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Fetus' Feet Show Fish, Reptile Vestiges
Discovery News ^ | May 18, 2006 | Jennifer Viegas

Posted on 05/20/2006 6:02:56 PM PDT by Al Simmons

Fetus' Feet Show Fish, Reptile Vestiges By Jennifer Viegas, Discovery News

May 18, 2006 — The feet of human embryos taking shape in the womb reveal links to prehistoric fish and reptiles, a new study finds.

Human feet may not look reptilian once babies emerge from the womb, but during development the appendages appear similar to prehistoric fish and reptiles. The finding supports the theory that mammalian feet evolved from ancient mammal-like reptiles that, in turn, evolved from fish.

It also suggests that evolution -- whether that of a species over time or the developmental course of a single organism -- follows distinct patterns.

In this case, the evolution of mammalian feet from fish fins to four-legged reptiles to four-limbed mammals to human feet appears to roughly mirror what happens to a maturing human embryo.

"Undoubtedly there are clear parallels between the mammal-like reptilian foot and the human foot," said Albert Isidro, an anthropologist at the Autonomous University of Barcelona, Spain and lead author of the study, which appeared in the journal The Foot.

Isidro and colleague Teresa Vazquez made the determination after analyzing fossils of a number of mammal-like reptiles that lived from 75 to 360 million years ago. The scientists also studied fossils of osteolepiform fish, which appear to be half fish and half reptilian. These fish lived 400 million years ago and had lungs, nostrils and four fins located where limbs would later be found in four-footed reptiles and mammals.

In 33-day-old human embryos, the scientists observed "the outline of a lower extremity in the form of a fin, similar to that seen in osteolepiform fishes." As the embryo continued to develop, the researchers focused their attention on two foot bones: the calcaneous, or heel bone, and the talus, which sits between the heel and the lower leg.

At 54 days of gestation, these two bones sit next to each other as they did within the reptile herbivore Bauria cynops, which lived around 260 million years ago. This ancient reptile had flat, crushing teeth and mammalian features.

At eight and a half weeks of gestation, the researchers found the two embryonic foot bones resemble those seen in the Diademodon vegetarian dinosaur, which lived around 230 million years ago.

"We can tell that the embryo is half way between the reptiles and the mammals (at this stage)," Isidro told Discovery News.

The two foot bones continue to develop until, at nine weeks, they resemble that of placental mammals as they emerged 80 million years ago.

This development of feet in the human embryo mirrors how the foot evolved over millions of years beginning with fish and ending with early mammals, according to the scientists.

Supporting the fish/foot link was the discovery last month of a new species, Tiktaalik roseae, which lived 375 million years ago. It had fish fins and scales, but also limb parts found in four-legged animals.

"Tiktaalik blurs the boundary between fish and land-living animals both in terms of its anatomy and its way of life," said Neil Shubin, professor and chairman of organismal biology at the University of Chicago and co-author of a related paper in the journal Nature.

H. Richard Lane, director of sedimentary geology and paleobiology at the National Science Foundation, said, "These exciting discoveries are providing fossil ‘Rosetta Stones’ for a deeper understanding of this evolutionary milestone: fish to land-roaming tetrapods (four limbed animals)."

--


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: creationism; crevolist; dinosaurs; evolution; guesstheresnogod; homology; istillthinkgoddoodit; pavlovian; prenataldevelopment; werejustanimalsohno
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I thought this was a fascinating piece of news. Have at it, folks!
1 posted on 05/20/2006 6:02:57 PM PDT by Al Simmons
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To: Al Simmons

Developmental Biology 101.


2 posted on 05/20/2006 6:04:38 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (No program, no ideas, no clue: The democrats!)
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To: Al Simmons

Utter nonsense.


3 posted on 05/20/2006 6:05:10 PM PDT by tallhappy (Juntos Podemos!)
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To: Al Simmons

you can call them reptiles, just don't dare call a fetus a baby.


4 posted on 05/20/2006 6:05:21 PM PDT by Third Order
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To: Al Simmons

Holy crap, this thread has all the elements, doesn't it?


5 posted on 05/20/2006 6:05:58 PM PDT by Caveman Lawyer (Cluckin' defiance)
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To: FormerACLUmember
Actually, superstitious pseudo mysticism incorporated in to Biology a century ago that still hangs on.
6 posted on 05/20/2006 6:06:12 PM PDT by tallhappy (Juntos Podemos!)
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To: Al Simmons

Study finds??? I've known this since I was a kid, and I'm older than I want to admit. We really are getting dumbed down, aren't we?


7 posted on 05/20/2006 6:06:28 PM PDT by Williams
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To: Al Simmons; PatrickHenry

8 posted on 05/20/2006 6:09:25 PM PDT by Paleo Conservative
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To: Al Simmons
My wife claims I still have the feet and skin of a lizard.

And I DO tend to shed in the Spring.

prisoner6

9 posted on 05/20/2006 6:09:31 PM PDT by prisoner6 (Right Wing Nuts hold the country together as the loose screws of the Left fall out.)
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To: tallhappy
The fetus visibly passes through these stages, just as the brain develops from a reptilian base to mammalian. I've seen pictures of this 40 and more years ago.

The part of the article that is idiotic, and I guess the basis of the "new study," is the attempt to compare fetal development to specific prehistoric fossils. There is no need and no ability to make such a specific comparison.

10 posted on 05/20/2006 6:11:17 PM PDT by Williams
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To: FormerACLUmember

Exactly, I remember leaning something similar to this back in high school biology in the early 90's. We compared images of developing embryos during different developmental stages and how similar a human embryo was in appearance to a pig or fish embryo at different times.


11 posted on 05/20/2006 6:11:52 PM PDT by hootiebird
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To: Al Simmons; Aetius; Alamo-Girl; AndrewC; Asphalt; Aussie Dasher; Baraonda; BereanBrain; ...

This nonsense was exposed for the lie it is a long time ago. Recycled dog feces.


12 posted on 05/20/2006 6:11:53 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Atheist and Fool are synonyms; Evolution is where fools hide from the sunrise)
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To: Al Simmons
Okay, I'm not even a big evolution guy, but this seems like stupid science to me. And here's why: If at two weeks/months/trimesters gestation human foot bones seem a certain way, and somehow relate to some ancient bird or lizard, who cares?

What did the ancient bird or lizard feet look like at two weeks/months/trimesters? And how, in any way, does that prove anything? If a preborn human somehow resembles a fossil of an adult, fully formed bird or reptile then whoopdeedoo and isn't that neat. But it surely means nothing. Or am I not being scientific here?
13 posted on 05/20/2006 6:11:56 PM PDT by tongue-tied
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To: Al Simmons
It's really not news.

In any case, if the bio-system was simply assembled in a factory (somewhere) using appropriate technology, you might well find the exact same process exhibited as a mammal's feet were grown.

It's the height of hubris to look at something like this and conclude that there are magical/mystical/butotherwise unmeasurable forces at work, lurking in the background, deciding that feet should/must develop in this manner.

The simplest solution is the design engineers at the "mammal feet" factory came up with this one because it was more economical, easier, superior to other methods, or they didn't wrap up the job as well as they thought they did.

14 posted on 05/20/2006 6:12:33 PM PDT by muawiyah (-)
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To: VadeRetro; Junior; longshadow; RadioAstronomer; Doctor Stochastic; js1138; Shryke; RightWhale; ...
Evolution Ping

The List-O-Links
A conservative, pro-evolution science list, now with over 370 names.
See the list's explanation, then FReepmail to be added or dropped.
To assist beginners: But it's "just a theory", Evo-Troll's Toolkit,
and How to argue against a scientific theory.

15 posted on 05/20/2006 6:13:01 PM PDT by PatrickHenry (Unresponsive to trolls, lunatics, fanatics, retards, scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: PatrickHenry

Ping.


16 posted on 05/20/2006 6:14:01 PM PDT by Junior (Identical fecal matter, alternate diurnal period)
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To: Al Simmons

LOL! I was taught this crap in junior high--"it looks like a gill, therefore we were fish."


17 posted on 05/20/2006 6:15:17 PM PDT by Mamzelle
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To: Al Simmons

There were famous illustrations in all the school biology textbooks for many years, showing this kind of fetal development. Most of us probably used one of those textbooks when we were children. They have long been proven to be complete lies.

I would imagine this is yet another example of wishful thinking by some hapless Darwinist.


18 posted on 05/20/2006 6:15:55 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Al Simmons
....and after 63 days they look like a pair of fluffy bunny ears, and only 5 days later resemble band instruments, indicating that we have evolved from softness and niceness and had happy thoughts of music and sugarplums dancing in our heads
19 posted on 05/20/2006 6:16:11 PM PDT by 4woodenboats (The GOP was created by those opposed to Southern Democrat Plantation Slavery...)
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To: Al Simmons

Red Meat...you are evil.


20 posted on 05/20/2006 6:16:22 PM PDT by Mikey_1962 (If you build it, they won't come...)
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