Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.
In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:
Our discussion has been light:
It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog
However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB
Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr
Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog
Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB
Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed
To the very philosophical:
…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla
To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…
…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB
Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog
…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1
Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed
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Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom
…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253
Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed
So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.
Plus, based on the conversation between Faramir, Denethor, and Gandalf in ROTK, Boromir had his marching orders from his father. To get the ring and bring it back to Minas Tirith.
If you want heat, bash the Elves! :D
When I was a kid, then a teenager, I loved reading fantasy/sci-fi, mostly fantasy. I read the Thomas Covenant series back then. After I became a Christian I picked it up again, and nearly threw it across the room ;^). I despise Harry Potter and I love Tolkien.
My daughter asked me one night “Dad, why is Harry Potter bad but LOTR good?” I wasn’t quite prepared for that question. I told her that in the Harry Potter series that magic was glorified, and that good and bad were intermingled. Whereas in LOTR good is good, evil is evil, magic is not glorified, more often than not it corrupts those who attempt to wield it.
She then asked “What about Gandalf? He’s a wizard.” I told her that even though he had the title of “Wizard” in the book he was actually an angelic like being that was sent by the one “God” to help protect Middle-Earth.
Anyway, I don’t know why I went into all that, but there it is.
Do you have any good book suggestions for someone of the [fundamental] Christian persuasion? What do you think of Lawhead?
Thanks.
-ksen
To answer your Tolkien-unrelated but interesting question, it would seem to me that God has a dim view of kings! After all, when the Israelites demanded a king, didn't Samuel warn them of all the bad things that would happen? And since I'm a stickler for semantics, I might add that a democracy is "mob rule", where the whole people decide every issue, and not practical on a large scale. What we practice is a representative republic, not a democracy. Which is why this site is called "Free Republic".
I'll be back for real Tolkien talk after second breakfast.
How about that old guy who was in that Ron Howard movie where all these old people were turned youthful from swimming in a pool that had "alien" pods in them? Wilford Brimley I believe is his name.
-ksen
I see what you mean. After all, Elrond looked like a boy, Legolas looked, mostly, like a boy, but Haldir and his folk all looked like amazon women. ;^)
-ksen
I doubt it. I am setting myself up for disapointment because I hope they sweep, but I predict that FoTR will not get the awards we would like to see it get. There are logical reasons why they should not let FoTR sweep this time. They can't. They have two more years after this one for movies that have all the promise of being just as high in quality as this one. They are not going to let LoTR and a small film company dominate all the major awards for three whole years and they have to worry about precedent.
Prediction: (write this down)
McKellan wins, and maybe three other more minor awards like song or technical awards. Against all hope, I don't think they will get Director or Picture, although a higher chance for director than picture.
In the next two years, we will see Actor or Supporting Actor nominations for both Elijah Wood and Viggo Mortenson.
I bet they award the whole effort most heavily in the third year.
Patrick Stewart seems a bit too serious to play the jolly Tom Bombadil, and I can't picture him (even with the miracles that Hollywood performs) with "thick brown hair...crowned with autumn leaves." Shatner would be much better suited personality-wise for the role, I think, but then I'm a biased hardcore fan of the original Trek series.
-ksen
Have you heard of an actor named Robert Hardy out of England. He played Siegfried Farnon in All Creatures Great and Small series... He would be perfect. Great actor, disappears into the role, has the look of Bombadil.
hehehe - I am not the guru in the group!
Well, perhaps I am blending the film and the book this morning... On a quick skim through... I didn't find it... I found one passage that on its own makes it look like Frodo's presumption:
Frodo rose to his feet. A great weariness was on him, but his will was firm and his heart lighter. He spoke aloud to himself. `I will do now what I must,' he said. 'This at least is plain: the evil of the Ring is already at work even in the Company, and the Ring must leave them before it does more harm. I will go alone. Some I cannot trust, and those I can trust are too dear to me: poor old Sam, and Merry and Pippin. Strider, too: his heart yearns for Minas Tirith, and he will be needed there, now Boromir has fallen into evil. I will go alone. At once.'
Hmm, Jack Nicholson...I can picture him dancing down a path, babbling inSane poetry, but I think 90% of the audience would be expecting him to slit his guests' throats while they sleep or go berserk with an axe in the forest...or at least answer the hobbits' inquiries with a snarling "You can't handle the truth!" Nicholson is an orc if I ever saw one.
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