Gobekli Tepe conspiracy theories: Rupert Soskin pushes back. [23:54]

Transcript
· Introduction
0:00 · hi folks ruper here um actually I'm on
0:03 · holiday and normally I would have
0:04 · ignored this uh for now but I couldn't
0:08 · leave this the other day I was sent a
0:09 · link to a movie called you won't believe
0:12 · this disturbing gcle tee update uh it's
0:15 · on a channel called bright Insight run
0:17 · by a chat called Jimmy corsetti the
0:20 · thing is that there's so much
0:21 · misinformation in this film and the
0:22 · channel has 1.62 million subscribers so
0:26 · potentially including viewers who aren't
0:29 · subscribed
0:30 · this could be going out to millions of
0:32 · people and and there's so much wrong
0:34 · with it I really thought that something
0:35 · should be said
0:37 · soon um now there are many aspects of
0:41 · Jimmy's film that are misleading and I'm
0:42 · Not For a Moment saying that he is being
0:45 · dishonest I'm not calling him a liar
0:47 · there's a huge difference between
0:49 · misinformation and disinformation and
0:52 · this isn't willfully misleading it's
0:53 · just biased and Ill informed wrong
0:56 · interpretations now um big thing Jimmy
0:59 · talks about a mind blind Revelation that
1:02 · he'll tell you about at the end of the
1:03 · film and I'll come back to that too cuz
1:06 · there's some things to get out the way
· Gòbekli Tepe was NOT deliberately buried
1:09 · first uh now one thing to uh to get out
1:12 · of the way um Jimmy only mentions this
1:15 · but it's worth talking about because
1:17 · it's a misconception that's been hanging
1:18 · around for years um it's been known for
1:21 · a long time now the kcle tee wasn't
1:25 · deliberately buried uh that hypothesis
1:28 · was put forward years ago I I think by
1:30 · CLA Schmidt himself as a possible
1:32 · explanation for the Phil as far as it
1:35 · had been excavated at that point um but
1:40 · as excavations progressed it became
1:42 · clear that the film was caused by the
1:45 · the fil the film The Phil um it was
1:48 · caused by gradual slumping and settling
1:51 · of the hill and the most obvious
1:54 · evidence for this was that as they got
1:57 · lower in the excavation some of the
1:58 · pillars had been pushed over by the
2:01 · weight of the slump um which that's
2:04 · something that couldn't have happened if
2:06 · it had been deliberately filled in from
2:08 · the bottom it would have made the
2:09 · positions of the pillars more secure not
2:11 · less um and less obvious but dating from
2:17 · the fil showed that it was just a
2:19 · jumbled mess now if you imagine for
2:22 · example if you've got a a wall um that's
2:25 · settled over time and or even when it
2:28 · was built actually so you got the old
2:29 · stuff at the bottom and the new stuff at
2:30 · the top now if that at some point just
2:34 · the whole wall collapses then what you
2:36 · get is this tumble down where you can
2:39 · even have the the more recent stuff
2:42 · falling underneath the older stuff as it
2:45 · um as it Tumbl so you just get this big
2:47 · mixture and that's what the dating
2:49 · showed um the thing is that what as is
2:53 · often the case the media pick up on
2:55 · something that's really exciting and uh
2:58 · and they tell the world and everybody
2:59 · pick picks up on that information and
3:02 · then uh you know as as more discoveries
3:05 · come to light the thing is you know if
3:07 · they're not exciting then the media
3:10 · doesn't bother to report them and the
3:12 · public at large is left with the old
3:14 · information and the big problem is that
3:18 · uh unless you go seeking out the actual
3:21 · research papers that are based in the
3:23 · universities or whever then you're not
3:26 · going to get that and of you're not
3:28 · going to get that information and
3:29 · obviously
3:31 · most people don't go looking for the
3:34 · academic papers they rely on the media
3:36 · to give them the
· The 'square rectangular compartments'.
3:38 · information um anyway back to the film
3:43 · and now in the first few minutes Jimmy
3:46 · is talking about the fact that such a
3:48 · small percentage of the site has been
3:50 · excavated and I quote that doesn't even
3:54 · include a series of square rectangular
3:57 · compartments he says
3:59 · what he shows you the image that he
4:01 · shows you in that voice over is a
4:04 · photograph of the excavation grid which
4:07 · anyone with any knowledge of archaeology
4:09 · would have recognized straight away and
4:12 · he would have identified it as such if
4:14 · he had even once Googled archaeological
4:17 · excavations or something similar now I'm
4:21 · not saying that everyone should know
4:24 · this that you're stupid if you don't
4:26 · know this what I am saying is that if
4:29 · you're going to make make an accusatory
4:30 · film criticizing people's work and
4:34 · motives you should have at least looked
4:36 · up that kind of
4:38 · detail um for those of you who don't
4:40 · know it depends on the scale of the
4:43 · excavations it isn't always necessary if
4:46 · it's just say a small burial site that
4:49 · has been uncovered then it's small it
4:52 · doesn't need dividing up but on larger
4:55 · scales excavations are um divided up
4:58 · into a grid you got squares AB c d your
5:02 · way around ABC d 1 2 3 4 so that as the
5:06 · excavations go on everything that
5:09 · everything important that come not even
5:11 · important everything that comes out of
5:13 · those uh soils uh whether it's a piece
5:17 · of bone a broken piece of uh of pottery
5:22 · not so
5:23 · muchy U microliths Flint blades whatever
5:26 · it is all those things that are found
5:29 · they cataloged with the number of the
5:32 · square in which they were found um uh uh
5:36 · with a name and the thing is that uh
5:40 · what that tells you is that anybody
5:42 · who's looking at the excavation data
5:44 · after the event will know exactly where
5:46 · on that grid that item was found okay so
5:50 · that's what he's looking at it's they're
5:52 · not Square compartments from thousands
5:56 · of years ago um
6:00 · you know the grid is purely for
6:01 · excavation efficiency and it Bears no
6:04 · relation to the shape of the structures
6:05 · below the
6:07 · surface uh then now okay Jimmy goes on
· Why it all takes so long.
6:11 · to talk about how only 5% of the site
6:14 · has been excavated and that figure
6:17 · hasn't changed in the last seven years
6:19 · and he asks how is it possible that no
6:21 · measurable advances have been made and
6:23 · what is the hold
6:25 · up this is a tail the thing about a tail
6:29 · is that you don't really know how deep
6:31 · it's going to be the Mounds get bigger
6:34 · over the centuries of human occupation
6:36 · um in fact possibly the best example of
6:39 · this is the mound at um karanovo in
6:43 · Bulgaria where the archaeologists have
6:45 · actually erected a pillar there against
6:48 · an excavated facade marking out the
6:51 · levels of the mound through the
6:53 · Millennia right from Neolithic up to the
6:56 · chal lithic so you can stand by that
6:57 · mound and you can see where you know on
7:00 · your own body and going way up above
7:03 · your head you can see where the the
7:06 · ground level was over the periods of
7:10 · time um now just imagine for example
7:17 · um the reason that the excavations at
7:20 · gockley tee are still around the 5% Mark
7:23 · is because it's a tail it was a if it
7:26 · was a flat field in Wilshire or
7:28 · Wisconsin uh with an excavation depth of
7:31 · say a meter then yeah excavations would
7:33 · be fairly quick relatively uh but it
7:37 · imagine you got a grid of 100 squares
7:40 · and you dig down you're you're in one
7:42 · square square one or you've done you've
7:44 · started off with 10 um and you start
7:47 · digging down and the next season you're
7:49 · still digging down you haven't got to
7:50 · the bottom and you keep and and year on
7:52 · Year you still haven't got to the
7:54 · bottom you know the whole point about a
7:57 · tail is that the depth can be immense
8:01 · and there's no point starting a new
8:03 · trench over there when you haven't even
8:05 · reached the bottom here so at the end of
8:08 · each excavation season on top of that
8:10 · the team spend ages writing up their
8:14 · findings making sure they all the
8:15 · catalog is cataloging is done properly
8:18 · and there is a reason these things are
8:21 · done meticulously it takes time that b
8:25 · statue that we were all so excited about
8:27 · last year was at a depth of about 5 or
8:29 · six M from the surface so I you know
8:33 · nobody says for example nobody says how
8:35 · ridiculous it is that chatt ho is at
8:37 · roughly the same percentage of
8:39 · excavation regardless of the fact that
8:41 · it's been under excavation for 30 years
8:43 · longer there's something about kcly TIY
8:46 · just makes people lose the
8:48 · plot
8:49 · now the thing is see it it's over a
· Without the rigour, you have nothing.
8:52 · century now since archaeology stopped
8:57 · being essentially glorified treasure
8:59 · hunter
9:00 · it's all about the people
9:02 · and what we can find out about the
9:05 · people soil is scraped away carefully
9:09 · and slowly with with each microlith each
9:13 · tiny Flint blade or whatever cataloged
9:16 · types of stone vessels animal bones how
9:19 · did they change over time and what does
9:22 · that tell us about how these people were
9:26 · living why is that important well is
9:29 · important for so many reasons but
9:31 · without the riger you have nothing
9:35 · imagine you find pieces of work Flint or
9:38 · obsidian whatever uh with little chips
9:41 · napped off a core to make an axe now you
9:45 · can make yourself a perfectly usable axe
9:48 · with a little knowhow and if you imagine
9:51 · then going backwards in sequence putting
9:54 · it back together the fragments that you
9:57 · chipped away will reveal how that a
9:59 · was made now potentially quite
10:03 · random but what if it's not random if
10:07 · you collect all those seemingly
10:09 · unimportant fragments going down through
10:11 · say 2,000 years of soil and you see that
10:15 · they reveal the same fragment shapes and
10:19 · the same technique it shows you that
10:22 · that method was taught parent to child
10:25 · or teacher to student for generations
10:29 · and and
10:30 · generations you've heard of Clovis
10:32 · culture gratian cutan there's so many
10:36 · tool making techniques that Define a
10:38 · group of people in time now without that
10:41 · painstaking cataloging of finds we would
10:45 · know none of this if you brought in
10:48 · 10,000 volunteers to gockley teepe with
10:52 · shovels you could uncover the whole site
10:54 · in no time uh but how would you deal
10:57 · with all that data how could you
11:00 · possibly record all that without
11:02 · bringing in another few thousand
11:04 · volunteers to do all the cataloging you
11:07 · couldn't apart from the vast amount of
11:09 · damage caused by the footfall of
11:11 · thousands of people you you you'd end up
11:13 · uncovering something maybe something
11:15 · wonderful but learning nothing um you
11:20 · know who were those people don't know we
11:22 · threw that away it's you know it's
· Science has got no place for impatience
11:29 · see all theologies it doesn't matter
11:30 · which it doesn't matter which one it is
11:32 · a personal favorite of mine a geology
11:35 · you know
11:37 · it's all theologies they require dogged
11:40 · determination and rigor the whole body
11:43 · of human knowledge is born from these
11:46 · beautiful nerdy people who painstakingly
11:50 · spend their lives pouring through data
11:53 · that would make other Minds go
11:55 · numb um you know um
11:59 · a bit of a hero of mine in the 1890s
12:02 · there was a geologist called Arthur row
12:04 · and uh he was exploring Cliffs on the
12:07 · coast of Kent Southeast England uh the
12:11 · cliffs that show millions of years of
12:13 · strata uh and uh as he as he scrambled
12:17 · down he spotted a fossil in The Cliff
12:20 · face prized it out carried on down by
12:23 · the time he'd got to the bottom he'd
12:25 · collected a small number of fossils uh
12:28 · and each noticeably different these were
12:30 · all micers he did a lot of study on
12:32 · micers which are a kind of fossil sea
12:35 · urchin um now uh like a lot of fossil
12:39 · Hunters you know he was quite excited by
12:41 · this so he decided to climb back up
12:44 · being a bit more careful and collecting
12:47 · as many fossils as he could as he went
12:50 · back up and he carefully noted the order
12:54 · of each one as he went up now when he
12:58 · got back home
12:59 · he laid them out in order and was
13:03 · astonished to see quite clearly how over
13:06 · time the form of the one at the
13:09 · bottom turned into the form of the one
13:12 · at the top just gradual changes right
13:15 · way up through millions of years in your
13:18 · face evidence for evolution which I got
13:20 · to be honest I don't understand why this
13:22 · isn't taught in schools to this day um
13:25 · my point is that imagine if as he went
13:31 · row had just tossed all the fossils into
13:34 · a bucket that when he looked through
13:36 · them later all he would have seen would
13:39 · have been a jumbled collection of
13:40 · different species um no clue as to their
13:44 · relationship through time and
13:47 · consequently the real importance of what
13:49 · he had found now Archaeology is just
13:54 · like that and science has just got no
13:57 · place for impatience
· The trees have not been deliberately planted
14:00 · um so there's another biggie that Jame
14:03 · uh that Jimmy talks
14:05 · about another feature he talks about in
14:07 · a very conspiratorial way is is what he
14:11 · describes as Orchards of trees um uh
14:15 · these are actually olive
14:16 · trees and uh they've actually been a
14:19 · massive pain for the archaeologists now
14:23 · the conspiracy theorists will tell you
14:25 · that they are planting trees to stop you
14:29 · from Excavating or some such
14:31 · nonsense what the
14:34 · conspiracists failed to take into
14:37 · account is that when gockley teepe was
14:40 · discovered this was all private farmland
14:43 · and pretty much worthless Farmland at
14:46 · that now when it became clear that this
14:49 · was a major Discovery it also became
14:53 · clear that the authorities would want to
14:56 · take ownership of the land to continue
14:59 · the excavations so the farmers started
15:02 · planting olive trees as fast as they
15:04 · could to increase the value of the land
15:07 · by 10 to 20 times at least now
15:12 · realistically from $1,000 an acre to
15:16 · maybe $20,000 an acre I'm not fully up
15:19 · on uh on those on land prices today but
15:24 · I know that's a ballpark figure anyway
15:27 · so those trees are nothing to do with
15:30 · them trying to hide stuff from you
15:32 · they're the result of poor people trying
15:35 · to make as much money from their land as
15:38 · they can and frankly you can't blame
15:41 · them for doing
· The role of governments & commerce
15:43 · it uh now this one may count as a bit of
15:46 · a shock to you do you know what
15:48 · governments aren't generally fast about
15:51 · archaeology unless it's significant for
15:53 · the tourist industry governments don't
15:56 · care um now it doesn't matter where in
15:58 · the world
15:59 · some excavations are funded by
16:01 · universities when they can afford it
16:03 · pretty much everything else is funded by
16:06 · tourism or most of the time development
16:10 · you think how how often have you read
16:13 · something like Bronze Age site found
16:15 · during Road building or burial site
16:17 · uncovered during building work for a new
16:19 · housing
16:21 · estate uh it's discovered because they
16:23 · were digging the land for profit you
16:26 · can't avoid that and it's crazy to
16:28 · imagine inagine that every money-making
16:31 · scheme is a
16:33 · conspiracy uh the problem is that
16:35 · conspiracy theorist folks they see these
16:37 · huge multinational corporations as part
16:40 · of a new world order trying to hide the
16:43 · truth from you they're not they just
16:45 · love money and want to make as much of
16:47 · it as they can they don't care much
16:48 · about the details and if they funded
16:51 · excavations they want to see that money
16:53 · back with a return on their investment
16:56 · and they're fully aware that sites like
16:58 · Beckley tee as a tourist attraction it's
17:01 · only going to get more profitable as
17:03 · time goes on far from hiding it they
17:06 · would absolutely love it if the
17:08 · archaeologists uncovered something
17:11 · spectacular it would mean Millions more
17:13 · dollars through
17:15 · tourism
· What are they 'hiding' and why?
17:16 · now some people do like to say that they
17:20 · have a reason to hide the past from you
17:23 · but seriously think that one through
17:27 · there is no possible ad Advantage not a
17:30 · single one um Al although I mean it says
17:34 · something about human nature that you
17:36 · write a book about archaeology you might
17:38 · sell a few thousand copies but if you
17:39 · write a book saying they're hiding it
17:41 · from you you'll sell a million um
17:44 · seriously ask yourself what amazing
17:48 · Revelation from Human past from
17:51 · Humanity's distant past what amazing
17:55 · Revelation would turn you into an
17:57 · anarchist or whatever ever would make
17:59 · you rise up against these people who'
18:01 · hidden it from you what what what what
18:03 · amazing thing would make you want to do
· The canopy & walkway
18:07 · that um uh moving on something else that
18:12 · Jimmy criticizes is the uh and quite a
18:17 · lengthy criticism as well of the the
18:19 · canopy and the walkway construction put
18:22 · in for tourists I can't break down the
18:25 · whole thing I've had long conversations
18:27 · with um uh with archaeologists uh about
18:31 · how this was done and how it was planned
18:34 · uh and it's long and it's complicated
18:36 · and all I'll say at this point is I'd
18:38 · love to know what his solution to the
18:42 · problem would have been I mean what
18:43 · would Jimmy have uh have suggested
18:46 · should have been done here um you know
18:49 · it's a it's clearly a massively
18:50 · important uh site the public wants to
18:54 · see it and if you don't put
18:57 · in uh War walkways and things that uh
19:00 · that enable the public to see it then
19:02 · all you're going to do is have footfall
19:04 · across the site itself which is going to
19:07 · totally destroy a load of the
19:09 · archaeology so that just it can't be
19:11 · done uh in actual fact the uh there's
19:15 · compromises in every uh tourist
19:18 · structure that's put in a sight frankly
19:20 · they did a bloody good job um kcle teepe
19:24 · and uh uh as I said I'd like to know
19:27 · what Jimmy's solution would have
· A 'crime against humanity'?
19:30 · been now the last point that Jimmy makes
19:35 · his big reveal which he describes as a
19:38 · crime against
19:40 · humanity is that there's the possibility
19:43 · that excavations will stop and the site
19:46 · will be left for future generations and
19:48 · the thing is there's just no truth in
19:51 · this whatsoever it is completely made up
19:55 · I know the coordinating archaeologist
19:57 · down there and I know that there is no
19:58 · such sensation of activity has been
20:00 · suggested the uh the Dig schedules are
20:05 · carrying on as
20:07 · normal um I was trying to think where
20:11 · that idea may have
20:14 · Arisen and it's
20:17 · possible it's unlikely but it's possible
20:21 · that it's misheard whispers about the
20:24 · cessation of excavations at the Ness of
20:26 · broader on ory without doubt one of the
20:30 · most important archaeological sites in
20:32 · the
20:33 · world um now excavations are going to
20:36 · stop uh the nest at the end of the
20:39 · season this year
20:40 · 2024 uh and it will be covered up for
20:44 · the foreseeable future the thing is that
20:48 · far from being any conspiracy nonsense
20:51 · there's good reasons for this um unless
20:55 · of course you're simply an impatient
20:58 · treasure hunter uh I mean you know
21:01 · imagine you go back to the 1940s and
21:03 · Willard Libby University of Chicago uh
21:07 · came up with the genius concept of
21:08 · carbon dating something that completely
21:12 · transformed the world of
21:14 · archaeology and I thing is it was
21:16 · decades later that advances in
21:20 · Biochemistry brought in other
21:22 · groundbreaking techniques like strontium
21:24 · analysis and protein recognition I mean
21:28 · not long ago a piece of broken pot was
21:31 · just a piece of broken pot but now not
21:36 · only can you tell that maybe it
21:38 · contained milk you can tell whether it
21:41 · was sheep's milk or goat's milk or cow's
21:44 · milk it just gives us so much more
21:47 · information about how our ancestors were
21:49 · living um we can tell that that gold
21:53 · found in Germany actually came from
21:55 · Cornwall or the person in that Bronze
21:58 · Age grave in Denmark grew up in Spain uh
22:02 · the the thing is that far from being a
22:04 · crime against
22:06 · humanity um this is actually a selfless
22:09 · act um it it's putting as a researcher
22:12 · it's putting all that zealous enthusiasm
22:16 · to one side um in the knowledge that in
22:20 · 10 or 20 years from now the inevitable
22:23 · advances in physics and chemistry will
22:25 · reveal far more information than we
22:28 · could possibly hope to achieve right now
· A shout out for those who actually do the work!
22:32 · um I mean the biggest sadness in all of
22:35 · this for me is that the archaeologists
22:39 · and researchers on the ground bust their
22:43 · asses to do their work the best way
22:46 · possible and bring the the information
22:48 · to the public um as as quickly as they
22:51 · can uh to accuse them of hiding
22:55 · information when you don't even put in
22:58 · the effort to read their latest research
23:01 · papers is at best
23:04 · disingenuous uh but I'll bet the vast
23:06 · majority of conspiracy theorist folks
23:09 · have never sought out and read a
23:10 · scientific paper in their lives um
23:13 · anyway enough um if you've made it to
23:17 · here then thank you very much for
23:20 · listening um if you want facts about
23:23 · prehistory without any of the
23:25 · conspiratorial nonsense that hit like
23:28 · And subscribe and stick with the
23:30 · prehistory guys cuz it's what we do see
23:34 · you soon

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Þanlýurfa To Shed More Light On History Of Civilization [06/24/2006]
German Paper Reports World's Oldest Temple Is In Sanliurfa (Turkey- 10,000BC) [01/21/2006]
Layers of clustered apartments hide artifacts of ancient urban life [04/20/2005]
Italian Archaeologist: Anatolia - Home To First Civilization On Earth [06/22/2003]

Subjects like this fascinate me. Of particular note:

1:06 · there's some things to get out the way · Gòbekli Tepe was NOT deliberately buried

Tyhe speaker rambles on too much; canno sit through listenting to him.

That one in particular has been obvious from the beginning, originating in nothing but an offhand speculation. It’s obvious that there’s no evidence for it, but even here on FR it pops up once in a while.

2:04 · something that couldn't have happened if 2:06 · it had been deliberately filled in from 2:08 · the bottom it would have made the 2:09 · positions of the pillars more secure

No arguing that reasoning.

not long ago a piece of broken pot was 21:31 · just a piece of broken pot but now not 21:36 · only can you tell that maybe it 21:38 · contained milk you can tell whether it 21:41 · was sheep's milk or goat's milk or cow's 21:44 · milk it just gives us so much more 21:47 · information about how our ancestors were 21:49 · living

Beautiful insights.

Historians have long wondered if the Eden story is a folk memory, an allegory of the move from hunter-gathering to farming. Seen in this way, the Eden story describes how we moved from a life of relative leisure - literally picking fruit from the trees - to a harsher existence of ploughing and reaping.

Fascinating. I wonder what could cause such a shift?

1:06 · there's some things to get out the way · Gòbekli Tepe was NOT deliberately buried.

The slow subsidence theory sounds possible, but how, then, did the structures at the apex of the hill suffer the same fate?

Right. And all at relatively the same time? So many questions.

Climate change.

About The Prehistory Guys

Rupert Soskin
Rupert’s university education was in Design, Photography and Natural History. His work has been copiously printed in books, magazine and wildlife publications. His love of the outdoors led him to train and qualify as an expedition leader and diver. Rupert has travelled extensively, lecturing and leading groups including expeditions to visit the Kogi Indians in the jungles of Northern Colombia. His life long interest in the natural world, has led him to further his research into archaeology, anthropology and evolutionary psychology. Filming ‘Standing with Stones’ and the subsequent The Prehistory Guys project has been a culmination of this work but he has also fulfilled his ambition to be a writer with the publication of the accompanying book by Thames & Hudson. For more information visit rupertsoskin.com
Michael Bott
Michael was born on the Isle of Man in 1954. He is a professional actor, and among his many credits he was a member of the Royal Shakespeare Company and worked at the Royal National Theatre for several years. Around the end of the 90’s he moved into video production and film making, developing ideas for television and freelancing as a corporate video producer. As a television producer his work includes “Henry Lincoln’s guide to Renne Le Chateau” and “The Man Behind The DaVinci Code” for Channel 5 and Discovery. His fascination for megalithic sites stems from early childhood when he was first taken to the Rollright Stones in Oxfordshire. His ‘magnum opus’ has turned out to be the subject of this site: ‘Standing with Stones’. and the Prehistory Guys project.