Posted on 04/26/2010 6:26:23 PM PDT by Artemis Webb
"What is the big deal about Bob Dylan?" Julia Schrenkler wondered on Gather.com three years ago. Well, according to fellow folkie Joni Mitchell, he's a plagiarizing fraud.
"Bob is not authentic at all," Mitchell tells the Los Angeles Times. "He's a plagiarist, and his name and voice are fake. Everything about Bob is a deception. We are like night and day, he and I."
True, Dylan's name is a "fake" -- he was born Robert ... um, Zimmerman -- but he'd have to be some kind of crazy to invent a voice like his current subterranean croak. Let's assume she's talking about his Woody Guthrie-isms of the '60s, just to be on the safe side.
But Mitchell (birth name: Roberta Joan Anderson, btw) doesn't restrict her remarks to male performers of her generation, letting us know that "Grace [Slick] and Janis Joplin were [sleeping with] their whole bands and falling down drunk."
Well, yes, but what of the Canadian-born Mitchell's own work? Time for a little self-examination, perhaps?
"My work is set against the stupid, destructive way we live on this planet," she announces. "Americans have decided to be stupid and shallow since 1980. Madonna is like Nero; she marks the turning point."
Ladies and gentlemen, Joni Mitchell: Special Ranting 2010 Edition. Approach her at your own risk...
(Excerpt) Read more at knittingcrochet.gather.com ...
Or Stephen Foster, W.C. Handy, Scott Joplin, George M. Cohen, George & Ira Gershwin, Hoagy Carmichael, Aaron Copland, Miles Davis, Erroll Garner, Duke Ellington, Cole Porter, Irving Berlin, Glenn Miller, Lerner & Loewe, Rodgers & Hammerstein etc etc—all writers, composers, or performers of authentic “American” music.
And Bob would not look out of place in the least on that list. And Bob is the only still actually making music, although, unless you count hard living, that is through no fault of any on your list. And the original post did say making authentic American music.
He’s got plenty of simple songs too. Ones covered by Elvis, the Ramones, Neil Young, Norah Jones, George Harrison, Rod Stewart, Van Morrison, Nina Simone, Sam Cooke, Johnny Cash, Pearl Jam, The Band, PJ Harvey, The Byrds, Emmylou Harris, Hendrix, Cassandra Wilson, Cheryl Crow, Bette Midler, the Stones, the Grateful Dead, Guns and Roses, The Pretenders, Ben Sidran, Brian Ferry, etc etc etc etc
Joni Mitchell can write this kind of tripe but she says Bob Dylan is a fraud!?
In that case, you'll probably enjoy all of her stuff from the 60's and 70's.
I also agree on Madonna being a modern day Nero. I was influenced by Joni’s guitar work, her lyrics and her phrasing in song but I was first influenced by Dylan and Judy Collins.
I have never paid any heed to her politics or her hatred of my Church. She’s an artist and as I come from a family of them I recognize the wackiness for what it is...she’s nuts. The media isn’t helping her sell any paintings as she isn’t wacky or talented enough, she’s only in it to feed her ego. She could have learned much from Leonard Cohen.
I don't care if they're simple or highly profound. A song has to sound good for me to like it. And only a rare few of his do, and just barely at that. As for his 'genius', I doubt even he could give an intelligent explanation of what his songs were about. If you asked him on different days, he'd probably give you a different answer each time.
I’m not a Bob Dylan fan in any way, shape, or form. However, Joni Mitchell? Seriously???
No, a song is either good or it isn’t. Judged by many people over the course of time. Whether you like the melody or the lyrics or the singing is purely personal. Some folks think Sinatra was the greatest singer of last century. I don’t necessarily agree, but I know this: In 50 years time people will still be relishing Sinatra music. And in 50 years, 100 years time, people will still be recording Dylan songs and buying his music. And I imagine there are songs duylan has forgetten to as to why he wrote it.
But he didn’t forget why he wrote his classic “It Ain’t me Babe”. He was giving the finger to the protest movement.
He didn’t forget why he wrote the classic “Forever Young” which he wrote for his children.
He didn’t forget why he wrote the classic “Blind Willie McTell” about the bues singer Bling Willie McTell
He didn’t forget why he wrote the classics “Sad Eyed Lady of the lowlands” or “Sara” or “You’re big Girl all the Way” for his wife/then wife.
And he didn’t forget why he wrote the most Pro-Israel, anti-terrorist song I’ve ever heard, “Neighborhood Bully”.
It goes on and on over for the last 49 years.
One of the greatest love songs ever.
Somewhere a elevator is missing it’s music ........
Could be for good reason. What the songs mean to him doesn’t have to be what they mean to anyone else. And in the time since he first wrote the songs what they mean to him could have changed as well. He really hit his stride, in my book anyway, 45 years ago. Anyone could look back and find new meaning in those songs even the guy who wrote them. Why would he want to limit the possible meanings from someone by saying definitely, this is what the song is about, this was the inspiration? Obviously he connects with a lot of people, and they take meaning from what he has to say either in his more direct songs or his more abstract songs. You may not appreciate the genius it takes to do that, and to do it over the course of 34 studio albums, but it does take it.
Joni has become bitter with age. She’s a freaking grouch.
I noticed this a few years ago in another interview. In that one she said she was sick of music.
Then he starts talking about his Dylan collection. What a day.
IMO, Dylan is to music what Picasso is to art. Open to an infinite number of interpretations while on the surface often ugly. Yet both are described as ‘geniuses’.
Picasso, btw, was part of the Soviet plan for screwing up American culture with meaningless garbage replacing traditional art.
lol ............. it sounds like that.
I noticed this a few years ago in another interview. In that one she said she was sick of music.
She's spiritually sick. No question about it. A musician of her caliber doesn't say something like that unless they've hit rock bottom as a being.
That's really sad to hear. She was once a valuable contributor to the culture.
Love the subtitles on the first one.
Bob Dylan - It's All Over Now, Baby Blue #3 from DM (1965)
Joni Mitchell crafts meaningless words and phrases into meaningless songs.
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