Posted on 09/23/2003 7:50:20 AM PDT by presidio9
No dancing in the aisles or applause in church, please, we're Catholic. And we'd prefer altar boys to altar girls.
Those are some of the warnings contained in the draft of a document the Vatican (news - web sites) is preparing to crack down on what it considers "liturgical abuses" of the mass, the focus of Roman Catholic worship.
According to the authoritative Italian Roman Catholic monthly magazine "Jesus," a draft document urges the faithful to notify their bishop or the Vatican to report suspected abuses.
The magazine released an advance text of the article which will feature in its October edition.
If issued in its draft form, the document, known as a directive, could have wide-ranging ramifications on some worship practices that have come into common use in many developed countries, particularly the United States and in western Europe.
According to the magazine, the draft says the use of girl altar servers should be avoided "unless there is a just pastoral cause" and that "priests should never feel obliged to seek girls for this function."
The Vatican in 1994 gave individual bishops the power to decide whether to allow altar girls in their dioceses. But some conservative Catholics are against altar girls, saying their presence has eroded a traditional recruiting ground for priests.
Traditionalists have also seen altar girls as a foot in the door to a female priesthood, which the church bans.
Italian media reported that the initial reaction to the draft, circulated to the world's bishops, has been negative and the document may have to be at least partially modified.
The draft document also discourages applause during masses and "dances inside the sacred building."
Ironically, Pope John Paul (news - web sites)'s sermons during masses, even those in St Peter's Basilica, are often interrupted by applause.
Some of the pope's masses in Rome and around the world have included dancing, particularly those celebrations marking Asian, African or Latin American events.
The document, drafted by two Vatican departments which oversee doctrine and liturgy, was ordered by the pope who will eventually have to approve a final version.
The draft also warns against the use of non-Biblical language during the mass, such as readings from poets.
It discourages the practice where the faithful receive the wafer and wine at communion.
Catholics believe Christ is present in the wafer and wine but the document says it is preferable just to receive the wafer.
"Self-service" communion is also frowned upon. This appeared to be a reference to the faithful taking the consecrated host directly from the chalice instead of receiving it on their tongue from the hand of a priest.
The Roman Catholic Church, founded by Jesus Christ upon Peter, s here to stay. Jesus guaranteed that at the outset. Get over it!
You also seem to operate under the delusion of Church leadership "responsive" to public opinion in or out of the pews. Not in your lifetime. Not in God's lifetime.
Also, as to the "crisis", we have always had controversy but never "crisis" if that is defined as anything thaty threatens the continued existence of the Church itself. We buried the Caesars and they were a lot worse threat than anything cooked up by those shepherds who have proven unworthy. Christ xchose twelve to be shepherds or Apostles. From Christ through them, there is apostolic succession. Three Apostles were Peter, Thomas and Judas. That there are sinful shepherds is hardly news.
Straightening out the sheep in flock has always been and will always be the job of the shepherds. That some have failed or even been part of the problem does not dissolve the promises of Christ Who will be with us all days even unto the end. He did not promise that the gates of hell would not be in opposition to the Church, simply that they would not prevail.
"All things that you bind on earth are bound in Heaven--and those which you loose on Earth will be loosed in Heaven."
The Pope (successor to the man who heard these words directly) has full, complete, and universal authority over the liturgy.
You are talking to one. I can't even go to McDonald's and have a cup of coffee with a priest. All the married women can at least do that.
Holy Mass is fun and joyous to participate in. Such joy does not need expression in clapping and dancing.
Yes, and that is exactly the point. We don't want to further feminize the priesthood by only making altar service attractive to girls and girly boys.
....but isn't there something inherently feminine about putting on a white dress robe anyways?
Only if you think Jesus was inherently feminine.
SD
Of course, you can prove this...
I'm stuck. I moved on with everything except going back to church. I feel bad when I go to church.
Bishop Loverde is NOT Bishop Keating. These scandals are a LOT rarer in conservative dioceses.
Bishop Delaney of Fort Worth actually imported a levender priest (his old pal) from Rhode Island to run the diocesan BOY SCOUT program. No diocese is immune but those whose faith is othodox and whose practice is traditional have a lo fewer problems with folks who think they can reinvent the Church as they please.
No, that was neither the point I was making, nor the point I intended to make.
You're a Protestant then. Catholics recognize the Pope's authority over the Church.
SD
Black Elk,Natural Law's response is posted right above the post of yours to which I am responding.
Have you read the lives and writings of the women saints? I haven't in particular (male or female, save a few) but I would imagine they are good role models and have written some pretty great things about women in the Church. Maybe a modern saint like Edith Stein would be best. I would also highly recommend Dorothy Sayers' "Are Women Human?", though she was Anglican.
Then of course there's some woman called Mary who's been showing up quite a bit the last few centuries. I get the feeling she's pretty important. :)
That's strange. Father Juhas taught us that the Mass is The Lord's Supper. Now you say it's the about the Cross.
The Last Supper was the mystical presentation of the Cross 18 hours ahead of time. "This IS my body which IS being given up for you." "This IS my blood which IS being poured out for you." "Do this in memory of me."
The Cross fulfilled these words, and the perpetual celebration of the Mass afterwards fulfilled them.
Christ really sacrificed Himself in the Last Supper, offering Himself up with His own hands under the species of bread and wine - thus he was a priest after the order of Melchizedek who also offered a sacrifice of bread and wine. The Cross actualized this mystical offering.
The Mass is the repeated offering of the Last Supper, which represents the sacrifice of the Cross in an unbloody and mystical manner.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.