Posted on 01/27/2005 7:27:58 PM PST by Patriot814
I know the 2008 election is a while away and anything could happen, but if things were the same as the polls right now and it was between McCain and Giuliani, who would you choose? I would choose Giuliani because they're both modereate, but Giuliani's more loyal. McCain would appease the democrats and would be painted as crazy.
Like choosing between Herpes or the Clap.
Newt versus Hillary would be great.
Hillary is soiled, the Donks would be unable to fling ethics and multiple marriage charges at Gingrich
Again about Bloomberg and Spector, they are liberals and I don't believe they would have gotten as far as to actually win a primary for President. You have to look where they are from.
I still stick to my original position. I will revise my original statement. I will vote for a Republican unless the other party can provide me a good alternative like Zell Miller or John Brau. (Cant spell)
I am definitely not a wimpy conservative. I am a Rush Limbaugh type conservative. A raging, get involved, hate liberalism type of conservative. I think I am probably one of a few people who actually sees the real danger of getting a liberal in power. Not in social issues or domestic issues but on terrorism. I really believe Rudy or even McCain would be better on terrorism than a liberal democrat.
We can take our stand but do it after our guy gets in office cause if a liberal democrat gets in, we won't have another chance.
I understand what you are saying about people saying each election, this is the most important one but those were before 9/11. This time and in the future, it is for real.
I am not a big conspiracy buff, but I've been alive and watching politics long enough to notice that there is a group of people with a lot of $ who think that ordinary citizens should not be permitted to choose our leaders since they regard themselves as much superior to us and therefore, know what is best for us. These people are found in both parties (Republicrats) and work together to move their agenda and protect their interests. They like races where they own both candidates and no matter who wins, they do.
I would vote for either of these guys!!!!
Neither is my ideal choice (Condi!), but I see the upside to both choices. No one can say that McCain would not be tough on terrorists, and Rudy seems to have a nationwide appeal. Socially, Rudy bothers me more, but economically McCain does.
I *WILL NEVER* vote for a gungrabber.
No matter the party affiliation.
The only reason Bush got my vote this time is because he let the AWB die.
I agree -- Giulianni -- he is gracious, even in disagreement. McCain has, it seems, always tried to pattern himself in the Teddy Roosevelt style, but he's missed it by 180 degrees: He speaks incessantly and his stick is a wet noodle he got from the Democrats.
I gotta disagree...nothing will ever stop the Donks (nice name by the way) from flinging crap...any and all kinds. And nothing will ever stop their followers, including the media, from drinking their kool-aid.
Too bad so many voters here in PA didn't have this common sense during the primaries-Specter made it through and only with the help of Bush and Santorum. So why is it safe to say they would never make it through the presidential primaries if the party doesn't let you have one? "The 'R' is better than the 'D'"
TROLL!
I wanted to be the first. ;-)
I will vote for neither.
McCain is mentally ill, and I believe, compromised beyond redemption. And did I mention corrupt?
My biggest concern for the future of the country is not terrorism, but the domestic war on terrorism. There are so many people who are willing to trade freedom for a little security that all it would take is one more 9/11 and these people would surrender all of their freedom.
What ever happened to "Give me liberty or give me death"?
The worst that a terrorist can do to me is kill me.
In order to 'protect' me, my own government is ready, willing, and I might add, able to take my liberty away. It's evident that we are not trusted as a free people already and the one thing that the government should do -- protect the borders -- they refuse to do. Strange that both parties find it in their interest to keep the borders open despite the obvious threats posed by them being kept open.
Rudy is a gungrabber. He doesn't trust me to be free. I don't trust him to be president.
If the best that we have to offer against a socialist like Hillary is a liberal nut and a gun grabbing nut, I don't know that it isn't time for the cleansing that Jefferson expected on a quite frequent basis.
I do agree with you on that. I think Specter is an atrocity! I don't understand why Bush and Santorum supported Specter. I think cause they thought he would deliver Pa. to Bush. But thats a shame to choose politics over principles.
Look up spinelessness in the dictionary and you'll find a picture of an elephant and the GOP as the 1st definition. ;-)
Again about Bloomberg and Spector, they are liberals and I don't believe they would have gotten as far as to actually win a primary for President. You have to look where they are from.
And McCain and Guiliani are. . . ? Staunchly conservative? I don't think so.
We are discussing a hypothetical that has been presented here. I think that it is really a great question and a great time to think about 2008 and examine our rationale and work through any misperceptions about who the candidates are or should be. If we indicate a willingness to accept a McCain or a Rudy, do you really think that we'll get any better? If we commit our support too soon to any candidate, do we stand a chance of getting what we want?
I hate to be crude or suggestive, but look at it in these terms:
Does a girl get more respect from a suitor when she says 'yes' on the first or second date? Or does she get used for his purposes and shunted aside? Think of politics and male/female relations in the same terms and the analogy is fitting. The goal of both the politician and the suitor is the very much the same. A woman should not give in so easily to such requests and neither should we.
I still stick to my original position. I will revise my original statement. I will vote for a Republican unless the other party can provide me a good alternative like Zell Miller or John Brau. (Cant spell)
I've voted for my last Republican if this is the best that we can do. I won't vote for the Dem, but if we aren't more stingy with our votes, the GOP will continue to prop up and promote RINOs. They have to know that sometimes we will vote for NOTA. If winning and power is what is important to them (the party elite), they will have to acknowledge that principle is what is important to us, but first we have to make sure that they hear that message loud and clear.
I am definitely not a wimpy conservative. I am a Rush Limbaugh type conservative. A raging, get involved, hate liberalism type of conservative.
From some of your other posts, I didn't really think that you were and that's why I was surprised by your post on this thread and I couldn't walk by without questioning you.
I think I am probably one of a few people who actually sees the real danger of getting a liberal in power. Not in social issues or domestic issues but on terrorism. I really believe Rudy or even McCain would be better on terrorism than a liberal democrat.
Overseas, I don't think that you are wrong. And, without their hands tied, the military can do the job better than any other force in the world. Domestically, however, I don't want anyone who forgets that we are a free people and respects that freedom and guards it zealously.
We can take our stand but do it after our guy gets in office cause if a liberal democrat gets in, we won't have another chance."
Once in office, it's too late for us to make demands and have expectations. In the primary, we better all get behind a strong conservative. If we don't, penowa's prediction of a 3 way race and a Hillary victory will come true.
We have come too far to hand the next nomination to a RINO. If we talk of compromising our values and desires, now, here on FR -- a conservative site (and you know that this site is monitored) -- in order to win at any cost, we are conceding defeat to the RINOs before the race begins and the victory, if there is one over the Democrats will be Pyrrhic.
I understand what you are saying about people saying each election, this is the most important one but those were before 9/11. This time and in the future, it is for real.
I think that penowa said that, but I do agree with him. Politicians always like to scare you into voting for them. If they lose, it's the end of the world. Nonsense. We survived the first clinton because we properly regarded him as an enemy of liberty. Many here believe that Bush can do no wrong. That's more nonsense.
This election is important, but not because of the war on terrorism, but because of the ongoing war on our liberties. If we choose security over liberty, then, as Franklin said, we are worthy of neither.
I may have subconciously toned down my staunch conservativism because I have been called down on it so many times. My unwillingness to compromise the issues has been critisized so much. I know I despise and fear liberalism. I have nightmares about liberals getting into power. I always thought even if we get a RINO in we have another chance to fix it but if we get a liberal rat in, its over. We'll never get in power again.
I don't like either of them for Prez. My issue is abortion, and I think both of them are pro-abortion - I know Giuliani is, because he was "converted" by his ex-wife, a Grade-B television commentator named Donna Hanover.
If I had to chose between them, though, I'd go for Giuliani because I think he would be more workable on both abortion and guns.
McCain has always been out trying to curry liberal favor and he will go whichever way they tell him to. And it won't favor either of our positions.
I have been taken to the woodshed for my former position and I have learned. I agree with your analysis about suiters. Its a good one.
Thanks. NO! is a very small but powerful word and we all need to use it more. Too many times throughout life we are afraid of not getting what we want so we quickly agree to anything that resembles what we want. We say YES! If we hold out, if we refuse to accept less than the best or less that we want and deserve, we may not get everything, but we will get more.
Over the last 2 years, as people saw the 9 clowns from the DNC, they started pledging their undying devotion to Bush and did so to the degree that we lost all of our bargaining power with Bush. When he should have been playing to his base and giving us what we wanted, his advisers told him that we were in the bag and that he could go after the middle. And he did, pandering to buy votes with tax money.
So what we have to do is make sure a RINO doesn't make it through the the primaries. I never thought of that.
Sure you did. You just didn't believe that it was possible to achieve.
I may have subconciously toned down my staunch conservativism because I have been called down on it so many times. My unwillingness to compromise the issues has been critisized so much.
Watch how I get blasted, the names that I get called, and you'll think that you've been getting love letters. I've been called just about every name in the book from whacko right wing extremist to a leftist. LOL
I know I despise and fear liberalism. I have nightmares about liberals getting into power.
Despise it, but don't fear it. Liberals will expose themselves for what they are. It is the RINO who masquerades as our friend -- the enemy inside the gate, if you will, that we must be on guard against as he insinuates himself into our hierarchy of power. Arlen Specter is the prototype for this. I started working to defeat Specter a year before Pat Toomey even announced that he was running. We started to bring him to Western PA to make him a household name 3 years ago. We built a grassroots organization (I am not taking credit for that) that worked feverishly towards that end and in this area of the state, he beat Specter by about 2 to 1 -- even in liberal Pittsburgh.
I won't rehash the story here, but this team came within a swing of 8500 votes statewide of defeating a 4 term incumbent who outspent him 4 to 1 AND had the backing of Bush and Santorum.
We have worked since the election to keep this coalition alive and ready for the next campaign. BTW, if Rick Santorum doesn't redeem himself for supporting Specter, this coalition WILL NOT be working to get him reelected.
I always thought even if we get a RINO in we have another chance to fix it but if we get a liberal rat in, its over. We'll never get in power again.
I did too when I was younger. The older I got, the less I believed that. Now I am totally unconvinced that it anything but true.
Stay true to your conservative convictions. Don't let yourself be dissuaded by fear tactics.
I am fired up now. Good luck getting Specter out next time. You are right on the money about President Bush. He needs to move back to the right. And yes, we did "fall in love" with President Bush. I know I have defended him to other conservatives when there really wasn't much I had to defend him with. Especially about immigration. I just don't get it. And gas prices. I tell everybody there isn't anything he can do about gas prices but is there? I absolutely will remain true to my conservative values but I think we all need a wake up call. Thanks!
That depends... Who are the Republicans running?
There is a natural tendency to want to defend 'our guy', but when we do are we any better than those who defended clinton despite his many failures as a man and as a president?
When Bush, or any other pol, is right. I have no problem saying so, even that one time clinton got it right. ;-) I won't defend the indefensible. And when they are wrong, it is my God given right to say that too.
Whether it is because fear of government reprisal or because of political intimidation, when you are afraid to exercise your rights, you have already effectively lost them. I won't cede mine. Too many good men and women died to preserve them for me.
I believe that the 'gas price' argument is an extension of the bogus 'war for oil' argument. I don't want the president or any branch of the government, or any government panel to have the ability to set prices. I trust the free market to set prices. In relative terms, gas is less costly now than it was before. Inflation has hit many other items much harder.
If you get into some good discussions and fights, would you mind pinging me? Together we can fight ignorance and fear disguised as reason and principle. Okay?
I would be glad to ping you but I haven't learned how yet. If you could tell me how to do that, I will. Free Republic needs a tutorial to teach us how to post pics and ping and stuff. I just now learned how to copy and paste. LOL
Ah, but we do provide help.
Go here:
http://www.freerepublic.com/help.htm
If you go to the FR's home page, there is a drop down tab in the upper right hand corner labeled "HELP" (that's this link that I've provided) There are several topics listed there.
Pinging is as simple as adding a FReeper's name into the "TO" box when you reply to a post.
BTW, Happy FReeper Anniversary.
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