Van Dam Jury Update, Monday August 12th: Westerfield's Fate Lies In Mudd Instructions?

Court TV ^ | August 12, 2002 | Court TV

[FresnoDA]

Jury's time Jurors will resume deliberations Monday in the capital case of David Westerfield, who is accused of killing 7-year-old Danielle van Dam

DAY TWO: FRIDAY, AUG. 9, 2002
12 noon ET	Jury enters jury room.
2:30 p.m. ET	Jury goes home for the weekend.

DAY ONE: THURSDAY, AUG. 8, 2002
1:10 p.m. ET	Jury begins deliberating. After two months of testimony, the capital murder trial of David Westerfield is in the hands of the jurors, who began their deliberations following more than two days of closing arguments.
2:50 p.m.	Jury sends a note to the judge.
3:00 p.m.	Jury at lunch.
4:30 p.m.	Judge calls the lawyers but not the public or the press into the courtroom.
5:15 p.m.	Judge says jurors sent note asking to deliberate five days a week instead of having Friday off and he approved their request.
7:00 p.m.	Jury goes home for the day. Will return Friday morning.

[the Deejay]

Plus, I think his mother embellished a lot of
what she told RR.

Not only have there been a whole lotta "hunches"
goin' on in this case, but a huge amount of
"embellishing" as well.

[pinz-n-needlez]

Hee hee. Heaven knows what these threads are going to look like in a few more days of deliberations.

It's beginning to sound like those deep, all night gab sessions in the dorm.

Well, maybe not really so deep, but it seemed that way at the time. :-)

[UCANSEE2]

Why would Detective Gerbac ask Denise if Damon was a spy?

Want my best guess? Damon must have either refused to answer questions concerning his whereabouts that night, or some other activity, or his trip to Italy, or something, and told police he couldn't tell them because he was a SPY and it was top secret. I know it sounds stupid, but ,hey, look at what we are dealing with.

[Yeti]

The hunch factor has not escaped my attention.

Like maybe they had a hunch that if they planted some blood on a jacket that was checked into the cleaner before she was abducted they might get a conviction.

Like I have a hunch maybe this investigation has not been on the up and up.

[rolling_stone]

As best I can gather, Criminalist Karen Lealcala lifted the 2 prints from the cabinet on 2/8/02. She had also been in the MH on 2/6.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/danielle/transcripts/20020312-9999-morningprelim.html

According to Lealcala Ott & keyser had been in the MH.(PrelimH)
What piece(s) of evidence did they give Criminalist Lealcala??

17 BY MR. FELDMAN:

18 Q DID YOU RECEIVE ANY PIECES OF EVIDENCE FROM

19 INSIDE THE MOTORHOME FROM DETECTIVES OTT OR KEYSER?

20 THE COURT: OVERRULED.

21 THE WITNESS: YES.

22 BY MR. FELDMAN:

23 Q AND DID EITHER -- WERE DETECTIVES OTT OR

24 KEYSER INSIDE THE MOTORHOME BEFORE YOU WERE ACTUALLY

25 INSIDE THE MOTORHOME, IF YOU KNOW?

26 MR. CLARKE: SAME OBJECTION.

27 THE COURT: OVERRULED.

28 THE WITNESS: I DON'T THINK THEY WERE IN THERE
Page 344

1 BEFORE I WAS.

2 BY MR. FELDMAN:

3 Q ARE YOU GUESSING?

4 A I'M NOT SURE IF THEY WERE OR NOT.

5 Q OKAY.

6 THE COURT: COUNSEL, I LET YOU GO A LITTLE BIT.

7 SHE TESTIFIED ABOUT THE FINGERPRINTS, SHE TESTIFIED

8 ABOUT THE ITEMS RETRIEVED FROM THE CLEANERS. THAT'S

9 ALL SHE TESTIFIED TO. THAT'S WHERE WE'RE GOING TO

10 KEEP IT.

11 MR. FELDMAN: YES, YOUR HONOR.


She also received the jacket that came from the cleaners from Det. Torgeson. She was trained in crime scene photography (35mm). No mention made of any pictures taken until jacket was turned over to Asst. Criminalist Soriano who took only Polaroids on one of the most important pieces of evidence. Soriano claims he was only trained in taking Polaroids, specialty was biological evidence, but did take other courses and had degree IIRC.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/danielle/transcripts/20020312-9999-afternoonprelim.html

(my note, Sorian stressed his training more at PH than at trial, later promoted to Criminalist)

Carpet stain was also not photographed,prior to testing, was it photographed afterwards? Which would show blood spatter? Testimony 6/20 of Annette Peer. DNA for comparison was taken from Danielle's rib after recovery of body.

CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. FELDMAN:

Q GOOD AFTERNOON, MA'AM.

A GOOD AFTERNOON.

Q CAN YOU TELL ME SPECIFICALLY DIRECTING YOUR ATTENTION TO THE BLOODSTAIN WHICH I BELIEVE IS 84 IN THE MOTOR HOME, DID YOU TAKE A PICTURE OF THAT?

A WELL, I ATTEMPTED TO TAKE A PICTURE OF IT WHEN I BROUGHT THE SAMPLE INTO THE LABORATORY.

Q BEFORE YOU TOOK IT INTO THE LABORATORY IN ITS ORIGINAL CONDITION AS YOU ORIGINALLY IDENTIFIED, DID YOU TAKE A PICTURE OF IT?

A I DID NOT TAKE A PHOTO, NO.

Q DO YOU HAVE A PRECISE DESCRIPTION OF THE SIZE OF THAT STAIN?

A NO. I HAVE AN APPROXIMATE DESCRIPTION.

Q I'M SORRY. WHEN YOU SAY APPROXIMATE, WHAT YOU -- WHY IS IT APPROXIMATE AND NOT. . .

A THE REASON WHY IT'S AN APPROXIMATE IS WHEN THE STAIN WAS OBSERVED BY MYSELF AND CRIMINALIST TANYA DULANEY, WE NOTED THAT A STAIN WAS PRESENT. I NOTED THE APPROXIMATE SIZE AND THE APPROXIMATE COLOR. AND THEN I CHEMICALLY TESTED IT. DURING THE COURSE OF IT BEING CHEMICALLY TESTED, THE FIBERS OF THE CARPET WERE SOMEWHAT DISTURBED, SO AN EXACT MEASUREMENT COULD NOT BE TAKEN OF IT AFTER I HAD CHEMICALLY TESTED IT.

Q SO BEFORE THE CHEMICAL TEST WAS DONE, THERE WAS NO EFFORT MADE TO PHOTOGRAPH IT WITH A, FOR INSTANCE, A MILLIMETER RULER OR AN INCH RULER?

A NO, THERE WAS NOT.

Q SO YOU CAN'T TELL US THE PRECISE SIZE OF THE STAIN. WHAT'S YOUR ESTIMATE?

A MY ESTIMATE IS APPROXIMATELY ONE-QUARTER-INCH IN DIAMETER.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/danielle/transcripts/020624_pm1.

[Rheo]

Someone else said something about the Investigator finding the print in the MH after he had the rehydrated skin of Danielle to compare to? (or use to make the print?). Is this possible?

Then Peer or Lacaclia is lying about getting that latent on 2/8.....Jeff did the finger peeling and rehydration but he did not go to the MH until 4/17..(thanks shezza)

[UCANSEE2]

I only am "guessing" about her being in Mexico..or Brazil or Finland :~)

Or in the nearest HOPE CENTER (alcohol/drug recovery/rehabilitation)

BTW, I think the boys told the LE if Danielle was there that evening...at least till they all went to bed...IMO.

Until I read it, I don't agree. We all ASSUME the LE's asked if Danielle was there. What if they just assumed it because Damon/Brenda/Barb/Denise said so?

What if Damon told them to say YES, or else?

[sawsalimb]

So, if Westerfield wiped the windshield, a window, an outside mirror, or ANY PART of the OUTSIDE of the MH with a rag, then rinsed it out in the sink, he could have deposited 1 hair there from Danielle without her EVER HAVING BEEN IN, but HAVING BEEN NEAR (which he thought she was once) the MH!

Or,postulating that the speculation about Brenda VanDam and Westerfield carrying on is true(and FWIW,I wouldn't be terribly surprised if that was the case),a motor home wouldn't be a bad place for an assignation. It's mobile,after all,it's self contained,and there wouldn't be any of those pesky motel receipts that might come back to haunt you a few years down the pike.

[the Deejay]

"and told police he couldn't tell them because he was a SPY and it was top secret."

Oh no, that wouldn't have been a lie to police, would it? LE should have nailed and jailed his sorry butt on the spot for that one.

[Rheo]

Great compilation rolling_stone!

why in the world could they have not taken pics before destroying the stains??

I still want to know when Ott was in the dry cleaners...was it when DW's stuff was in another person's name?

[juzcuz]

You know I heard echo's of that question before maybe from one of the other posters, I'm not sure. But the question is an unusual one. You would think for an investigative detective to ask such a question, he must have heard echo's himself. A spy, meaning CIA? Also, maybe the computer softwear world is full of those type of people that LE are familiar with. The trip to Italy might have influenced his question too.

My question is --When Det. Thomsovic was at the VD house (at 3:00AM Sun.)with LE/FBI child abuse expert, Ernie Hebert, who's trained to look for blood evidence in the environment why wasn't the blood on Danielle's PJ cuff's shown to him/them? The forensic folks were at the VD's all Saturday-night to the next morning collecting evidence.

[UCANSEE2]

"...she would say what Dumcek wanted her to say and Feldman wasn't sure what she would say! Since she was the first one to spill the beans about the pot smoking/garage activities, how can you be so sure she would say what Dusek wanted?

Maybe neither side could be sure.

[the Deejay]

DW said BVD is "too heavy" and I think he was being
kind. He actually meant, "too fat for me". She's
just not his style. Just seeing Susan L. tells one
what type he prefers, and it's not even close to BVD.

BVD just looks dirty/sloppy/trashy.

[pinz-n-needlez]

yeah, Cyncooper and Rheo clarified that for me, I had the dates wrong.

But it was an unusually strong print, right, Rheo?

[Yeti]

why didn't it trigger her memory when she then found them in the house as opposed to remembering in July??

Necessity is the mother of invention ;)

[Rheo]

That bothers me greatly too juzcuz.

Here is the lead detective and a child abuse expert looking for leads in a missing child case and NO ONE shows them the blood on the stairs, garage floor, pjs??

Barney Fife..ya dropped yer bullet.

[mouser]

this is interesting

in a poll whitch is highly slanted against westfield
1 person in 5 eather says not guilty or hung jury

a hung jury to me says there was reasonable doubt but someone could not get past emotion or porn

however the jury who has seen all of the evidence as presented verses spin ???

[gigi]

Do you listen to Mike Savage? I used to listen to him everyday when I lived in the Bay Area. I miss him. What does he say about this case? If you know.

[Rheo]

But it was an unusually strong print, right, Rheo?

Jeff Graham made mention more than once that after 2 lifts...the print was very strong and could still be seen very clearly.

Now, why did a 2nd lift get taken?

[Rheo]

Necessity is the mother of invention ;)

Good one!:-)