Mormons address mystery surrounding undergarments

I realize much of the national attention to the issue of LDS garments is as a result of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints issuing the press release, photos, and video.

Ah..

Press releases...

Ya gotta have 'em to clarify things...

Media Letter

26 June 2008 — Salt Lake City (http://newsroom.lds.org/additional-resource/media-letter)

*The following is a letter from Elder Lance B. Wickman, General Counsel of the Church to publishers of major newspapers, TV stations and magazines. It was sent out on Tuesday, June 24, 2008.

Recent events have focused the media spotlight on a polygamous sect near San Angelo, Texas, calling itself the “Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.” As you probably know, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has absolutely no affiliation with this polygamous sect. Decades ago, the founders of that sect rejected the doctrines of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, were excommunicated, and then started their own religion. To the best of our knowledge, no one at the Texas compound has ever been a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Unfortunately, however, some of the media coverage of the recent events in Texas has caused members of the public to confuse the doctrines and members of that group and our church. We have received numerous inquiries from confused members of the public who, by listening to less than careful media reports, have come to a grave misunderstanding about our respective doctrines and faith. Based on these media reports many have erroneously concluded that there is some affiliation between the two – or even worse, that they are one and the same.

Over the years, in a careful effort to distinguish itself, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has gone to significant lengths to protect its rights in the name of the church and related matters. Specifically, we have obtained registrations for the name “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints,” “Mormon,” “Book of Mormon” and related trade and service marks from the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office and corresponding agencies in a significant number of foreign countries.

We are confident that you are committed to avoiding misleading statements that cause unwarranted confusion and that may disparage or infringe the intellectual property rights discussed above. Accordingly, we respectfully request the following:

As reflected in the AP Style Guide, we ask that you and your organization refrain from referring to members of that polygamous sect as “fundamentalist Mormons” or “fundamentalist” members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
We ask that, when reporting about this Texas-based polygamous sect or any other polygamous group, you avoid either explicitly or implicitly any inference that these groups are affiliated with The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
On those occasions when it may be necessary in your reporting to refer to the historical practice of plural marriage in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, that you make very clear that the Church does not condone the practice of polygamy and that it has been forbidden in the Church for over one hundred years. Moreover, we absolutely condemn arranged or forced “marriages” of underage girls to anyone under any circumstances.

Stated simply, we would like to be known and recognized for whom we are and what we believe, and not be inaccurately associated with beliefs and practices that we condemn in the strongest terms. We would be grateful if you could circulate or copy this letter to your editorial staff and to your legal counsel.

We thank you for your consideration of these important matters.

Sincerely,

Lance B. Wickman

General Counsel

101 posted on 10/24/2014 1:23:26 PM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

Can that be enough, please?

102 posted on 10/24/2014 2:18:54 PM PDT by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred.)

I do believe my dear wife follows this passage;

D&C Section 49, verses 18-19 read; “And whoso forbiddeth to abstain from meats, that man should not eat the same, is not ordained of God.

For, behold, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and that which cometh of the earth, is ordained for the use of man for food and for raiment, and that he might have in abundance.”

...but not this one...

D&C 89, verses 12 and 13 read; “Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.”

It’s just all so confusing and conflicting...

103 posted on 10/24/2014 6:41:24 PM PDT by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political parties in the long run gave away our liberty.)

It’s just all so confusing and conflicting...

Evidently not to her.

Can she explain this paradox?

Proverbs 26:4-5

Do not answer a fool according to his folly,
or you yourself will be just like him.

Answer a fool according to his folly,
or he will be wise in his own eyes.

104 posted on 10/25/2014 5:14:37 AM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

To: elcid1970; Elsie; All

It’s not even sunrise, and your post is starting my day with an “Oh, SHIZ!!” moment. I clutch my coffee mug for comfort. We’ve joked about Mormon fantasticalisms for years, but it’s not funny anymore: how do so many intelligent people believe this concocted poppycock!!? The 19th century was chock full of pied pipers & charlatans & snake oil salesmen, but it seems that Joseph Smith alone has maintained his horde of deluded followers, modern DNA & archaeological methods notwithstanding. A North American empire of white & delightsome blond Hebrews wiped out by dark skinned Jewish Indians without a trace left behind.....it boggles the (non-Mormon) mind.

Ironically...Laughingly...yet quite sad.

105 posted on 10/27/2014 7:59:51 AM PDT by Colofornian

To: JAKraig; SkyDancer; greyfoxx39; Elsie; All

I'm married to a Mormon who wears the garments, they're underwear period. The underwear is rather plain and if it weren't for the little symbols sewn onto them you could buy them at any store that sells undergarments. They have sacred symbols on them to remind them of the promises they made to God. They are a protection to them in the same way that people who are true to their faith are protected by God. Only cynical, Non-Mormons call them “Magic Underwear”.

Eleven years ago this month, the Lds Church published in its Ensign magazine an article by Elder David E. Sorensen which included this comment from Sorensen, representing the official Mormon church:

"...The garment, … when properly worn, will serve as a protection against temptation and evil."

And, uncanningly, four years ago YESTERDAY, I asked the following question on a FR thread about Mormon underwear:

"Why is it @ Mormon testimony meetings we don't hear testimonies about how somebody's temple garment (Underwear) saved them from temptation and evil? Anybody know of such a testimony?

The Doctrine of Temple Work (Mormonism - Open) (post #16) ALL: I recommend you check out that entire thread...381 responses...

106 posted on 10/27/2014 8:09:09 AM PDT by Colofornian

To: SkyDancer; JAKraig; Elsie; All

They say that underwear is supposed to protect them from harm

In my last post, I noted how the Mormon Church official publication, Ensign, in its October 2003 edition said:

"...The garment, … when properly worn, will serve as a protection against temptation and evil."

Note in that article, there failed to be any commentary whatsoever as to how that was to be accomplished. They didn't say, "it will serve as a reminder of your covenants" or any other description.

IoW, Mormon leaders have implied thru the years how the process is almost like spiritual osmosis...

And yet what do we have Mormon leadership saying now?

"The video notes that there is nothing magical or mystical about them"
Mormons explain their sacred undergarments

107 posted on 10/27/2014 8:21:23 AM PDT by Colofornian

“Why is it @ Mormon testimony meetings we don't hear testimonies about how somebody’s temple garment (Underwear) saved them from temptation and evil? Anybody know of such a testimony?

__________________________________________________________

First you would have to go to a Mormon Testimony meeting to hear such a claim. there are over 30000 Testimony meetings each month, you would have to go to a lot of meetings to hear them all. But, taking my tongue out of my cheek, you don't hear them because when the garment is properly worn, and that has nothing to do with the garment but the qualifications for it, you don't approach evil. Mormons die in car wrecks, get murdered, have their houses broken into just like everybody else, but, I do suspect they rob banks less frequently or commit adultery less frequently than the general population, at least I suspect this is so for people properly wearing the garment.

108 posted on 10/27/2014 8:55:32 AM PDT by JAKraig (Surely my religion is at least as good as yours)

To: Colofornian; ejonesie22

...Elder David E. Sorensen which included this comment from Sorensen, representing the official Mormon church:

Where can we find an 'OFFICIAL MORMON' teaching website??

Official sites are sites supported by LDS officials unless said official sites are considered unofficial by said officials.

At that point such sites are unofficial unless officially referenced for official purposes by officials who can do so officially.

This should not be misconstrued as an indication that official sites can be unofficially recognized as official nor should it be implied that unofficial sites cannot contain official information, but are not officially allowed to be offical despite their official contents due the their unofficialness.

Official sites will be official and recognized as official by officials of the LDS unless there is an official reason to mark them as unofficial either temporally or permanently, which would make the official content officially unofficial.

This is also not to imply that recognized sites, often used on FR by haters and bigots cannot contain official information, it just means that content, despite its official status, is no longer official and should be consider unofficial despite the same information being official on an official site elsewhere.

Even then the officialness my be amended due to the use of the unofficial information which may determine the officialness of anything be it official or unofficial depending on how and where it is used officially or unofficially.

I hope this clear things up for the lurkers out there.

The haters tend to make things complicated and confusing when it is all really quite crystal clear.

--Ejonesie22

109 posted on 10/27/2014 9:01:34 AM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

To: JAKraig; Utah Binger

...because when the garment is properly worn, ...

Is there a little instruction booklet that comes with each newly purchased garment?

Similar to the Missionaries Handbook? (Which; strangely enough; does NOT mention any GARMENT...)

The Rules

Learn and obey all missionary rules.
Keep your thoughts, words, and actions in harmony with the gospel message.
Read only books, magazines, and other material authorized by the Church.
Don't debate or argue.
Center your mind on your mission.
Dress conservatively. Elders: white shirts, conservative ties, and business suits. Sisters: conservative colors and skirts that cover your knees. No floor-length skirts or dresses.
Cut your hair regularly.
Keep your hair clean and neatly combed at all times in the approved style.
Be neat and clean.
Bathe frequently.
Use deodorant.
Polish your shoes.
Iron your shirt and business suit.
Arise at 6:30 A.M.
Study for 2 hours every morning.
Proselytize for 10 hours between 9:30 A.M. and 9:30 P.M.
Turn off your lights at 10:30 P.M.
Exercise regularly.
Write in your journal regularly.
Follow the "Missionary Gospel Study Program" (31157) for your personal study.
Regularly study the Missionary Guide and the Discussions.
Attend Sunday priesthood or Relief Society meetings, Sunday School, and sacrament meeting.
Attend the general session of Stake Conference.
Attend general conference broadcasts if available.
Avoid all other church meetings unless you have a special assignment or are brining an investigator.
Proselytize as much as possible on weekends and holidays because this is when you'll find people home.
End your preparation day at 6:00 P.M. and proselytize from 6:00 P.M. to 9:30 P.M.
Wear your missionary uniform in public on preparation day while not engaged in recreational activities.
Arise at 6:30 on preparation day and study for 2 hours from the approved books.
Take care of your physical preparation for the week on preparation day: wash your clothes, clean your apartment, wash your car, get your haircut, and shop for groceries.
Write to your parents every week on preparation day.
Write less frequently to your siblings, friends, and acquaintances.
Don't communicate with any friends or acquaintances that are within or close to your mission boundaries, except as a part of official mission business.
Plan safe, wholesome, and uplifting activities for preparation day.
Stay with your companion during all activities.
Do not go on road trips.
Do not leave your assigned area without permission
Do not watch television.
Do not view unauthorized videocassettes.
Do not listen to the radio.
Do not listen to unauthorized audiocassettes or CD’s.
Do not participate in musical groups.
Do not participate in athletic teams.
Do not sponsor athletic teams.
Do not engage in contact sports.
Do not engage in water sports.
Do not engage in winter sports.
Do not engage in motorcycling.
Do not engage in horseback riding.
Do not engage in mountain climbing.
Do not embark on a private boat.
Do not embark in a private airplane.
Do not handle firearms.
Do not handle explosives.
Do not swim.
Do not play full court basketball.
Do not play basketball in leagues.
Do not play basketball in tournaments.
You may play half-court basketball.
Never be alone.
Seek advice from your mission president if your companion is "having difficulties".
Be loyal to your companion.
Ask your mission president for help if your companion doesn’t obey the rules.
Pray with your companion every day.
Study with your companion every day.
Plan your work with your companion every day.
Take time at least once a week for companionship inventory.
Seek to be one in spirit and purpose and help each other succeed.
Always address your companion as Elder or Sister.
Sleep in the same bedroom as your companion.
Do not sleep in the same bed as your companion.
Do not arise before your companion.
Do not retire after your companion. (apparently, being together is more important than getting the correct amount of sleep that your unique body requires.)
Frequently study with your companion the Missionary Guide section on companions.
Never be alone with anyone of the opposite sex.
Never associate inappropriately with anyone of the opposite sex (conversely, they don't mention whether or not it is against the rules to associate inappropriately with anyone of the same sex).
Do not flirt.
Do not date.
Do not communicate via phone or letter with anyone of the opposite sex living within or near mission boundaries.
Do not visit a single or divorced person of the opposite sex unless accompanied by a couple or another adult member of your sex.
Try to teach single investigators in a member’s home or have missionaries of the same sex teach them.
Always follow the above rules, even if the situation seems harmless.
Use the commitment pattern to get referrals from members.
Keep your dinner visits with member briefs and during the customary dinner hour in the area.
Remember to say thank you to those who feed you.
Visit members and nonmembers only at appropriate times.
Do not counsel or give medical treatment.
Do not stay in the homes of people when they are on vacation.
Only write letters to family members and friends at home.
Do not telephone parents
Do not telephone relatives.
Do not telephone friends.
Do not telephone girlfriends.
Contact your mission president in case of an emergency.
Take problems and questions to your mission president.
Do not write to the President of the Church or to other General Authorities. Letters from missionaries to General Authorities are referred back to the mission president
Respect the customs, traditions, and property of the people who you are trying to convert.
Obey all mission rules.
Obey the laws of the land.
Do not get involved in politics.
Do not get involved in commercial activities.
Do not give any information about the area.
Respect the customs and cultures of those who you are trying to convert to your own customs and culture.
Respect the beliefs, practices, and sites of other religions.
Do not say or write anything bad about the political and cultural circumstances where you serve.
Do not become involved in adoption proceedings.
Do not suggest or encourage emigration. (This rule is a bit ironic, given the now-defunct doctrine of gathering the believers to Zion)
Be courteous.
Provide community service.
Do not provide community service that isn’t approved by your mission president.
Do not provide more than 4 hours a week of community service.
Do not provide community service during the evening, weekend or holidays—those are peek proselytizing times.
Your mission president must approve your housing.
Keep your housing unit clean.
Do not live with single or divorced people of the opposite sex.
Do not live where the spouse is frequently absent.
Your living unit must have a private bath and entrance.
You may occasionally fast for a special reason, but generally the monthly fast is sufficient.
Do not fast longer than 24 hours at a time.
Do not ask friends, relatives, and members to join in special fasts for investigators.
Maintain your health.
Eat a healthy diet.
Sleep from 10:30 to 6:30.
Follow the approved exercise program.
Keep your body, clothes, dishes, linens, towels and housing unit clean.
Dispose of your garbage properly and promptly.
Follow the safety rules for all of your stuff.
Seek medical care if you are in an accident or become sick.
Be immunized.
Spend your money only on things relating to your mission.
Budget your money carefully.
Keep a record of what you spend.
Do not spend more than your companion.
Do not loan money.
Do not borrow money.
Keep a reserve fund of $50 to $100 at all times for transfers.
Pay your bills before leaving an area.
Pay cash for all resale literature and supplies ordered from the mission office.
Do not waste money on souvenirs.
Do not waste money on unnecessary items.
Be a frugal photographer.
Do not accumulate excess baggage.
Obey custom laws and regulations.
Pay fast offerings each fast Sunday to the bishop or branch president where you serve.
Pay tithing on outside sources of income (i.e. interest) to your home bishop or branch president.
Evaluate your funds a few months before the end of your mission. If you have more than you need, ask that less be sent so that you can return home without excess money.
Do not drive without a license.
Drive only Church-owned vehicles.
Do not drive members’ cars.
Do not drive nonmembers’ cars.
Do not give rides to members or investigators in Church-owned cars.
Use cars only on approved mission business.
Use cars only within the assigned geographical area.
Be conscious of safety at all times.
Drive defensively.
Wear your seat belt.
Pray for the Lord’s protection while driving.
If your companion is driving, assist him or her.
Do not tamper with the vehicle’s odometer.
Know bicycle safety rules.
Use extreme caution on your bicycle.
Do not ride your bicycle after dark.
Do not ride your bicycle in heavy traffic.
Do not ride your bicycle in adverse weather conditions.
Go directly to your new area when transferred.
Find your new companion without delay when transferred.
Have a maximum of two suitcases and a briefcase.

110 posted on 10/27/2014 9:04:57 AM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

111 posted on 10/27/2014 9:11:28 AM PDT by Daffynition ("We Are Not Descended From Fearful Men")

.. but, I do suspect they rob banks less frequently or commit adultery less frequently than the general population,...

Suspect no MORE!

I'm quite sure there is data available about the visitors to THIS fine institution; located in an area that is 57% Mormon; that will satisfy even the most picky of information gatherers...

http://mormonmatters.org/2009/09/16/what-mormon-prisoners-want/

112 posted on 10/27/2014 9:14:18 AM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

I’m going out halloweening in them as the Holy Ghost.

113 posted on 10/27/2014 10:46:43 AM PDT by Utah Binger (Southern Utah where the world comes to see America)

You show a 57% Mormon population in an over 60% Mormon population state, but how many of those are temple Mormons? What is the population of Mormons in the prison? What is the population of active Mormons in the prison? What is the percentage of temple Mormons in the prison? Nearly 0% I suspect. In looking through suits to the Federal Government by Mormons in prison I have not seen one that requested permission to wear garments.

The truth is there are not really very many Mormons in prison. When a Mormon is convicted of a felony they have a court or disciplinary council as they call it and are normally excommunicated. When they have served all their time and have no more obligations to the state/Fed and generally 12 months after that they can petition The Church for re-baptism and become a Mormon again.

This is not a problem for inactive Mormons they probably didn’t want home teachers coming to bother them anyway but for a person who simply had a lapse in judgment it would be excruciating. To an active Mormon, church and ordinances of the church are a very big part of their lives.

114 posted on 10/27/2014 11:39:55 AM PDT by JAKraig (Surely my religion is at least as good as yours)

What do missionary rules have to do with garments?

The rule book is the Temple Recommend questions, it is the only handbook needed.

If you can answer them properly then you can wear the garment properly.

My wife has never talked about rules of wear except that clothes should cover them. I don’t think that is a problem for most people, my clothes cover my underwear.

115 posted on 10/27/2014 11:44:41 AM PDT by JAKraig (Surely my religion is at least as good as yours)

Nearly 0% I suspect.

Still suspecting?

116 posted on 10/27/2014 8:21:07 PM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

You show a 57% Mormon population in an over 60% Mormon population state, but how many of those are temple Mormons?

OOoooh!

The percent has gone UP since the last time I checked?

117 posted on 10/27/2014 8:29:59 PM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

The truth is there are not really very many Mormons in prison.

Heck; there's not many Mormons that can enter a Mormon temple; either!

15% is the last amount I am aware of.

118 posted on 10/27/2014 8:31:18 PM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

My wife has never talked about rules of wear except that clothes should cover them.

Does she have a TR?

119 posted on 10/27/2014 8:32:09 PM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)

My wife has never talked about rules of wear except that clothes should cover them.
Does she have a TR?
______________________________________________________

If TR means Temple Recommend, yes she has one and has for decades. She had it before I ever met her.

120 posted on 10/28/2014 5:33:54 AM PDT by JAKraig (Surely my religion is at least as good as yours)

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