Posted on 07/29/2017 9:08:32 AM PDT by LS
MY ORIGINAL POST TO LS:
Interesting, Dan Bongino was talking about this yesterday—that in the past he did not support Third Party, but given the fact that GOP is acting more and more like Dems or a Uniparty-esp. with healthcare bill.
Seems that the downside risk of going third party is diminishing. We are all tired of being sold out :(
He did not go into the detail you did. He did, however, mention that David Horowitz is also in favor of third party.
I think you have some good ideas.
YOUR REPLY TO ME:
This is sheer nonsense and is ignorant of how politics works. The Republicans are not acting like the Democrats. What is going on is that the Republicans have a faction of “moderates” (”Neo-Cons”, “RINO’s”, etc.), led by John McCain, who are more hawkish. This faction may want to repeal Obamacare but to get what they want on foreign policy issues, they have to shoot down Obamacare to force concessions from Trump on foreign policy issues they are pushing for. So the real question becomes: would you be favorable to Trump making concessions on foreign policy to repeal Obamacare? Or would you rather live with a modified form of Obamacare and keep Trump foreign policy intact? Remember, in politics we can only rarely have our cake and eat it too. Some of this thinking about a third party is by those who want to divide the Republicans and give the Democrats a shot in 2020. To get what you want you may have to log roll - referring to many people who differ in their politics pushing on a huge fallen redwood tree to roll it. If you don’t form a coalition to push the log there will be a legislative “log jam”. This goes by the name of “REALISM” - the attitude and practice of accepting a situation as it is and prepared to deal with it. Realism also goes by another name: “COMMON SENSE”.
Wow got Snark? Uh yeah you certainly do...Well Mr. Know-it-all Wayne, to say I am posting sheer nonsense and I, LS, Bongino and Horowitz are ignorant of how politics works is what is nonsense. That is unless you have written books, taught courses on politics, hosted talk shows, advised campaigns, etc...I saw no such credentials on your profile.
I am sorry but I don’t agree with your THEORIES and OPINIONS
that RINOs (McCain et. al.) shot down Obamacare to force concessions on foreign policy. Perhaps you can provide a listing of the numerous experts who have supported this theory...I did not see any.
In fact, here is an article about why McCain did not vote for it and it has NOTHING TO DO WITH FOREIGN POLICY.
No I don’t want a modified Obamacare—and neither do many of us. I don’t think we have to settle nor should we. Frankly, We got Trump, so “we really are having our cake and eating it too.”
I don’t think LS, Bongino or Horowitz** wish to divide “us” whoever “us” is—The GOP is really just DEM-Lite...because the Republicans are not following their platform, they are not supporting their president, and they have not kept their promise to repeal. PERIOD. They are elitists; they are no longer the party of smaller government and less spending...Shame you did not actually read LS post nor do some research on Horowitz and listen to Bongino...You just swooped down commenting on that which you think you know but don’t.
Your comment: This goes by the name of “REALISM” - the attitude and practice of accepting a situation as it is and prepared to deal with it. Realism also goes by another name: “COMMON SENSE”.
Uh, I don’t need you defining terms for me.
Realism? The reality is that the Republicans ignore their base until right before the election. They spend the majority of their time dialing for dollars...Common sense? Common sense is to stop doing the same thing that results in failure every election...
I disagree with pretty much everything you said, and unless you can produce numerous experts supporting your MERE THEORIES AND OPINIONS, I think your post is sheer nonsense and ignorant of how politics works.
BTW, really did not appreciate first comment to me of the night due to slow servers being someone I DID NOT POST TO, and I have never seen before swooping down on what I posted..Not exactly polite or nice...You have a right to disagree with me, but you sure don’t make friends and influence people with your tone.
**Horowitz has done more work for conservatism than just about anyone...you really should look him up. Also look up the books LS wrote...
I agree with you as to Trump. As to divine intervention, faith tells us both that it happens and that the Lord cleverly disguises much of His best work as human effort.
Read the article. It looks nothing like Ron Paul. It looks like the Lincoln Republicans.
Thanks for the ping.
You’re welcome. Hope it helps.
Anyone pushing the idea that the RINOs will willingly give up their power and $$$ because we asked strikes me as being naïve at best and a fool in regards to human nature.
The Tea Party was not a party but a movement.
What would be done differently than has been done to this point? What's your plan?
> What would be done differently than has been done to this point? What’s your plan? <
Good question, and there is no easy answer. But the guy we have in the White House now is unique. He has the ability to motivate grass-roots Republicans (and working-class Democrats) like no one I’ve seen since Reagan.
If Trump can untangle himself from all the garbage the Deep state is throwing at him, maybe - just maybe - he can get a long-term MAGA movement going within the GOP.
“Anyone pushing the idea that the RINOs will willingly give up their power and $$$ because we asked strikes me as being naïve at best and a fool in regards to human nature.”
We didn’t ‘request’ that the RINOs get out of the way to let Trump be the nominee, and we are not ‘requesting’ that the RINOs give up their power and money for us.
We are DRIVING THEM OUT - big difference. Surprised some people would rather leave them in power and try organizing elsewhere...as if that would have a happy ending.
Really...this "driving them out" of which you speak...looks an awful lot like the swamp creatures digging in for prolonged battle.
What makes it "driving them out?"
Actually, yes. We NOW know where the problem is, and we are NOW starting to fix it...as in Rinse.
Giving up and letting the rump Republican Party maintain its hold on donors really seems like a dream of the Democrats, although I realize that 98% of the people here fed up with the Republicans are NOT trolls (yourself included)...even so, why do the dirty work of trolls?
RINOs in the government are an issue. Millions of them.
...and one at a time, they are outed and ELIMINATED (politically)...hard to think of a happier outcome.
So your plan would be to sever-off us activists from the Republican Party...leaving their structure, with their fund-raising, intact - while we activists would try to form our own party with no money or infrastructure. And, if we’re lucky, we’ll get, maybe, 30% of the popular vote and wind up with 50 seats in the House, 10 in the Senate, and 12 Electoral Votes. The rump Republican Party will do worse than that, as their starting point might be 25 percent (maybe 20 percent) of the popular vote.
While I’m not claiming that those offering the above solution are Democrats in drag, I will claim that the effect is IDENTICAL - we’ll be dealing with a CLEAN SWEEP by the Democrats if we try a Third Party.
Much better to DRAIN THE SWAMP and complete our TAKEOVER of the Republican Party, infrastructure and all.
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