nonetheless. As a Corporal, a non-commissioned officer in the military, that, in and of itself, is enough to demand some serious jail time. The old "I was only obeying orders" died at Nuremberg.

When push comes to shove, if you were arrested for assault or theft, and not yet prosecuted or sentenced, would YOU or your children want to be incarcerated in this man's jail?

He's a uniformed bully .. one of the few times that I've actually seen one of those archetypical "jackbooted thugs" that a lot of people on FreeRepublic are always so worried about. Yet it is those same people who seem to be defending this scum and his unrestrained posse.

Samauri Court Reporter

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