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New York Army Vet Facing 7 Years in Prison Over Empty Ammo Magazines
http://www.theblaze.com ^ | february 23, 2013 | Madeleine Morgenstern

Posted on 02/24/2013 5:47:16 AM PST by lowbridge

An Army veteran in New York is facing up to seven years in prison for possessing five empty 30-round ammunition magazines.

Nate Haddad told WGRZ-TV he was parked on a road last month waiting to meet someone interested in buying them off him when police approached. According to the station, the magazines were for an AR-15 rifle, the same type of weapon Haddad once carried in combat. Magazines over 10 rounds have been illegal in New York since 1994, unless they were manufactured before the law went into effect. Haddad says he thought his were legal, until he found out otherwise.

“I certainly did not think I was committing a felony crime by having these,” Haddad told WGRZ. “My understanding of what I had in my possession was that it was manufactured before 1994, but the arresting officers told me otherwise after I showed them the magazines that I had in my possession.”

(Excerpt) Read more at theblaze.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: New York
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; guns; newyork; secondamendment
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1 posted on 02/24/2013 5:47:25 AM PST by lowbridge
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To: lowbridge

Rapists in NY are typically sentenced to 4-12 years (a recent forcible rape conviction netted 15 months!) and serve a small fraction of that time. To the far left fringe, being a decent American potentially capable of defending himself and others against criminals (including rapists and tyrants) is worse than being a rapist.


2 posted on 02/24/2013 5:51:35 AM PST by Pollster1
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To: lowbridge

This is an outrage. God help our children and grandchildren for what’s happening in this country.


3 posted on 02/24/2013 5:54:25 AM PST by From The Deer Stand
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To: lowbridge

The second amendment doesn’t apply in New York anymore. Why should ex port facto laws be prohibited?


4 posted on 02/24/2013 5:54:49 AM PST by InABunkerUnderSF (Because 2 terms with Jerry Brown as Governor was all I could take.)
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To: lowbridge

People who want to live free and own what ever magazine they want and own what ever legally weapon they want - should not live in NY, CA, MA, etc...but pick a state that does not infringe on their rights.

After all the “hard working” responsible residents move out of these states — there will be no longer viable income to support all the losers that depend on them for tax revenue - and all that will be left are the entitlement junkies that will be running wild demanding their masters take care of them...

...might not be able to vote them out - but it doesn’t mean you can’t move out!


5 posted on 02/24/2013 5:56:50 AM PST by BCW (http://babylonscovertwar.com/index.html)
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To: lowbridge
He is going to court. He turned down the misdemeanors. Hopefully he gets a good jury because if he is found guilty (even if he does NOT do time) he will lose his pension. It is a gamble but somebody has to stop this tyranny. The only problem is he is using ignorance of the law. I wonder where he got the empty clips. I hope from from the military after he used them. Normally you cannot keep empty clips and it would be considered theft. He has a long road. Prayers to him.
6 posted on 02/24/2013 5:58:03 AM PST by napscoordinator
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To: lowbridge

And how would the arresting officer know when they were manufactured?? Sounds like trial by cop.


7 posted on 02/24/2013 5:58:03 AM PST by OldEagle
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To: lowbridge
Did the police drive by and say “hey? clean cut white decent looking man? must be be up to no good” or is New York now setting up people on Craigslist? Un f’n believable!
8 posted on 02/24/2013 5:58:51 AM PST by Tail Gunner John
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To: lowbridge

And how would the arresting officer know when they were manufactured?? Sounds like trial by cop.


9 posted on 02/24/2013 5:59:22 AM PST by OldEagle
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To: lowbridge
I think he should have taken the plea deal. Now he is going to face a trial for a felony, and the Federal Government has found that there is no constitutional infirmity to a ban based on magazine capacity (Heller II, DC Circuit, SCOTUS declined to review the holding).

His only hope is jury nullification, but the evidence is pretty clear, and a judge will take the decision away from the jury if it doesn't convict.

The courts are corrupt on the right to keep and bear arms.

10 posted on 02/24/2013 6:01:32 AM PST by Cboldt
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To: lowbridge
I just saw a headline on Twitter where some democrats want to pass a bill allowing the police to come into your home once a year and announced to do a firearms check. Pretty scary!


www.cafenetamerica.com

11 posted on 02/24/2013 6:04:06 AM PST by tsowellfan
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To: OldEagle
Well, that is New York for you. There are better places to live.
12 posted on 02/24/2013 6:05:06 AM PST by ANGGAPO (Layte Gulf Beach Club)
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To: OldEagle
And how would the arresting officer know when they were manufactured??

Surplus mil spec mags have their date of manufacture stamped on them.

13 posted on 02/24/2013 6:05:06 AM PST by InABunkerUnderSF (Because 2 terms with Jerry Brown as Governor was all I could take.)
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To: lowbridge


14 posted on 02/24/2013 6:10:18 AM PST by Iron Munro (I miss America, don't you?)
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To: Tail Gunner John
Did the police drive by and say “hey? clean cut white decent looking man?

Possibly. Twenty years ago, I was driving my then-girlfriend and her mother to a hospital, and had to go through some part of Brooklyn where those of Italian, German or Polish ancestry were not usually found. I was driving my much-loved '66 Dodge Dart.

I was pulled over, and asked what we were doing. Never was there a hint that I was doing anything wrong. We just touched off the policeman's "One of these things doesn't belong here" alarm.
15 posted on 02/24/2013 6:10:18 AM PST by Dr. Sivana ("C'est la vie" say the old folks, it goes to show you never can tell. -- Chuck Berry)
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To: lowbridge

I bet David Gregory will cover this story — he knows all about magazines and how ordinary citizens (like himself) can possess them in all circumstances, even when the cops specifically say not to. Gregory will lead the charge to see that justice is done. [/s]


16 posted on 02/24/2013 6:13:09 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (Nothing will change until after the war.)
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To: lowbridge

Nathan Haddad and his attorney were on Cam and Company yesterday.

Updated posted by Michael Haddad 2 days ago

“I have not yet begun to...

“I have not yet begun to fight!” – John Paul Jones

Yesterday’s court proceedings clarified things! The Jefferson County District Attorney’s office is more interested in political expediency than justice. THAT IS A MISTAKE!

Consultations between Nathan’s attorney Seth Buchman and a team of attorneys specializing in the 2nd Amendment and Constitutional law have already occurred. In addition, outside organizations including the NRA and The 2nd Amendment Foundation are aware of and involved in this action. Strategy is being debated, planned out and implemented.

I want to add a special thanks to Emily Miller at the Washington Times for her careful, fair and accurate reporting. In a time when most reporters simply carry water for the government Emily truly stands out as wanting to find “truth.”

We will continue to raise funds and are prepared to take this as far as necessary to obtain justice. Nathan did not choose this path but he is on it. If this path takes him to the Supreme Court of the United States that is where we will go!

We will be sharing additional information in the coming days including actionable steps you can take.

“An unjust law is no law at all”—Augustine of Hippo

Please send interview requests, comments, or suggestions to: americans4the2nda@gmail.com

Thank you!

Nathan Haddad’s legal fund

http://www.gofundme.com/1tkukc


17 posted on 02/24/2013 6:14:08 AM PST by KeyLargo
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To: lowbridge

“I certainly did not think I was committing a felony crime by having these,” Haddad told WGRZ. “My understanding of what I had in my possession was that it was manufactured before 1994, but the arresting officers told me otherwise after I showed them the magazines that I had in my possession.” ( from the article)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Well! ....This absolutely settles it. I am **NEVER** going to New York for any reason. Why? Because what other nutty laws to they have to nail someone with?

From Ayn Rand:

“Did you really think we want those laws observed?” said Dr. Ferris. “We want them to be broken. You’d better get it straight that it’s not a bunch of boy scouts you’re up against... We’re after power and we mean it... There’s no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren’t enough criminals one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What’s there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced or objectively interpreted – and you create a nation of law-breakers – and then you cash in on guilt. Now that’s the system, Mr. Reardon, that’s the game, and once you understand it, you’ll be much easier to deal with.”


18 posted on 02/24/2013 6:17:15 AM PST by wintertime
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To: napscoordinator

Don’t mean to lecture...however -

They are called magazines...not clips.

Magazines......not clips.

Thank you.


19 posted on 02/24/2013 6:19:17 AM PST by LFOD (Formerly - Iraq, Afgahnistan - back home in Dixie.)
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To: Cboldt

“I think he should have taken the plea deal. Now he is going to face a trial for a felony,”

Nathan Haddad said last night on the Cam & Company program that he is a federal employee and does not want a criminal conviction which will ruin in chances for any career advancement or job prospects in any job where he would need such things as a security clearance.

If he were to plead guilty to misdemeanors his arrest record will still show that he was arrested for Felonies.


20 posted on 02/24/2013 6:20:14 AM PST by KeyLargo
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To: KeyLargo
Consultations between Nathan’s attorney Seth Buchman and a team of attorneys specializing in the 2nd Amendment and Constitutional law have already occurred.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

How much is this costing Nathan in money? How much in emotional anxiety and disruption to his life?

The people who do this are pigs right out of the pages of Animal Farm.

21 posted on 02/24/2013 6:21:12 AM PST by wintertime
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To: napscoordinator


22 posted on 02/24/2013 6:22:04 AM PST by Iron Munro (I miss America, don't you?)
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To: wintertime

Haven’t read Animal Farm. In know I need to.

Is this from where the moniker “Pigs” comes, in referring to police?


23 posted on 02/24/2013 6:23:19 AM PST by stanne
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To: wintertime

Ayn Rand certainly understood it.


24 posted on 02/24/2013 6:24:15 AM PST by OldEagle
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To: wintertime
Everyone should have the Sportsman channel.
25 posted on 02/24/2013 6:25:22 AM PST by KeyLargo
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To: wintertime

Certainly New York is making an example of this man to frighten others into accepting their latest gun laws.

They love this.


26 posted on 02/24/2013 6:26:56 AM PST by Venturer
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To: KeyLargo
-- If he were to plead guilty to misdemeanors his arrest record will still show that he was arrested for Felonies. --

The arrest is going to persist unless it is expunged, and even then, I think there are circumstances where a person is obliged to divulge events that would not surface in a review of government records.

My general point is that the police, the prosecutor and the courts will work in unison to find Haddad guilty. None of those entities has a favorable view of the right to keep and bear arms.

27 posted on 02/24/2013 6:27:09 AM PST by Cboldt
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To: stanne

I don’t know. I do know it was common for the Marxist revolutionaries in the U.S. ( The Bill Ayers types) to call the police pigs.


28 posted on 02/24/2013 6:27:43 AM PST by wintertime
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To: ClearCase_guy

Yeah, my first thought was that he should have just told the police that he was David Gregory.
Would have been no foul and he’d of gotten a pass.


29 posted on 02/24/2013 6:27:51 AM PST by skimbell
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To: OldEagle

I hate to keep posting on this thread, but the cop was apparently the buyer. Or am I letting my imagination run wild?


30 posted on 02/24/2013 6:29:05 AM PST by OldEagle
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Comment #31 Removed by Moderator

To: KeyLargo

It looks more and more like our preditory governments want to make felons of every citizen. That way they can utter: bring in the usual band of suspects, whenever they want to do just that. These are definitely the current dark ages of American history.


32 posted on 02/24/2013 6:30:51 AM PST by Mouton (108th MI Group.....68-71)
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To: OldEagle
And how would the arresting officer know when they were manufactured?? Sounds like trial by cop.

I have a feeling that charges will be dropped because the police will have inadvertently misplaced the magazines and are unable to prove they were illegal.

33 posted on 02/24/2013 6:33:12 AM PST by oldbrowser (They are marxists, don't call them democrats)
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To: hunosehu

You said sting.....

What if the cop and Haddad were in collusion to have an arrest and a trial to have the law thrown out?

The law is not the law if it violates the right to keep and bear arms. To kep arms, it is necessary to buy arms.


34 posted on 02/24/2013 6:33:25 AM PST by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 .....The fairest Deduction to be reduced is the Standard Deduction)
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To: BCW

People who want to live free and own what ever magazine they want and own what ever legally weapon they want - should not live in NY, CA, MA, etc...but pick a state that does not infringe on their rights.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Decent citizens shouldn’t visit there. Businesses and organizations that have yearly conventions shouldn’t schedule them in these places.


35 posted on 02/24/2013 6:33:47 AM PST by wintertime
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To: lowbridge
 photo NYFLAG_zps9d1ce27e.jpg
36 posted on 02/24/2013 6:34:16 AM PST by baddog 219
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To: Mouton

1/3 of US Returning Military Veterans Considered Mentally Unstable by the Government

The newest disorder being used as a reason to detain veterans is ODD or Oppositional Defiance Disorder. ODD is described as a mental disease wherein free thinkers, civil disobedience supporters, non-conformists, and those who question authority and are seen as being hostile toward the government are labeled mentally ill.

Psychiatrics claim that sufferers have “a recurrent pattern of negativistic, defiant, disobedient, and hostile behavior toward authority figures that persists for at least 6 months” which includes:

• Persistent stubbornness
• Resistance to directions
• Unwillingness to go along with the crowd
• Deliberately annoying others
• Testing limits by ignoring orders

http://www.offthegridnews.com/2012/08/28/13-of-us-returning-military-veterans-considered-mentally-unstable-by-the-government/


37 posted on 02/24/2013 6:38:13 AM PST by KeyLargo
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To: BCW
...might not be able to vote them out - but it doesn’t mean you can’t move out!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That is already happening. Look at Boeing:

http://www.charlestoncitypaper.com/charleston/boeings-decision-to-move-to-south-carolina-has-turned-into-a-legal-nightmare/Content?oid=3461150

(Boeing's decision to move to South Carolina has turned into a legal nightmare )

38 posted on 02/24/2013 6:39:37 AM PST by wintertime
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To: stanne
Is this from where the moniker “Pigs” comes, in referring to police?

No. In 'Animal Farm' the pigs become elites. All other animals toil to support them. The pigs were the object of the phrase from the book "All animals are equal but some are more equal than others."

I think it was during the Spanish Civil War that Republican propagandists coined "Fascist Pigs" to refer to their nationalist enemies. The American left probable adopted it from them.

'Animal Farm' is well worth reading.

39 posted on 02/24/2013 6:42:00 AM PST by InABunkerUnderSF (Because 2 terms with Jerry Brown as Governor was all I could take.)
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Comment #40 Removed by Moderator

To: lowbridge

Seven years? You can only get more than that in NY by teasing a dog, yelling at your kids, or giving the finger to an obama sticker.


41 posted on 02/24/2013 6:55:33 AM PST by Right Wing Assault (Dick Obama is more inexperienced now than he was before he was elected.)
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To: stanne

And Orwell was a disillusioned participant in the Spanish Civil War on the Republican side. ‘Animal Farm’ was written after his political epiphany, about the rise of Stalin (Napoleon the pig in the book) and the moral bankruptcy of socialism. You could argue that ‘Animal Farm’ is related to the left’s calling police “pigs” but Orwell would actually have regarded the well heeled, tenured leftists as the pigs.


42 posted on 02/24/2013 6:57:26 AM PST by InABunkerUnderSF (Because 2 terms with Jerry Brown as Governor was all I could take.)
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To: LFOD

I was in the Army in the late ‘80s to late ‘90s.

We called the standard magazine exactly that - a magazine.

But we called the 30 round magazines a ‘banana clip’. Like so many things dealing with guns, nomenclatures are mis-used repeatedly until they become normalized.

I’d love to know what they’re called in the Army today....I’m guessing banana clip is still used.


43 posted on 02/24/2013 7:03:27 AM PST by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: InABunkerUnderSF

Thanks. I really have to read it. Wo many apt allusions to it ins recent times.


44 posted on 02/24/2013 7:08:40 AM PST by stanne
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To: lowbridge

NEVER, EVER volunteer anything to the police. NEVER accede to a search without a warrant or the officer’s declaration that exigent circumstances exist for doing such - even then, declare yourself that the search is involuntarily on your part.


45 posted on 02/24/2013 7:11:49 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: Iron Munro

True,but the item on the left is commonly called a ‘stripper clip’.... additionally, what one might call a ‘magazine’ for a Garand is technically called an “En Bloc Clip”......


46 posted on 02/24/2013 7:13:44 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: wintertime

It was my impression it was a term the leftists used. anyway, it’s a must read.


47 posted on 02/24/2013 7:14:15 AM PST by stanne
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To: Iron Munro
Thanks for that info.

I'm going to start learning about guns. My husband died 2 yrs ago and left a 38 revolver, but I want a gun with a magazine - for protection. I'm getting concerned about losing our rights to protect ourselves. Funny I would never buy a gun if it were not for the libs talking about restricting our rights. BTW, my husband also had a little semi automatic pistol (my brother has it right now)- it takes .25 bullets. I think it is a colt but not sure at all. Do u think it would be good for protection? Should I have an extra clip/magazine for this pistol?

48 posted on 02/24/2013 7:18:04 AM PST by ncpatriot
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To: wintertime

It is not for nothing that the state motto of New York is The Empire State. I left and I am never moving back. They can kiss the jobs that my business creates goodbye. But for socialists like they have in New York, they would rather die than give people liberty. And since they are on the same trajectory as Detroit, that is exactly what might happen.


49 posted on 02/24/2013 7:18:53 AM PST by theBuckwheat
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To: BCW

Yes...I will be vacating California as soon as I can. These people are robbing our hard won rights as free people. They are the very same types that George W. and company had to fight and kill for 8 long years to win this once free nation. How dare they!


50 posted on 02/24/2013 7:22:53 AM PST by fabian (" And a new day will dawn for those who stand long, and the forests will echo in laughter")
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