'GOD MADE MAN...GOD MADE WOMAN--AND COL. COLT MADE EM EQUAL!'
Posted on 01/10/2014 3:35:13 AM PST by marktwain
A jury convicted Philip K. Green, 40, of reckless homicide. Green had a CCW permit, and called the police after the shooting. Green knew the man he shot, and had gone to several bars with him and two others. This is the first homicide conviction for a Wisconsin resident with a CCW permit. The permit system has been in place for over 2 years, with over 200,000 permits issued. If we assume an average of 100,000 permits per year, then the rate of convictions for CCW holders in Wisconsin becomes .5/100,000 with this conviction. That is about 1/10th of the national average, about the same as Minnesota. 60% of the murders committed in Wisconsin occur in Milwaukee, which has a little over 10% of the population of the state. From jsonline.com:
Green and the two other men out that night had said they all met at one bar, then rode together to a second tavern before going to a strip club. Green, who is much older than others in the group, said he didn't want to go, and preferred to be dropped at his car. That's when Banks, 26, seemed to take offense, stopped the car, and pulled Green from the back seat and began beating him.There does not seem to be any contention that Banks was the aggressor. The reckless homicide charge seems to be based on the contention that Banks had stopped beating on Green when Green shot. Banks was driving the car, Green and two other people were passengers.
"I felt threatened for my life from what's going on," Green told the jury.
He said Banks, 26, had hit him, knocked him to the ground, kicked him and pulled his jacket up over his head. He said he felt handicapped and put his hand on his holstered gun for fear Banks would take it. Then as he returned to his feet, Green said, he just "put it up and shot."
In his closing argument, Assistant District Attorney Grant Huebner told jurors Green "wasn't protecting his life, he was firing back in anger." Even though Banks was the aggressor, Huebner said, it was unreasonable for Green to use deadly force in what was clearly "a fist fight."I do not know what the defense said, but many "fist fights" end up with a person killed or brain injured. The idea that a person should put up with a beating, and risk their life, has long been discredited.
Looking at the article, two bars is not “several”.
In Michigan he would have been carrying in violation of the law when in the bars, and in violation in general if he had any measurable alcohol in his system.
I am 100% in favor of using firearms to end a fist fight. A 5’1” girl with a Glock is not supposed to count on her right hook against a man who is beating on her, and neither should any other victim who is not the aggressor. Perhaps there are relevant facts not in the article, but I would be sympathetic to the man who shot his attacker.
A number of the so called “knockout” victims have been killed with one punch.
60% of the murders committed in Wisconsin occur in Milwaukee, which has a little over 10% of the population of the state.
That's also known as "leadership" in Chicago. Milwaukee may have a special local term for it that I'm unfamiliar with.
If he was drinking I don’t have a lot of sympathy for him.
This prosecutor seems to be mixing things up. If the fight was “over”, then I agree that the use of deadly force may have been illegal. Unless of course it had only paused; “Now get in the car or I’ll REALLY give you a beat-down” as he got ready to swing again.
But to say you can’t use deadly force to end “a fist fight” is an entirely different thing. And is entirely legal where I live.
Its my understand the law here in Florida doesn’t allow you to use deadly force for a fist fight. If someone says “i’m going to beat you up” you cannot shoot them. If they say they’re going to kill you, then you can. Never understood why the state expects you to let yourself be beat.
It would be a very poor case for that anti-gunners to hang their hats on. What they’re looking for is for a cc nut to start arbitrarily shooting up places and killing people (preferably children and/or lib protected groups) without cause. But a guy who is getting the tar beat out of him and who could actually be acting in self-defense is not the one they’re looking for.
“Looking at the article, two bars is not “several”...........
You want “several” bars, visit La Crosse, there has to be a bar on every block. Fun town too.
Doesn’ the Wisconsin “castle doctrine” consider the immediate space around you as “your space” and give you the right to protect yourself within said space? Enlighten me.
When Banks picted Green up from the ground did NOT mean he didn’t plan to continue his assault, perhaps he was only catching his breath for round two.
Not knowing either of these two, I can only imagine the part of the city they came from. (Near north side?)
Alcohol and guns like automobiles and alcohol should never be mixed. Both are deadly. That fact alone prejudices me against Mr Green. Reckless Homicide sounds about right, IF the facts are as presented.
I think it would be allowed in Florida. Here is a recent Appeals Court case that is similar:
http://gunwatch.blogspot.com/2014/01/flappeals-court-vindicates-concealed.html
That said, alcohol and firearms do not mix - unless you're using some kind of alcohol based cleaner/de-greaser. In CO he would be in violation of the law for being in possession of a firearm while under the influence. If I'm going out, even for just one beer with friends while watching a game - the Glock stays home.
I do not know that he drank any alcohol. It would be interesting to know if he did.
I did not see it mentioned in the articles I read about the case.
Wow, that doesn’t really make sense.
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