'Intelligent design' theory threatens science classrooms

Seattle Post Intelligencer ^ | 11/22/2002 | ALAN I. LESHNER

[whattajoke]

"PU... It Stinks!"

Ok, that was weak, but hear me out. PU is most assuredly a diploma mill, a sham, a scam, a joke. There is no faculty! There are no classes! There are no real course outlines! Those of us who went to accredited schools, such as yourself, should be upset when someone else misrepresents himself as a graduate, when indeed, they are not.

The real question is why does Hovind bother? Having the fake moniker attached to his name does him no favors, gives him no greater relevance, nor does it increase his respect in the scientific world. He could drop it entirely and his followers will continue to follow, and his (many, many more) detractors will continue to laugh away is absurdist notions of living plesiosaurs.

My guess is that he is a megalomaniac who craves the attention (even if it's negative) his foolish games garner him. No one with a 6th grade education from any school seriously believes the Loch Ness Monster is a real live dinosaur. It's attention grabbing at it's worst, and certainly is not worthy of my respect.

I worked hard for my bachelors and masters degrees. It irks me that this clown pretends he's done the same. Read his "thesis." It's a joke, no matter how much you wish to believe what he says. The least he could have done is spell properly and, oh... I don't know... finish it perhaps?

But PU got his check, which is all they cared about, and sent him his xeroxed piece of toilet paper in the mail. And now he can speak at his impossible "700 times per year" pace that he claims to maintain.

[goodseedhomeschool]

YOu guys are all nice and I enjoyed posting again. I think I will go take a dip in the pool. It's hot today and my pool is looking so good right now. I'll be back tonight. Have a great evening everyone.

[goodseedhomeschool]

300 times a year. :). He really does. It does not bother me because I just don't think about the labels when he or anyone speaks their mind. I never was interested in science in school, just accounting and business. When I discovered his seminars, I loved them. I took these 4 couses his ministry offers too. I learned more good science, and I am not just talking about the evolution subject, from those courses. He is a great teacher. The courses were very good. It was "distance". It is called CSE 101, 102, 103, 104. Each one has 6 tapes and 8-9 quizzes, you have to read a book and write an 850 word synopsis for each one and take a final exam for each one. The books I read were, "Seven Men who Ruled the World from the grave, The Young Earth, New Age Bible versions, and the hard one was Walt Brown's In the Beginning"
He just has a great style of teaching. I love his style.

[goodseedhomeschool]

Time to go swimming. That pool looks good. Have a blessed day everyone. :)

[js1138]

This in in your opinion that AIG has more integrity. I hear a very different story form my peers. I know exactly how that whole got started and you might be surprised to know ALL THE DETAILS.

I think you are doing what you accuse us of doing -- confusing credentials with substance. Give us a specific example of a false argument from AIG.

[goodseedhomeschool]

Reread my post. There is more to the little tiff between AIG and DR Hovind that meets the eye. That is what I am saying. Follow the money. Gotta scoot. See you later. :)

[BMCDA]

Just found this website and thought I might share it with you.
That's quite some interesting stuff there IMO.

http://www.geocities.com/kenthovind

[whattajoke]

From Hovind's own mouth:

"My 250-page dissertation dealt with the subject of the effects of teaching evolution on the students in our public school system. My 20-year study of the creation evolutionism subject led me to start Creation Science Evangelism in 1991. I now speak over 700 times each year on the subject, have had 40+ debates and have been a guest on over 3500 radio and television talk shows."

See that, 700 times a year! Amazing.

Of course he's a good speaker. so is John Edward. so is Duane Gish. They have to be to peddle the nonsense they do.

[Condorman]

I hear some of you making fun of Dr. Hovind's dissertaion but could some of you link a post to yours for our enjoyment?

Hang on a sec. I don't doubt your sincerity but there is a sharp distinction between "making fun of" and "legitimately critiquing" a dissertation. You appear to believe that criticism of Hovind is due to jealousy or fear or some kind of personal vendetta on our part while rejecting out of hand the possibility that Hovind may not be what he claims.

The link I posted previously (a repeat of one that appeared previously on the thread) demonstrates that the document Hovind claims as his dissertation does not meet the criteria of a PhD-quality thesis.

As I said, I'm sure you are sincere in your admiration and respect for the man. Please just remember to bear in mind the fact that in the pursuit of knowledge, one must always be willing to reevaluate one's conceptions when presented with new information. That is true for people on both sides of the debate.

So find out for yourself whether the cirticisms are valid. Talk to people who have written and defended a thesis. Visit your nearest university and read a couple. Then judge for yourself if Hovind's measures up.

[whattajoke]

Lots of goodies in that link, thanks. This one is a pretty funny (and apparently Hoving believed it) April Fools prank.

[whattajoke]

oops, here's the real link: http://www.nmsr.org/Archive.html

[BMCDA]

LOL! That's a good one!
Bookmarked ;)

[Alamo-Girl]

I just wanted to say thank you for your demeanor on this thread. You have been all alone in your position with a rather large group adverse.

That is always a difficult situation - but you have been kind-hearted and even-tempered throughout. That is a sign of the Spirit, so Praise God!!!

I have no input to the debate since I've not studied either Hovind or AiG. But it is a joy to watch you and I just wanted you to know.

[Junior]

Very nice. I swear, Hovind is doing more to discredit Christians than any number of atheists could ever accomplish. The devil must be dancing with glee every time Hovind's name is mentioned...

[goodseedhomeschool]

Hi Alamo-girl. You really made my day with your kind words. Thank you for the uplifting in my spirit. Praise God, He is always good all the time. :)

[RightWingNilla]

Hovind is doing more to discredit Christians than any number of atheists could ever accomplish.

This is absolutely true. Well said.

[goodseedhomeschool]

Most of the people I have spoken with have said that Dr. Hovind has done more to make stonger their faith since viewing his seminars. I think many folks appreciate him more than this board lets on. He has those who diagree with him, but I don't know How in the world his giving substantial data to back up the Bible would discredit Christians, at least not in their brothers and sisters in Christ's eyes anyway. Christians do not seek man's approval but that of God's, so I am not sure what the post meant. BTW. The swim was very nice, it felt so good to dive in. Did I ever tell you about Dr. Hovind's favorite dinosaur? He calls it "blondasaurus", lol. He has this plastic dino with a barbie doll wig on it. The kids get a hoot out of it.

[CyberCowboy777]

Data collection for a hypothesis is done within the scientific method; as a process of the scientific method.

You do not collect data using the scientific method. You collect data for the scientific method, testing a hypothesis.

This all seems very simple to me. I must be missing somthing, a block of some sort.

[js1138]

I have also complimented goodseed on demeanor, but there is more to a debate than politeness. Bill Clinton was polite, most of the time. The argument is over how Hovind could have a Ph.D. from an institution that doesn't offer one, and whether the things Hovind says make sense. I haven't seen any evidence for either proposition.

We have, however, been threatened with exposure of the lurid past of the people sponsoring AIG. Isn't this the same argument?

[goodseedhomeschool]

There is a neat picture of my son Cody and Dr. Hovind on my front page with a dino pal here:
http://home.bellsouth.net/personalpages/PWP-goodseedhomeschoolgroup