Update from Ukraine | Ukraine Continue to Push the Ruzzian Army on the South | Verbove is next

Youtube.com ^ | 11-15-2023 | Denys Davydov

[JonPreston]

I like to get the KooK typing :)

[JonPreston]

[BroJoeK]

quoting NBC News: "US and European officials have begun quietly talking to the Ukrainian government about possible peace negotiations with Russia..."

Of course they are, there have been negotiations in the past and doubtless will be again at some point.
Such negotiations have never led to anything positive, but who knows, maybe this time will be different?

The public signs from Vlad the Invader are that he wants to negotiate, but not that he is willing to give up on any demand for Ukrainian territory or "neutrality".

My guess is Ukrainians will not be interested in any deal Vlad might offer and Vlad will not accept giving up Ukrainian territories or on EU and NATO membership for Ukraine.

So negotiations will go nowhere and both sides will use the winter to rearm and adjust for another go at it next year.
Just guessing, you never know for sure until it happens.

[BroJoeK]

kiryandil: "You've more patience than I with "Ol' Wall O' Text".
It's like reading a "nightly news" transcript from CNN or MSNBC."

I notice that you guys are more than happy to quote from "main stream media" whenever that suits your own narrative.

[JonPreston]

Your Biden pushed this war, just as we have been saying x 2 years.

Top Ukrainian MP, David Arakhamia, confirms Russia agreed to end the war and pull back its troops in March 2022 if Ukraine would accept neutrality.
- Then, the US/UK sabotaged the peace agreement to fight Russia with Ukrainian soldiers.
- Confirmed by mediators -Turkey & Israel pic.twitter.com/TVENA022Kn— Glenn Diesen (@Glenn_Diesen) November 25, 2023

[kiryandil]

He comes when he's called.

Wonder if we could teach him the Pavlov's dog thingee with the bell?

[kiryandil]

confirms Russia agreed to end the war and pull back its troops in March 2022 if Ukraine would accept neutrality.

How many times have we seen that same stupid post on FR:

"All Russia has to do is withdraw."

This shows that the moronic line was ALWAYS horsplop.

[JonPreston]

Russia agreed to end the war and pull back its troops in March 2022

This was Putin's pullback from Kiev, as per the Istanbul summit

[JonPreston]

He comes when he's called

Along with 500 words and links absolutely no one will read. I'll wake him up tomorrow morning with the latest from Moscow.

[JonPreston]

[BroJoeK]

kiryandil to JonPreston: "He comes when he's called.
Wonder if we could teach him the Pavlov's dog thingee with the bell?"

Seriously? That's all you've got? Nothing else?
No facts, no logic, no reasons, no data, no arguments worth the name?

Do you even understand how weak you sound?

[BroJoeK]

JonPreston: "Your Biden pushed this war, just as we have been saying x 2 years.
Top Ukrainian MP, David Arakhamia, confirms Russia agreed to end the war and pull back its troops in March 2022 if Ukraine would accept neutrality.
- Then, the US/UK sabotaged the peace agreement to fight Russia with Ukrainian soldiers.
- Confirmed by mediators -Turkey & Israel
pic.twitter.com/TVENA022Kn— Glenn Diesen (@Glenn_Diesen) November 25, 2023"

We've covered this ground now at least three times before,

Here on November 5

Here on November 17

Here on November 24

Key facts remain as always:

1. Sources pushing this narrative are all pro-Russian, there are none I've seen from the Ukrainian perspective.

2. Vlad the Invader himself only began pushing it in June 2023, perhaps signaling his own eagerness to "negotiate".

3. Vlad the Invader himself killed earlier negotiations
   "Russian President Vladimir Putin had rejected a potential deal with Ukraine offered by his key envoy in the early days of the invasion as he 'expanded' his goals to include annexing more territory, Reuters reported Wednesday, citing three unnamed sources close to Russia's leadership.

   Kremlin deputy chief of staff Dmitry Kozak, Putin’s chief envoy on Ukraine, was said to have secured a deal guaranteeing that Ukraine would not join NATO — a key Russian demand prior to its full-scale invasion of its pro-Western neighbor.
   According to Reuters, Putin made clear that Kozak’s deal with an unspecified number of Ukrainian concessions did not go far enough.
   Putin reportedly 'expanded his objectives to include annexing swathes of Ukrainian territory,' Reuters reported. 'Everything was canceled.
   Putin simply changed the plan as he went along,' one of Reuters’ sources was quoted as saying."
   Moscow Times, September 14, 2022.

4. I've never seen a statement from any Ukrainian official saying they were willing to accept peace with Russia on Vlad the Invader's terms.

5. Beginning early in Russia's invasion, US Pres. Biden said publicly, the US will support Ukraine's resistance "for as long as it takes".
   My guess is, such assurances may well be the root cause of Ukraine's leadership's unwillingness to sign a surrender document with Vlad the Invader in March 2022, or anytime since.

Bottom line is that Vlad the Invader can have peace with Ukraine and with the world at large, today if he wants it.
All he has to do is order his minions in Ukraine to stop fighting, withdraw back to previous recognized Russian boundaries, and promise never to invade again.
Then there is the matter of Russian reparations to Ukraine, but those will be very cheap compared to the costs in blood and treasure of continuing his invasions of neighboring countries like Ukraine.

[BroJoeK]

JonPreston to kiryandil: "Along with 500 words and links absolutely no one will read.
I'll wake him up tomorrow morning with the latest from Moscow."

You have no idea who reads which posts, and it doesn't matter.
What matters is that when lunatics like you post Russian propaganda KoolAid directly from the Kremlin's sewer pipes, then there need to be answers posted which directly, factually and logically incinerate such sewage.

As for links, they show there is a source, for anyone who doubts enough to check them out.
If you believe the data looks legitimate, then there's no need to check out the source.

[JonPreston]

More cowbell please

Here’s your daily reminder that Ukraine is a Nazi state and Putin was right about EVERYTHING ‼️

🚨 This is where your government’s been spending your tax money for the past 10 years

It’s for “freedom and democracy” they said👇 pic.twitter.com/ayzLBWAdL5— Gabe (@GabeZZOZZ) November 26, 2023

[JonPreston]

Peace was at hand in March, 2022, but YOUR Biden pushed war, a war you Neocons celebrate.

Ukraine is NOT a democracy ‼️

Zelensky banned opposition political parties

— He arrested political opponents

— He banned independent media

— He shut down Orthodox churches

— Nazi collaborators are celebrated as national heroes (Ukraine has over 40 monuments of Stepan… https://t.co/CX7vhfqfcg pic.twitter.com/VBUcs77vZO— Gabe (@GabeZZOZZ) November 26, 2023

[JonPreston]

Don't skimp on the typing. I want, at a minimum, a 750 word reply *with links*

GO!

The Ukrainian TV channel published information in a creeping line about more than 1.1 million dead and missing military personnel of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

The channel’s management, after a call from Zelensky’s Office, apologized for the “typo.”@Slavyangrad pic.twitter.com/mTRbypZFwC— Zlatti71 (@djuric_zlatko) November 26, 2023

[BroJoeK]

JonPreston: "BBC: 650,000 conscription-aged men have left Ukraine for Europe"

OK, so let's first look at Russians who fled Russia since February 2022:

"Following the Russian invasion of Ukraine that started in late February 2022, more than 300,000 Russian citizens and residents are estimated to have left Russia by mid-March 2022, at least 500,000 by the end of August 2022... and an additional 400,000[1] by early October, for a total of approximately 900,000.
This number includes economic migrants, conscientious objectors, and some political refugees.[2][3][4][5][6]"

Ukrainian refugees are counted as:

"An ongoing refugee crisis began in Europe in late February 2022 after Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
Nearly 6 million refugees fleeing Ukraine are recorded across Europe,[1] while an estimated 8 million others had been displaced within the country by late May 2022.[needs update][2][3][4]
Approximately one-quarter of the country's total population had left their homes in Ukraine by 20 March.[5]
90% of Ukrainian refugees are women and children, while most Ukrainian men between the ages of 18 and 60 are banned from leaving the country.[6]
By 24 March, more than half of all children in Ukraine had left their homes, of whom a quarter had left the country.[7][8] "

How many actual Ukrainian draft dodgers are there?

"BBC says nearly 20,000 men fled Ukraine to avoid conscription
Story by VALENTYNA ROMANENKO • 1w"

"The BBC has found that nearly 20,000 men have fled Ukraine since the start of the full-scale war to avoid being drafted into the country's army.
Ukraine's State Border Guard Service (SBGS) is unaware of such figures, adding that attempted illegal border crossings fell in 2023.

"Source: BBC; Colonel Andrii Demchenko, spokesperson for SBGS, in a comment to Ukrainska Pravda

"Details: The BBC says it established this number by requesting data on illegal border crossings from Ukraine's neighbours Romania, Moldova, Poland, Hungary and Slovakia.
The data indicate that 19,740 men illegally crossed these countries' borders between February 2022 and 31 August 2023."

So who are those 650,000 Ukrainian men refugees also reported by the BBC?

"Approximately 650,000 Ukrainian men aged 18-60 have left Ukraine for Europe since the start of Russia's illegal invasion of Ukraine in February 2022, BBC Ukraine reported on Nov. 24.

Citing data provided by Eurostat, the official statistical record-keeping agency of the EU, the report notes over half a million male refugees are currently residing in the 27 EU member states, as well as Switzerland, Liechtenstein, and Norway, many of whom are undocumented."

"...The statistics do not provide details on the number of men who departed legally as fathers of three children, individuals with disabilities, or other eligible categories for travel outside of Ukraine.
Nor do statistics specify the number of men who may have traveled to Europe from the territories temporarily occupied by Russia.

"As Ukraine faces the challenge of maintaining adequate military personnel, recent reports indicate that nearly 20,000 Ukrainian men have managed to evade conscription, finding various routes to leave the country."

So, 20,000 are known draft dodgers, the rest could be legitimate, including escapees from Russian controlled regions of Ukraine.

[JonPreston]

Your last effort was somewhat better, but still lacking the 750 words I requested. Try harder.

5 men were caught trying to flee Ukraine through the Slovak border. pic.twitter.com/VDooGZq4Bu— Joe Dubyk (@JoeDubyk) November 25, 2023

[BroJoeK]

JonPreston: "More cowbell please
Here’s your daily reminder that Ukraine is a Nazi state and Putin was right about EVERYTHING ‼️
🚨 This is where your government’s been spending your tax money for the past 10 years"

Seriously?? That's all you've got?
Somebody, somewhere draped in an odd-looking flag proves all Ukrainians as somehow Nazis?
Do you even know what the word "Nazi" means?

Of course, you know, because in the Russian propaganda definition,

Nazi=Ukrainian=Nazi=Ukrainian=NATO=Ukrainian=Nazi/NATO/Ukrainian

But the real historical definition of "Nazi" is: National Socialist antisemite, and so far as anyone knows, there are none of those in Ukraine, as illustrated by their elected Pres. Zelenskyy of Jewish heritage and other Ukraine government officials.

The term "National Socialist" also defines fascism, so Nazis are antisemitic fascists.

The term "national socialist", meaning fascists, pretty well defines Russia's government under Vlad the Invader.
And there are plenty of Russian fascists who are also antisemitic, meaning they fit the definition of the word "Nazi".
On top of all that, Vlad the Invader is currently behaving just as Adolf Hitler behaved in the mid-1930s regarding Germany's neighbors in Austria, Czechoslovakia and Poland.

So the whole idea of "Nazi" is mostly meaningless today, but if it applies to anybody, it's to Vlad the Invader's Russians.

[JonPreston]

Your Biden's war is lost at the cost of nearly 300,000 dead and wounded Ukies. To this I say, Bravo! and give me no less that a 500 word post in YOUR follow up.

You're on the clock, GO!

Video thread:

‼️🇷🇺💥Frames from the Avdeevka industrial zone, which was taken under our control

▪️Intelligence officers shared footage of occupied positions in the industrial zone. The fighters also showed their command post, which they managed to set up in such a short time.… pic.twitter.com/YYCy6iqB9o— Zlatti71 (@djuric_zlatko) November 26, 2023