Military warns EMP attack could wipe out America, 'democracy, world order'

Washington Examiner ^ | 11/30/2018 | Paul Bedard

[BenLurkin]

The report, titled, “Electromagnetic Defense Task Force,” and the product of a mostly classified summit of officials from 40 agencies just outside of Washington earlier this year, is a forceful call for a new focus on preparing for either an enemy EMP attack or a natural hit such as a solar storm.

While it is focused on the devastating impact an EMP hit would have on the military, it appears to support a congressional warning that up to 90 percent of the population on the East Coast would die in a year of an attack that would dismantle or interfere with electricity, transportation, food processing, and healthcare.

Consider just some of the warnings in the report from the United States Air Force Air University and the Curtis E. LeMay Center for Doctrine Development and Education.

Figuring out just which country launched an attack would be difficult since certain weapons could be delivered in a satellite.

It also noted the development of the 5G mobile network and how it will run communications and why it must be protected, especially since China is the biggest investor in its development.

“Because control of 5G is roughly equivalent to control of the Internet, open 5G is critical to freedom and free-market economics. Meanwhile, access to the 5G-millimeter wave bandwidth will be critical to operations in all war-fighting domains, in particular, space command & control,” said the white paper.

Lt. Gen. Steven Kwast, the commander of Air Education and Training Command, said, “As electromagnetic technologies fuse in new and often dangerous ways, it’s critical that the military and industry make honest evaluations of present and future conflict states to ensure we’re proactive rather than reactive.”

[Shadowstrike]

depends on where it hit, when the Carrington event happened it did NOT affect the entire US. Quit fear mongering.

[Freedom56v2]

Well, I don’t know how you define “not all that bad for civilians, either.” What do you mean by “either?”

1. Did you actually read Section 8 of the 168 page report yo posted? I don’t see where it is not all that bad for civilians...Please direct me to that passage.

2. The report does not address cyber attacks that can bring down the grid—IMHO that is more likely scenario.

3. I went to the Metatech website and saw no staff directory of names and credentials~in fact not a lot of info on exactly who they are at all...Why should I believe them? Why do you?

4. The report was prepared NINE years ago...

—You think technology might have changed a bit? Like how accomplished the Chinese and Nork hackers have become?

—This report was funded and filed during the Obama administration...by a company I know nothing about...Why would I trust any of it?

[Freedom56v2]

I asked what you are talking about...Ivan...OK I am not still not sure who you mean but I am guessing Putin...Who cares what he says?

So are you, like all the Dems, hung up on RUSSIA RUSSIA RUSSIA? Russia is not the USSR anymore. Why do all Russiaphobes ignore the obvious threat of China? Iran?

I really don’t understand what you are getting at.

[familyop]

"I asked what you are talking about...Ivan...OK I am not still not sure who you mean but I am guessing Putin..."

You still don't know. But many FReepers do, especially those of us who lived and served early enough to have learned enough about Russia.

"So are you, like all the Dems, hung up on RUSSIA RUSSIA RUSSIA? Russia is not the USSR anymore. Why do all Russiaphobes ignore the obvious threat of China? Iran?"

There's some projection and quite a bit of ignorance about history on display there. And "Russiaphobes?" That speech is hysterical and fruity. You were obviously not properly trained to do an American favor "for mommy." [Something else you may not understand.]

[familyop]

"—You think technology might have changed a bit? Like how accomplished the Chinese and Nork hackers have become?"

Waaaaaa. The word is not hackers. It's crackers. You're not only mouthing off too much about foreign enemies without a good history education, but you obviously haven't done much lower level programming either.

[familyop]

If blue state bosses weren’t so lazy about how power plants are built and maintained, the threat of a crack wouldn’t be a problem for those states. Same goes for blue state bosses who only hire script kiddies for software jobs. And no, the grid is not a nationwide monolith that can’t be separated. And it doesn’t have the same kinds of components throughout. People should do more reading and stop paying so much attention to the screechy talking girls on the boob tube.

[Freedom56v2]

You make no sense...Nor do you support your contentions...Show me the EMP threat Russia poses? Didn’t do it. Instead you insulted me stating I don’t know history etc...

I lived “early enough” to understand the threat of USSR—over 25 years ago...There were students at my university from Soviet block countries that were under surveillance. We all knew who they were—grad students in programming, engineering, etc...Some were escorted away in dark of the night...sort of like living The Amerikans TV show...(Wish the Chinese were being watched today, but I suspect numbers are so large, no one is watching what they are stealing like Soviet block students were watched in the 80s...)

So having lived thru the 80s I am well aware of what WAS the Soviet threat. The 80s...when we had a wonderful president who defeated the Russians...President Reagan who I voted for and saw in person—So yeah, I get that there was a Soviet threat...then, but Russia today is a shadow of what was the Soviet Union.

No I did not serve, so I don’t get your special terms...which I asked you to clarify and you didn’t... “Ivan” “properly trained to do a favor for mommy.” Thanks for showing that you are erudite and special.

Crackers vs. Hackers...Unlike you, I don’t need to prove credentials...This is not a tech forum discussing coding hacking or if you must, cracking...so you want to split hairs, go ahead...

However, I actually have a degree in programming from the 1980s, plenty of coding...Assembler VAX, BASIC, COBOL, FORTRAN. Oh, and I did take a fair amount of history while completing my BS.

I said Russia is not USSR. It is not USSR superpower NOW. It was in the 1980s. Projection? Hardly you brought Russia on the thread and I don’t think anyone else did...I get that you are far more savvy and learned than me, so you go right ahead and continue to focus on Russian EMP threat and Ivan and continue to think;

an EMP “is not all that bad for civilians, either.”

As for me, well President Trump realizes the threat, and so do I.

This back-and-forth has devolved, taken far too much time with no movement in either of our positions (facts help btw), and is not adding to the debate on EMPs, so I am done. Please, no more insulting unsubstantiated posts as I am not responding...

[familyop]

Alright. Look here in the paper ("The Early-Time (E1) High-Altitude Electromagnetic Pulse (HEMP) and Its Impact on the U.S. Power Grid", Metatech Corporation for Oak Ridge National Laboratory).

"Then there are others that think every electronic device in the country will fail, and we will go back to the Stone Age. There are many such exaggerated scenarios; for example, it is doubtful that more than a very small fraction of vehicles will suddenly stop working..."

See? That's a nice break from the hysteria that we've been seeing in some of the comments in the thread.

"...but how long will they be able to run with gasoline supply disruptions from possible electric power grid problems?"

And that would keep the leftist mobs in the cities out of trouble long enough for us to get them situated.

"Many perceptions of E1 HEMP effects, and the feeling that nothing can be done about E1 HEMP vulnerabilities, are also erroneous. Besides accounting for the unlikely chance of a HEMP event, efforts to protect against E1 HEMP effects also tend to have other benefits."

Businesses and bureaucrats are working on that. We, as individuals and families, should be preparing ourselves instead of promoting hysteria. There's no sense in worrying about it otherwise.

[familyop]

"As for me, well President Trump realizes the threat, and so do I."

Well then, we shouldn't even be arguing. Never mind. ;-)

More seriously, EMP effects would come with nuclear exchanges mostly designed to destroy infrastructure, equipment and potential conscripts with air bursts (not much fallout), although there would be a few ground bursts in particular areas (much fallout).

And nuclear exchanges would be only the beginning of the greatest war. In the USA alone, there would probably be roughly 50 million men fit enough to begin training after nuclear strikes. In other NATO countries, there would be many more.

[familyop]

"I said Russia is not USSR. It is not USSR superpower NOW."

Hmmm. From your choice of words there, maybe you do know more about the USSR but from a perspective different from mine.

[Defiant]

I may be misinformed, but I've read that we now have the technology and ability to determine where a radioactive isotope is processed into weapons grade

I read that many years ago, as well, which meant that if a random nuke exploded in the US we would know where it came from. Worryingly, though, it has been posited that the purpose of the U1 deal was to get uranium to Russia that would be distributed to other players so that we might not know where it came from if one happens to explode in the US. I hope such is not the case.

[Defiant]

Yup.

[GBA]

"The more they overthink the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain."
Montgomery "Scotty" Scott

We are very dependent upon technology, so much so we have happily and smugly forgotten to learn basic skills and will be lost if the tech quits working.

[joegoeny]

I will buy that just so all the countries are on the same page it will be in no countries best interest if a nuke slips out. Also maybe the rogue states will get reined in.

[BenLurkin]

Excellent quote from Scotty. I think of it often. Usually mis-quote it as “The fancier they make the plumbing...”

[joegoeny]

Actualy your cranked Ford model t comes emp hardened. Your 60s muscle cars willl need a backup set of wiring starter motor, spark plugs etc stored in a faraday cage.

[joegoeny]

And you need a strong rural community to survive. One that has an active disciplined militia. An Emp protocal in place and ready to go into effect at a moments notice. Preppers on their own will not survive to isolated.

[joegoeny]

And you need a strong rural community to survive. One that has an active disciplined militia. An Emp protocal in place and ready to go into effect at a moments notice. Preppers on their own will not survive to isolated.

[Garth Tater]

If it doesn't have any electronic components in it your car will be fine. Even in more modern vehicles the electronics will probably survive though they might need to be reset.

EMP Effects on Vehicles

"Automobiles were subjected to EMP environments under both engine turned off and engine turned on conditions. No effects were subsequently observed in those automobiles that were not turned on during EMP exposure. The most serious effect observed on running automobiles was that the motors in three cars stopped at field strengths of approximately 30 kV/m or above. In an actual EMP exposure, these vehicles would glide to a stop and require the driver to restart them. Electronics in the dashboard of one automobile were damaged and required repair. Other effects were relatively minor. Twenty-five automobiles exhibited malfunctions that could be considered only a nuisance (e.g., blinking dashboard lights) and did not require driver intervention to correct. Eight of the 37 cars tested did not exhibit any anomalous response."

[Freedom56v2]

Agreed!