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President Obama: We'll be debating unconditional free money 'over the next 10 or 20 years'
Business Insider ^ | October 12, 2016 | Chris Weller

Posted on 10/13/2016 11:28:41 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

Speaking with Wired editor-in-chief Scott Dadich and MIT Media Lab director Joi Ito in a recent interview, President Barack Obama reaffirmed his belief that universal basic income would be harder to ignore in the coming decades.

UBI is a system of wealth distribution in which the government provides everyone with some money, regardless of income.

The money comes with no strings attached. People can use it however they choose, whether to repair a leaky roof or to go on vacation. Advocates say the system is a smart and straightforward way to lift people out of poverty.

A growing body of evidence suggests such a system might be necessary if artificial intelligence wipes out a huge chunk of jobs performed by humans. That is the future Obama wants to avoid, but he said the possibility warrants a debate on basic income....

(Excerpt) Read more at businessinsider.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; Politics; Society
KEYWORDS: automation; guaranteedincome; obama; welfare
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To: rbg81

GREAT,
We can buy more drugs, alcohol and cigs. It don’t matter cause we have free health care to take care of us.

AND maybe enough leftover for that final injection at age 30!


81 posted on 10/14/2016 5:29:48 AM PDT by oldasrocks (rump)
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To: Cronos

I think we already have the “ultra-violence”


82 posted on 10/14/2016 5:32:53 AM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“People can use it however they choose, whether to repair a leaky roof or to go on vacation.”

Creating animosity right there. You think those who need to fix a roof with it will be happy about those who get to blow it on a vacation?


83 posted on 10/14/2016 5:52:42 AM PDT by jughandle (Big words anger me, keep talking.)
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To: Cronos
Most of your bulleted premises are wrong or irrelevant.

This idea is Marxism, pure and simple.

84 posted on 10/14/2016 6:33:38 AM PDT by matt1234 (The alt-right is the left's Emmanuel Goldstein)
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To: rlmorel

Correct. I think we SHOULD have this debate as Obama says — and we should then bring out these points that there is no bottomless well...


85 posted on 10/14/2016 6:43:41 AM PDT by Cronos (Obama's dislike of Assad is not based on his brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: matt1234
UBI is Marxism, yes. But my bulletted points are not irrelevant. The fact is that automation will eliminate the usefulness of a large bunch of people -- anyone who can't think will have no job. Oh and in my point plumbers, farmers etc. have to think and they do -- but not farmhands or the guy who hands out the burger and fries

and there are lots of people who can't think. The question is -- what to do with them?

I see UBI as a way to keep the unwashed masses amused and off our backs, but the more efficient way is what wasteout said -- you don't have a job, then you work for the nation doing some task -- most likely military or infrastructural (remember that the Roman Army spent most of its time building)

86 posted on 10/14/2016 6:48:03 AM PDT by Cronos (Obama's dislike of Assad is not based on his brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Advocates say the system is a smart and straightforward way to lift get people out of poverty to ask for more money.
87 posted on 10/14/2016 7:00:45 AM PDT by Malsua
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To: Cronos

Exactly. The pessimistic side of me thinks it will be fruitless, but the other side of me says we have to do it no matter what the result.

If we don’t, it will just happen, and will be another nail in the coffin for the Republic, not that there aren’t a lot in there already.


88 posted on 10/14/2016 8:02:51 AM PDT by rlmorel (Orwell described Liberals when he wrote of those who "repudiate morality while laying claim to it.")
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

THe problem with free money is that it is free.

THe “cost” of any item is driven by the value people place on it, and value tends to be based on how hard a person has to work in exchange for an item.

If you don’t have to work at all, then you would pay “anything” for an item.

SO, if you give people $10,000 of free money, the general cost of everything will go up by $10,000 . Same amount of goods, more money chasing those goods, prices rise to balance demand.

The misunderstanding of basic economics is probably the biggest impediment to our future as a nation.

Imagine if we got rid of money, and you actually had to barter or work for goods. How then would you give people a base income? Well, Poor person (PP) wants a new car. The person with the new car wants an addition to their house. The PP can’t do that, they have no skill, which is why they have no money. So instead, we force a half-dozen people off the street to come over and build the addition to the house, and then the car is given to the PP.

That’s what UBI is, only we take people’s “work” by using tax code.


89 posted on 10/14/2016 8:56:22 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: kearnyirish2

The truth that the Left does not want to admit is that all labor is not equal and some is worth more compensation than others. Trying to make that untrue by raising minimum wage well above what a business is willing to pay an unskilled worker entering into a tight work force for the first time will only make it more likely that large subgroups of people will not find work. Their solution is to keep raising the minimum wage. There is also the whole matter of the costs of goods and services going up in correlation to increases.

The minimum base income is not connected to labor and it would be a set amount. If a person wanted to increase that income he would either have to create his own job or work for somebody else. One big reason I support it is because I think it would really help families. For example it could be used so that a young mother did not have to put her children in daycare. It could be used to help purchase health insurance or pay for private school. It might mean a family could move from a dangerous neighborhood to a safer one. I see this largely as a benefit to the middle class.

My biggest concern Is that the government will demand it go to non-citizens including illegal aliens. That would be a non-starter for me. I would also object if it was regarded as just another welfare program on top of existing programs. It should replace those programs or at least lead to sharp reductions in them.


90 posted on 10/14/2016 9:03:13 AM PDT by lastchance (Credo.)
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To: Pollster1

http://www.conservativehq.com/article/20043-conservative-case-minimum-income


91 posted on 10/14/2016 9:11:06 AM PDT by lastchance (Credo.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

https://www.cato-unbound.org/2014/08/04/matt-zwolinski/pragmatic-libertarian-case-basic-income-guarantee


92 posted on 10/14/2016 9:15:31 AM PDT by lastchance (Credo.)
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To: BenLurkin

Yes we do!

So on the one hand he is saying robots will replace low-level unskilled jobs, and yet he keeps encouraging and allowing unskilled people to flood into our country...

What could possibly go wrong?


93 posted on 10/14/2016 9:56:10 AM PDT by Freedom56v2
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To: lastchance

The problem is we wouldn’t replace 79 welfare programs with one welfare program. We would supplement 79 federal welfare programs with another, larger federal welfare program.


94 posted on 10/14/2016 11:31:11 AM PDT by Pollster1 (Somebody who agrees with me 80% of the time is a friend and ally, not a 20% traitor. - Ronald Reagan)
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To: Pollster1

Most Conservatives in favor of the GBI do not favor retaining the current welfare system. Obviously if it was to be just another means tested program it would not work.


95 posted on 10/14/2016 2:00:07 PM PDT by lastchance (Credo.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
UBI is a system of wealth distribution in which the government provides everyone with some money that it STOLE from someone else. Socialism is theft. Socialists are thieves.
96 posted on 10/14/2016 2:03:22 PM PDT by NorthMountain (Hillary Clinton: scheming, robotic liar.)
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To: Cronos

I have the same perspective.

I could see starting out with a negative income tax to see how that spurs people to start their own cottage industry. I foresee that there may be a renaissance in skilled artisan crafts for handmade luxury goods.

The street fair / farmers markets are flourishing and the two I attend ban resellers of mass produced goods and the handcrafted items are juried (if the jury committee thinks your stuff is poor quality, unoriginal or uninteresting you don’t get in).

I can also see a UBI at 25-30K combined with a NIT of the same amount leading to a mass exodus of mostly women from the formal job market and having a stay at home parent become the norm again.


97 posted on 10/14/2016 3:44:39 PM PDT by Valpal1 (If the police can t solve a problem with violence, they ll find a way to fix it with brute force)
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To: lastchance

The biggest incentive for the government to raise the minimum wage is to add to the coffers for income taxes and most importantly, Social Security/Medicare taxes (there is no refund on those payments, and no Earned Income Credit). Living in a high-cost part of the country (the NYC metro area), we have local and state governments dead-set against reducing the workfare so common here (government jobs); rather that cut costs, they just want to transfer those costs onto employers - and the outcome is predictable: Employers and those workers who can flee to lower-cost areas, especially those without a gaggle of government workers (demanding salaries/benfits far beyond anything offered in the private sector) and unemployable Welfarians seeking sugar daddies to pay for their golden ticket bastards’ housing, schools, etc.


98 posted on 10/15/2016 6:07:32 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic warfare against white males (and therefore white families).)
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