Posted on 10/19/2012 2:14:49 PM PDT by Volunteer
I was fired from my job today after 5 years. They have offered me a 5 month severance package, the catch is I have to sign some agreement that I can't understand.
They explained they would not pay me my monthly salary this month or my 207 hours of vacation unless I sign the agreement.
Can any one out there give me some advice as to what I should do? I am in Wisconsin and I know nothing about Employment Law here.
Any suggestions would be very helpful and very appreciated.
Well, I can tell you right off the bat that they cannot refuse to pay you for your vacation. That would be a violation of Federal law, and you would be able to sue them for treble damages, I believe.
As far as the severance package, that they can make contingent on signing the agreement, since they are under no obligation to give you a severance package at all. But I would recommend you find a labor attorney to review the agreement first - you may be signing away some rights that you don’t even know you have.
Repeating what so many others have said, please DON’T sign the agreement unless you understand it.
Years ago, I signed for an agreement to receive severance pay, which prevented me from getting unemployment benefits because I the agreement stipulated that I had quit rather than being fired. (I was in a different state...laws may be different in your state.) The company offered me the agreement because paying me severance was a lot cheaper than the increase to the company’s unemployment insurance would have been. Based on the HR person’s comments, it sounds like you would be agreeing that you quit if you sign this agreement. What are your chances of getting another decent-paying job before the 5 months of severance pay are spent? Will a bad reference from this employer (if you refuse the agreement) make it harder for you to find a new job? On the other hand, can you rely on this employer to give you a good reference if you sign this agreement?
Non-competition clauses can also be a real problem, especially if your job and skill set are specialized. They can make it all but impossible to get another job in your field.
Most severance agreements have clauses stipulating that you won’t sue over certain things. Those “hold harmless” provisions might be fair and reasonable. Or, they might be the employer trying to cover his behind because there’s something you might have grounds to sue for - age or disability discrimination?
Last, I don’t see how the employer can legally withhold your last month’s pay if you don’t sign. If you worked that month, you earned the pay. Accrued vacation time may be trickier to claim, depending on what kind of employment agreement you signed (if any).
I am not a fan of running to lawyers with every little thing (people sue too much over trivial things), but this sounds like a time when a lawyer can keep you from making a costly mistake. A few hours of a lawyer’s time to review the agreement, and maybe having him write a letter or help you negotiate better terms is a lot cheaper than losing out on unemployment benefits or finding yourself all but shut out of your field.
Good luck!
LOL! That was pretty interesting to read as a lawyer who just spent half an hour composing a post with no possibility of getting anything in return other than the satisfaction of trying to help someone in need.
As a matter of fact, they have to pay you for all monies owed (salary, accrued vacation, etc) at the time they fire you, unless you are fired for some infraction that requires immediate dismissal - then they have to pay you within 3 business days. If they don’t, you have legal recourse.
A man with a PHD can’t figure out what has happened?
“Since I know the owner very well and truly do not trust the guy, I know I am going to have to get an attorney.”
“Be careful with the attorney. He could end up with the money, you get a bad deal and nothing to show for it. Have you done a good thourough search for this on the net? I’ll bet there are a lot of people who have faced this.”
I agree. I for one think getting lawyers involved is almost a guaranteed lose/lose, unless the employer did something illegal.
Volunteer, you are being fired for ‘performance’ but they offer 5 months salary?
Unless you worked there 30 years, that is quite generous. As an at-will employee, they could have made it 2 weeks. I know a gut who got just one month. Those packages are for those who get laid off.
You should really figure out “Can I get a new job within 6 months?” If you can ... YOU COME OUT AHEAD.
And now you say you dont trust the boss?!? Come on, this is a gift man, you just got out of working for a guy you dont trust and he’s paying you NOT to work for 5 months.
Millions have faced this. I faced it. (laid off, NOT for performance). Millions sleep on it and after a few days, checking it out, realize this is their best bet: Take the money and run to your next job.
I went right to the unemployment office for the info I needed.
I actually live in Green Bay, WI. My area is Behavior Analysis and I work with people who have Developmental Disabilities and Mental Illness.
Until today, I worked for a small company that provided residential services to these folks.
That is an assumption, we don’t know the background on this agreement.
It may or may not be boiler plate stuff.
Don’t be embarrassed. A LOT of us have been there. Well, okay, it was a little embarrassing at first, but it helped that our entire building was laid off.
I am now an official statistic, if that helps (probably not)....under employed. It was either everyone took an hours hit or someone would have to go.
Went from full time to not so full time. 3-4 hours a week makes a huge difference. We’re still hanging on by a thread.
Whatever you do, don’t sign the statement if it says you are resigning. That will disqualify you for unemployment—at least in Texas and Louisiana it would.
I'll be happy to take your case at only $25 per hour. While I'm not really an attorney, I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
So, here's my first hour of advice to you, file for unemployment..........
I'll send you my address via private FReepmail and you can send me the check. Thank you, it's been a pleasure handling your case.
If by chance your employer renegs on his statement and protests your claim for U.I., please feel free to contact me again and I will advise you on what to do next.........
I've been on both sides of this equation and in NYS, at least, one cannot be fired for 'performance' unless the employer has met at leasttwo standards...
1) A record of your poor performance and the employer's efforts to correct it or at the ;east warn you about it must preceed any dismissal.
2) Every other employee of the company with the same job must also be shown to meet the standard that you failed to or else be fired too.
Absent these two conditions NYS Dept. of Labor will represent the employee in a wrongful discharge suit (as long as the employee is not a 'manager').
If they have either sat you down to discuss the performance issue prior to this and/or notified you in writing that your performance is an issue then there is little (probably nothing) you can do except take the money and wave good-bye.
sign it & cash the check.
The agreement isn’t legally binding.
If you have some legal claim regarding the basis for your departure, a lawyer, competent in the field, will tell you whether you have a case.
I’ve been through a variety of business cycles over 40 years and have watched layed off, older workers prevail, in spite of signing such agreements.
Funny you mention that. I've been on the "firing line" for doing the same thing. Although the 2 witches involved did get her fired. This happened a few years ago and they are still trying to get me fired.
First off, are you a union member?
Sign it. It’s under duress and could be walked back as such.
Wrong. First off, employers don't "pay" unemployment to former employees. UE insurance is paid to the state, which we submit as a percentage of our total payroll for the quarter. For my business, in AR, I pay 4% of my total payroll in UE premiums to the state. The percentages are different for every employer, but that is a long and complicated discussion if I were to break it down. A five month severance off is generous. It is as long as any possible unemployment benefit that could be obtained from the state. UE will only payout a percentage of an individual's salary (60 to 80), the severance package is 100% of the salary. It's a better offer. Plus, they are agreeing to pay the 207 hours of vacation time, which NO employer needs to do when they let an employee go - contrary to what most people believe. Their offer is generous.
Move to a right to work state.
Forget Wisconsin em[loyment law...they have violated FEDERAL labor law. But five months severance instead of pay for 200 hours of vacation and last month’s wages??? I say you are about three months ahead of the game... BUT read the package carefully. Have a lawyer look at it (to protect you). They may be asking you to sign away some of your rights to things like unemploymen insurance pay etc).
I know folks dont like to go to lawyers but this would be a good time to do so
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