At one time back in the day, inside most police cars were equipped with an M-870 shotgun. Then theres an odd ball patrolman with his AR-15 with .223 caliber. Which patrolman has the advantage? Posted on 07/11/2017 9:39:24 AM PDT by w1n1
At one time back in the day, inside most police cars were equipped with an M-870 shotgun. Then theres an odd ball patrolman with his AR-15 with .223 caliber. Which patrolman has the advantage?
The logic behind the usage of an AR stems from situations where a firearm needed for greater range than a shotgun.
So the debate begins, shotgun folks talk about having the knock down power to stop the fight with its 00 buck. AR’s with its high velocity and more firepower in terms of 20 rounds – 30 rounds magazine capacity.
Using either firearm we can make a perfect case as the weapon of choice to have for personal defense. In order for us to decide in an un-biased environment, a test should be conducted for validation. We can do this by pitting the two guns in a side by side shootout.
There needs to be a determination that each gun should be fired at the same target and at the same range. Because the idea is to ascertain some kind of combat effectiveness under stress, a time limit needs to be establish on each stage.
This test was based from Wiley Clapp test out on Gunsite where he had two Range Masters both skilled with the shotgun and AR go through this special course of fire. (Bill Murphy – shotgun and Vince Morgan – AR-15)
This course of fire were as follow: A shooter armed with respective firearm would engage a silhouette at various ranges. First at 15 yards, then 25, 50, 75 and 100 yards. At the command of a whistle the shooter would have 3 seconds to fire off as many rounds as possible onto the target. Read the rest of the shot gun vs AR-15 test here. How bout you all, which would you go with?
“The shotgun for when they’re in close.”
“The AR15 to keep them from getting close.”
Thanks. That wasn’t so hard was it.
Poor advice. A pistol/revolver is used in order to fight your way to your primary mass-casualty/wound producing item: in my case shotgun w#4 buck while the wife secures the hallway with the PS90 SBR.
Hamburger meat? You've never shot anyone, I see.....and in reality, you won't give a damn about brains, blood, etc until the next day. ......unless its yours.
Moral of the story: firepower kills. Get as much lead downrange, accurately, as quickly as possible....and have a lawyer on speed dial.
357 mag probably best bet for home defense, unless a bullet that did not hit the perp tears throught the dry wall and throught your neighbors wall and injures them by mistake.
When a man with a 45 meets a man with a SHOTGUN he runs. heh heh
Well good for them.......
OO buckshot more closely resembles the ballistics of .22 LR, if my observations of dead deer mean anything. I have to admit, they were dead, though.
Like.
Well, double ought shot is 30 caliber.
.22 LR mushrooms to .30 cal.
These ranges seem rather silly for personal defense.
How often is a civilian going to fire in self defense at these ranges.
Most personal defense guns are fired at ranges of 10 feet or less.
If your in your own home it is most likely that the furthest you are to be from a home invader is 5 yards.
If you are away from home it is highly unlikely that you would be caarrying either one of these weapons as a personal defense weapon.
These ranges seem rather silly for personal defense.
How often is a civilian going to fire in self defense at these ranges.
Most personal defense guns are fired at ranges of 10 feet or less.
If your in your own home it is most likely that the furthest you are to be from a home invader is 5 yards.
If you are away from home it is highly unlikely that you would be caarrying either one of these weapons as a personal defense weapon.
These ranges seem rather silly for personal defense.
How often is a civilian going to fire in self defense at these ranges.
Most personal defense guns are fired at ranges of 10 feet or less.
If your in your own home it is most likely that the furthest you are to be from a home invader is 5 yards.
If you are away from home it is highly unlikely that you would be caarrying either one of these weapons as a personal defense weapon.
This test was based from Wiley Clapp test...
Does everyone at this blog write like a seventh grader?
I agree with what you’ve said about rifle vs. pistol - in a direct confrontation, the rifle always wins (well, maybe a .22LR vs. a .500 S&W Magnum would turn out differently).
I was just addressing the 100% definiteness of your statement that:
“When a man with a .45 meets a man with a rifle, the man with a pistol will be a dead man.”
No, not always. Mostly, yes, but not always. I have both, and I’d always prefer to have a rifle than a pistol...but I know that the rifle isn’t a magic wand, either, that some miscreant with a pistol can still put a slug in me.
Agreed, and I was just having a small amount of fun with the movie quote. :)
Lots f interesting commentary I am sure, but the bigger question is “what are you trying to accomplish?”
Are yo trying to put a bunch of small ballistically inferior lead balls ( no body armor penetration (low energy/mass per pellet) on a soft target ( how do you know the target is soft) or are you trying to stop a lethal threat that could be armored?
If the former- out to about 40 yards, maybe 100 if you can switch to slugs ( pump shotguns are not famous for such ability BTW), then by all means stuff your shotgun with OO buck and proceed. If the latter, then by all means load a magazine or two with medium/heavy tough bullets and penetrate easily through 3A+ armor, and have reach to do so out past 300m. Up close, the 556 heavy ammo is wonderful for fragmenting or expansion and energy delivery.
What is the threat? The shotgun will do well in certain situations, the carbine or rifle will do it better in a wider range of conditions.
If the quest if for as many hits as possible in a short time, remember that a bunch of minor hits that do not stop are worthless compared to one hit that does....
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