'We were at Dunkirk, too' say French furious at being written out of film epic

ibtimes.co.uk ^ | July 22, 2017 13:11 BST | Isabelle Gerretsen

[BenLurkin]

Around 30,000 French troops held back Nazi divisions near the city of Lille to protect their allies during the evacuation code-named Operation Dynamo.

Renowned French film critic Jacques Mandelbaum called Nolan "witheringly impolite" and slammed the director's "deplorable indifference" towards his country's contribution to the epic evacuation.

"Where in the film are the 120,000 French soldiers who were also evacuated from Dunkirk? Where are the 40,000 who sacrificed themselves to defend the city against a superior enemy in weaponry and numbers?" he asked in his review in French newspaper Le Monde.

[Snickering Hound]

The victory at El Alamain was more important than Stalingrad. Lose it and Rommel takes Alexandra and the Suez Canal and the oil fields of the middle east. From there they could take Persia and cut the main US Russian supply line and put there Bombers in range of the oil fields of Baku.

The Germans were out of tanks and out of gas by the time they got to El Alamein. It still took Montgomery months to clear them out. German losses in the battle were 1,100 killed, 3,900 wounded and 7,900 prisoners and Italian losses as 1,200 killed, 1,600 wounded and 20,000 prisoners.

Germans lost 400,000 at Stalingrad, Italians 114,000, Romanians 109,000, Hungarians 105,000.

A catastrophe like that isn't propaganda.

[Mollypitcher1]

You need to do a lot more research.

[dfwgator]

The Italians were the best “allies” we had. The Germans kept having to try fighting their battles. Because of the Italians getting routed in Greece and the Balkans, the Nazis had to bail them out there, which delayed Operation Barbarossa by a crucial six weeks.

[BradyLS]

At the start of the film, one of the English soldiers is shown running through a sandbagged position manned by French troops. Presumably part of the perimeter keeping the beaches open. Another soldier he soon encounters on the beach turns out to be a French soldier. It isn’t clear to whether the second soldier is a French deserter or not. He’s sussed out by a third (English) soldier who notes the second soldier never talks. At the end of the movie, after seeing off a British colonel, a British admiral says he’s staying behind to supervise the evacuation of the French.

So the French are represented and mentioned in the movie. But it isn’t obvious and you have to pay very close attention. If French watchers are unhappy about it, it’s understandable.

I didn’t know the film cost $150MM to make. Two or three ships and a Spitfire wallow or heel over on their sides in the movie and people are shown scrambling over them. I imagine a lot of money was tied up in those scenes.

Personally, I liked the movie. I think it’s worth seeing if you’re a WWII history buff. It’s not your standard war movie, however, at all. It’s a bit like the gritty realism of the first half-hour of Saving Private Ryan crossed with the story-telling technique of Syriana. It’s not ‘Heartbreak Ridge’ though there are some moments of heroism.

Apart from aircraft bombing, strafing, and dogfighting the Germans have no real presence in the movie. That is, they are portrayed in an impersonal, almost absent-minded way. I found that refreshing. Novel, at least.

For anyone wondering about the way the movie cuts back in forth—particularly if you haven’t seen it yet: the movie tells three disjointed stories that come together towards the very end. The story about the three soldiers on the beach takes place over the course of a week. The story about the three civilians in the small-craft fleet takes place over the course of a day. The story about the three RAF pilots takes place over the course of an hour. The movie notes this early on, but you have to pick up on it and remember.

[dfwgator]

Stalingrad was such a catastrophe, that after the surrender, Goebbels ordered all places of entertainment closed for three days. And then a few days later he gave his infamous, “Total War” speech.

[freedumb2003]

Add to that list:

The 21st Century Islamic Invasion of the France and the EU

Losing and will lose. In the next 20-30 years French culture, law and language will be swept away in favor of islam, sharia and arabic. "France" as it has been know historically will cease to exist. And at her own hand.

[Defiant]

LOL!

[wgmalabama]

Bookmark for later.

[DoodleBob]

American Lt Col Charles Stanton remembered the enormous contribution of French Marie Joseph Yves Roches Gilbert du Motier, who was better (and far more succinctly) known as the Marquis de Lafayette. Circa WWI, following a parade through Paris amidst the enthusiastic and welcoming embrace of the French, Pershing, Stanton, and the American troops arrived at the grave of the Marquis. Though the words are often incorrectly attributed to the better-known Pershing, it was Stanton who then said the ultimate return-the-favor quote:

“Nous voila, Lafayette (Lafayette, we are here!“)

Yes, France may be quite different from the US nowadays but so is the U.K. Further, I am not willing to trash an entire citizenry for the election of a less-than-stellar leader (witness America circa 2009-2016). Now, that does not mean we are eternally indebteded to France and must hold our tongue. Indeed, I consider a huge turning point in US-French relations to be when American bombers accidentally took out their embassy in Tripoli. But I have a feeling that Trump may help bring about a rightist swing in Franco politics.

If some French Person wrote out American activities in a WWII film, we'd be peeved. I'm ok with this commentary. Besides, French People can be funny.

[crazy scenario]

" His wife and two daughters spent the next three years indoors so they would not be raped by Nazis."

PURE Bovine replacement theology!!!

[Snickering Hound]

The Italians were the best “allies” we had. The Germans kept having to try fighting their battles. Because of the Italians getting routed in Greece and the Balkans, the Nazis had to bail them out there, which delayed Operation Barbarossa by a crucial six weeks.

The Italian army had out of date and worn out equipment.

Their navy mostly had to stay in port because their only fuel was what they could beg from the Germans who were short themselves.

Italian air force torpedo bombers had some spectacular success considering how small they were.

Late model Italian air force fighters were pretty but few in number and spare parts were always a problem.

[ExSES]

The 303rd Kosciuszko Squadron had the highest kill rate of any RAF Squadron.

My Brother's Father-in-Law flew in that squadron. After several kills he himself was shot down and lost a leg in the process. He completed the war with a wooden leg but was confined to Ground Ops (interestingly, a number of British pilots returned to flight duty with artificial legs!). He was a highly skilled machinist and immigrated to Canada soon after the war and then to Detroit later on, working for GM...

[PLMerite]

“Remake the movie using woman and minorities to portray the French.”

Charlene de Gaulle.
Maxine Weygand
Marine Gamelin

[dfwgator]

Patton was a Francophone who was fluent in French.

[dfwgator]

My Brother's Father-in-Law flew in that squadron. After several kills he himself was shot down and lost a leg in the process. He completed the war with a wooden leg but was confined to Ground Ops (interestingly, a number of British pilots returned to flight duty with artificial legs!). He was a highly skilled machinist and immigrated to Canada soon after the war and then to Detroit later on, working for GM..

God bless him. Shame that the Poles weren't rewarded for their contributions after the war.

[Mollypitcher1]

A tam effort as long as the Brits get the credit. But then of course during their advance towards the enemy, they always had to stop for their cuppa. Velly correct behavioh, doncha know!

[JohnyBoy]

>The Germans were out of tanks and out of gas by the time they got to El Alamein. It still took Montgomery months to clear them out. German losses in the battle were 1,100 killed, 3,900 wounded and 7,900 prisoners and Italian losses as 1,200 killed, 1,600 wounded and 20,000 prisoners.

They ran out of tanks attacking El Alamein, not before. El Alamein had port where the Italians could have landed fuel supplies if it had been captured and there was nothing to stop Rommel from rolling all the way to Ciro if he’d won.

>Germans lost 400,000 at Stalingrad, Italians 114,000, Romanians 109,000, Hungarians 105,000.

Russian losses where in excess of 1.1 million. Admittedly it was better than Russia’s normal losses of 3 to 1 against the Germans. The reason that Stalingrad wasn’t nearly as bad for Germany as Tunisian was the relative lack of tanks/guns/planes lost at Stalingrad. Most of the weapons lost were older ones.

Germany never had manpower problems but they had huge production problems because their socialist production system was awful. At Tunisian they lost tons of their newest and most powerful weapon systems and inflicted almost no damage to the allies. The troops captured at Tunisian were also some of the best troops in the German army. It was a much more devastating loss than Stalingrad.

[PLMerite]

[dfwgator]

I give Britain all the credit in the world for winning the Battle of Britain, when they stood alone. That was their big contribution.

[Mollypitcher1]

General Patton gave the French credit for enabling his successful advances in France and Eisenhower gave the French credit for the Allies successful invasion of Normandy. But of course Eisenhower and Patton didn’t know what they were talking about according to most on this board!!!