Posted on 08/02/2008 8:44:19 AM PDT by Soliton
don't remember when I first learned about the theory of evolution, but nowadays I find myself reading of it a great deal in the popular press and hearing it discussed in the media. As my daughter enters elementary school, I find myself anxious to discuss with her teachers what they will cover in science class and where in their curriculum they plan to teach evolution. OUR COUNTRY HAS LAWS THAT SEPARATE church and state. Public institutions like schools must be neutral on the subject of religion, as required by the Constitution's First Amendment. Our courts have mandated that creationism is not an appropriate addition to the science curriculum in public schools; yet supporters of intelligent design press to have antievolutionary discussions enter the science classroom. Creationists even advocate that, when leaching evolution, educators should add the disclaimer that it is "just a theory."
Let's consider why all of us as educated persons, scientists and nonseientists alike, should take note of what science is taught - and not taught - in our public schools. In common language, a theory is a guess of sorts. However, in scientific language, a theory is "a set of universal statements that explain some aspect of the natural world... formulated and tested on the basis of evidence, internal consistency, and their explanatory power."1 The theory of evolution meets all of these criteria.
(Excerpt) Read more at redorbit.com ...
I do not know, I’ve only scanned the koko/allball stuff and haven’t driven down deep on it. But if there is any hint of such awareness, it would prove to be a starting point to this discussion. That’s good science, right?
OUR COUNTRY HAS LAWS THAT SEPARATE church and state.
That one, guess I need to proof read before I post away.
The microevolution/ macroevolution dichotomy is a creationist talking point. There is every reason to believe that evolution is a continuum driven by natural selection.
If you're talking about ASBE, then Genome comparisons do not prove to millions of people that evolution is true, because they haven't seen the data themselves - they still have to have faith in people about things they've never seen - and that's faith not science.
The average IQ is 100 (by definition). Most people are too dumb to understand or care about science. You and I have a different concept of faith.
Furthermore, common DNA sequences could just as well be from a common designer!
Anything that evolution does can be and often is attributed to a designer. Unfortunately, no one has ever produced any evidence of a designer. If they had every scientist would be an ID proponent. Design is a discipline. Godd design has earmarks. A perfect designer would not have to make the complicated half-assed biological compromises we see in nature. A perfect design is always elegantly simple with no wasted steps. The study of genomes shows lots of mistakes, steps forward and back. They show trial and error type of evolution exactly as predicted by Darwin.
Cultures reward compliant behavior and punish noncompliant behavior. Killing is mostly injurious to the social contract, so cultures have evolved to view most killing as evil.
It is true and you can apply the same formula to all of the ten commandments. Even in the muzzie countries murder is against the law. Cultural laws always have exceptions. Most Christian conservatives are for the death penalty for example.
Believe what you want, but don't call it science. Words have meaning. I never said I wasn't into preaching. I'm preaching science.
I’ve added you to my do not respond list since you only want to spout of about privatizing schools. Start your own threads.
No AGW is a socialist Trojan horse masquerading as science for the purpose of furthering a political agenda in the same way that "Intelligent Design is a Trojan horse designed to further a religious one. Scientists must fight and are fighting liars for communism and liars for God.
I dated an EE, FUN GUY! I am hoping to pick some Geologist’s brain about meteor craters at some point. My interest in bible study is the main reason I became interested in science.
“devoid of any concept of God”
According to the bible, this is not possible. Every (hu)man is given a measure of faith. This is the “God shaped void” of non-believers.
“AGW is a socialist Trojan horse”
amen, brother. Y’all check out ICECAP.US for anti-AGW info. Swamps and volcanoes are worse than humans. (except maybe Al Gore)
The ruse of those who would argue religion can not be discussed or even mentioned in public discourse are too nescient of the basic tenant and general history.
Willfull ignorance is no excuse to not realise the intent of the admendment. By holding an arrogant silly fear they destroy one of the most cherished precepts the human soul could ever adorn.
It says nothing about keeping religion out of the state.
That would be pretty incongruous in light of this:
"When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
don't remember when I first learned about the theory of evolution, but nowadays I find myself reading of it a great deal in the popular press and hearing it discussed in the media.
I wonder if this gal was born yesterday. With regard to government schools evolution has been a hot bed of community conflict since before the 1930s. (Scopes Trial). Funny, but we never hear about these curriculum cat fights in private schools.
As my daughter enters elementary school, I find myself anxious to discuss with her teachers what they will cover in science class and where in their curriculum they plan to teach evolution.
She will quickly find that most government teachers are not bright enough or sufficiently educated to understand or grasp anything but the broadest outline of evolution. Government teachers have the lowest SATs and GREs on campus. Few teachers have taken anything more than Algebra for arts majors or anything other than the most minimal science for arts majors.
OUR COUNTRY HAS LAWS THAT SEPARATE church and state.
WRONG! WHAT A FOOL!
I am wondering about this gal's education. I bet she considers herself educated. Separation of church and state can not be found in our nation's founding documents.
There is a prohibition against government **establishment** of religion.
Our First Amendment also states that we have a right to freely express our religious belief. That is generally ignored by the evolutionists and liberal/Marxists who support compulsory, police threat, godless, government indoctrination.
Compulsory, police enforced, government schools FORBID free expression of religion for nearly all of the compulsory, police threat day! Compulsory, police threat, government schools also FORBID free association, free speech, and free press. Government schools also subject children to a godless religious philosophy nearly every minute of every compulsory, police threat day!
Public institutions like schools must be neutral on the subject of religion, as required by the Constitution's First Amendment.
It is IMPOSSIBLE for education to be religious neutral. It is axiomatic. ( Gee! I bet this gal thinks she is educated.)
The government **must** choose between teaching from a godless worldview or a God-centered one. NEITHER is religiously neutral in content or consequences!
Our courts have mandated that creationism is not an appropriate addition to the science curriculum in public schools;
Courts are not always right. And....As far as I know evolution in the government schools has never been considered by the Supreme Court. Also....When it comes to compulsory, police enforced, government schools, the courts have always rule narrowly and have never ( to my knowledge) considered that education can never be religiously neutral.
yet supporters of intelligent design press to have antievolutionary discussions enter the science classroom.
I bet if the anti evolutionists were given a complete and total lifetime refund for the money paid for government schools they would stop pressing. Also,...If the money now allocated to the atheistic government schools were directed to their children in the form of tax credits and vouchers they would stop pressing.
Also,...This stupid, ill-educated gal probably doesn't realize that there are HUNDREDS of issues that community groups war over in the government schools. Why? Because the government must make a binary decision on hundreds of religious non-neutral issues. No matter what the police threat government schools decide one side's religious worldview will win and the other will lose.
Mabybe those with God-centered worldviews press for their side because they are under police threat to pay for the godless government schools and would like their worldview given time and recognition.
Creationists even advocate that, when leaching evolution, educators should add the disclaimer that it is "just a theory."
Well...Gee! Even hard core evolutionists ( when cornered) admit that evolution still fits the strict definition of "theory". It isn't an experiment that can be duplicated using the scientific method.
Let's consider why all of us as educated persons, scientists and nonseientists alike, should take note of what science is taught - and not taught - in our public schools.
What needs to be considered here is the fact that as long as we have compulsory, police threat, godless government schools, there will be continual curriculum and policy wars. There can be no compromise because to compromise is to lie to one's conscience!
What needs to be considered is that government schools are a freedom of conscience ABOMINATION!!!
Also?....I bet she would consider those of us who want our children educated in an environment with a God-centered worldview, to be uneducated.I am willing to bet that she considers those of us who resent paying for godless government schools as being uneducated.
Finally, anyone who "believes" that "Separation of Church and State" exists in our nation's founding documents is a blithering idiot.
There is a solution to the continual curriculum and policy wars in our compulsory, godless, police threat government indoctrination centers.
Solution: Begin the process of privatizing universal K-12 schools.
I have no doubt that makes it easier, but I guess the question becomes whether right and wrong would exist at all if God didn't define it for us. I think it does, because it isn't some arbitrary dictate; it's a whole set of principles which are consistent.
I don't think it comes down to a situation where a deity says this is right and this is wrong and if you don't agree with me, I'll fry your butt in hell.
There is precious little in the Ten Commandments that we couldn't have figured out for ourselves as the best course of conduct. Perhaps the Sabbath and the admonition against graven images wouldn't have been intuitive, but I think everything else regarding conduct is.
But I could be wrong.
A male lion's conduct is consistent when it kills the offspring of rival males. A cuckcoo's behavior is consistent when it places its egg in another's nest. Chimpanzees often murder and eat their kind. Human conduct includes eating humans. Finally, what you determine is right or wrong is the product of human civilization which includes Christianity.
As to the ten commandments being an inevitable outcome of some unnamed process, please indicate how the concept of covet fits in? How about fornication? From what I see in the news, those two concepts are having a rough time among many others.
All of the commandments are having a rough time among the world population. That’s not the issue. Surely you’d agree that if there is a right and wrong, that people are able to choose wrong.
You know full well what the negative implications to fornication and coveting are. How? Only from the Bible? Or can you observe the effects for yourself?
Exactly. And It is why no darwinite has challenged me on that point. A clear and sane look will quickly show that to be true.
Yes, but it is your contention that right and wrong are derived empirically. So where is the perfect "eye"?
You see covetousness advertised and performed everyday and multiple times on our media. I'm sure you can surmise the same for fornication. Again, it is not my viewpoint that requires justification or proof, empirically we should determine right from wrong and somehow differentiate the two in your view. That does not seem to be happening.
The founders of our nation realized the dilemma. That is why our forefathers mentioned the Creator in our Declaration of Independence. The rights we have are out of reach of any form of government. If government can decide what rights we have, we have no rights.(rights obviously are based upon right and wrong and lawgiver as you originally mentioned. Evidently, you intuitively understand, but reject the law-giver.)
Thus they would rather destroy the country than give freedom to parents through complete privatization of schools.
This is why the most fanatical evolutionists support the Huge Government Public School liberals with such devotion.
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