Could I ask a serious question of some Mormons? (Please?)

today | me

[Jael]

No man who rejects the testimony of Joseph Smith can enter the kingdom of God"
Doctrines of Salvation, vol. I, p. 190).

My question:
Is that what Mormons believe?
If so, how was anyone saved before 1830.

[Elsie]

" Last time I checked, the divorce rate among temple married Mormons was WAY lower than that in the general population.

" Last time I checked, the drowning rate among people who can swim was WAY lower than that in the general population.

---

DUH!

Using the 'general population' as the other side of the comparison sure makes your figures look good, don't it!?

[Elsie]

We trust to God to handle the exceptional situations with wisdom, mercy, love and justice.

 

Pick one!

[CARepubGal]

What about getting a very emphatic NO when asking the Lord if your church is true? I left the LDS church after I prayed and sincerely asked God if the things I was taught were true and came from Him. He answered No.

[Grig]

"The Journal of Discourses is a 26 volume compilation of LDS presidents and apostles sermons, covering about 35 years. There were several men who were officially assigned by the LDS Church to record the talks."

These talks were recorded by using a form of shorthand that did not have any notation for punctuation. Later they were recopied to longhand and published, but in many cases the printed version was not checked by the speaker for accuracy. Nor was any such thing as tape recorders or sound systems in existance.

"The Assistant Manager for Deseret Book Company, gave the following endorsement of the Journal of Discourses in a a letter dated June 12, 1963:"

The Assistant Manager for Deseret Book Company has no authority to declare what is or is not cannon.

"The Journal of Discourses is listed as an official publication of the LDS Church in the following books: "

The JoD is not an official publication of the Church, it was not published by the church either. Nor are official publication automaticly cannon to us. I rather doubt those books specificly refer to it as an official publication of the church but I don't have the means to check this moment. If so it is unfortunate error that could have been caused by a poorly informed editor of those books.

"The Journal of Discourses is quoted repeatedly in LDS publications and in LDS conference reports."

So are C.S. Lewis and Shakespear. Big deal. Quoting a passage from something doesn't make the whole book cannon.

"It is inconsistent of the Mormons to question the accuracy of the Journal of Discourses while the LDS leaders continue to quote from it. "

No it isn't. Just because something is not 100% accurate doesn't mean it is 100% false. We don't think the Bible is 100% accurate and we quote it far far more than the JoD.

And it isn't just 'questioning', there are cases where JoD accounts of a sermon do not match with accounts by others who were there. The whole Adam-God thing is a prime example of that. It appears that the JoD account has a critical ommision that changes the meaning of much of the sermon.

[Wrigley]

The whole Adam-God thing is a prime example of that. It appears that the JoD account has a critical ommision that changes the meaning of much of the sermon.

Oh, is that how you're explaining this now.

[CARepubGal]

Great graphic but the Stooges do deserve better (Please FReepmail me this! I have a friend who would love this graphic).

[CARepubGal]

Not faith + fact but 100% reliance on feeling.

[CARepubGal]

I think she meant temple divorces. I had a couple friends go through a civil divorce but were under the impression they were still counted as wife #1 or two on the LDS rosters. How do you work the breaking of sealings part of divorce?

[Grig]

Oh please. Laake's book is a reflection of the mental illness that lead her to kill herself. Her claim are far from the truth.

[RnMomof7]

Grig wrote
**Last time I checked, the divorce rate among temple married Mormons was WAY lower than that in the general population.

**

---

You need to check again Grig




34% of non-denominational church members,

29% of Baptists,

25% of mainline Protestants,

24% of Mormons,

21% of Catholics,

21% of Lutherans,

17% of Unification Church members, according to an different surve

Among followers of different religions: The following percentage of adults have been divorced:

30% of Jews.

27% of born-again Christians, 24% of non-born-again, and

21% of Atheists & Agnostics.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_diov.htm

[Grig]

"What SHOULD disturb YOU is that Your organization just rolled over and acquiesed to the gov't!!"

And once again you ignore that part of OD1 that clealy identifies that they were willing to oppose the government, but God commanded otherwise. Is that the 4th or 5th time you've done that, I've lost track.

I would rather fight the government than have my family torn appart by them and I'm sure they felt the same way. Instead the did submit their will to God's will.

[restornu]

I was watching some movies of today a little of each looking for something! most of them were late 90's and I was so put off by the way younger people think today! It was all how to wrangle without shame! I got this feeling in my stomach that I had to turn the station! It is so foreign to me the thing of many not all, but many who seem to have their conscience seared!

I for a time reflected that is also how I felt when I see those on this threard like R7, Del, PP, havoc, drj, Elsie, Wrig, scripter, etc. It is why I do say things that I should know better. I feel like I have Chinese handcuffs on and no matter how one to trys, it keeps getting twisted way out of from what it is!

It is not my faith that is challenge for I know I will leave this earth LDS.

It is the hateful display that others will inflick on another! and try to justify it is telling the truth, or whatevey else they try to serve! Nothing in their mind crosses the line.

I can only feel to do this one must be VOID of feeling the sweet gentle spirit of the Lord!

[Wrigley]

It was all how to wrangle without shame!

Huh? How does one wrangle?

[drstevej]

You claim a gentle spirit but you are a habitual name caller and regularly impugn the motives of others.

*** It is why I do say things that I should know better.***

You blame us for your actions. Restornu, you really need to look in a mirror.

[Grig]

"As I demonstrated to Grig a few weeks ago, you're pulling James 1:5 out of context: "

Demonstrated? You never did any such thing. You simply declared it only applies to trial because that's what v4 is about and backed away from any request to support your position.

Rad_J, if you want to check it out start at http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/806452/posts?page=131#131 and follow our conversation. I think you'll enjoy it and it beats going over that same topic again.

[RnMomof7]

For a church without a "problem " with depression you guys have alot of support

Look just at the Google page

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=Depression++in+the+LDS&btnG=Google+Search

[Grig]

"Polygamy might have happened in the Bible but it was not Gods will."

Whoa, God gave David plural wives against his own will? Who forced God to do that?

"How do you explain this from the Book of Mormon? Or is that just an opinion too? Jacob 2:23-24..."

Still haven't read verse 30 yet?

[scripter]

Demonstrated? You never did any such thing. You simply declared it only applies to trial because that's what v4 is about and backed away from any request to support your position.

Listen, brown eyes, both of us know you have no clue what context is. You're not fooling anybody with this act. And if you keep this up I will go right back through that entire thread and show you to be the time waster and game player that you are.

[RnMomof7]

Grig wrote
**Oh please. Laake's book is a reflection of the mental illness that lead her to kill herself. Her claim are far from the truth.***

---

Another Mormon Woman that did not suffer from Depression?

News about Mormons, Mormonism,
and the LDS Church
Sent on Mormon-News: 31Oct00


By Kent Larsen

Phoenix Journalist Says Laake Blamed Mormons for Her Mental Illness

PHOENIX, ARIZONA -- In a tribute to Mormon journalist Deborah Laake, who committed suicide earlier this year, Phoenix journalist Terry Greene Sterling says that Laake blamed her clinical depression on "Mormonism and the men in her life." Laake was the author of the controversial tell-all "Secret Ceremonies," which detailed LDS Temple ceremonies and led to her excommunication from the LDS Church.

Laake's book was published in the spring of 1993 and became an immediate success, appearing on the New York Times' bestseller list for 15 weeks. Laake went on to appear on talk shows, fielding questions about the book and trying to explain why she claimed that her religion nearly destroyed her.

But Sterling says that she didn't realize the extent of Laake's mental illness, which Sterling says she saw as early as 1989. That year Laake won a top Arizona writing award for her work as a journalist on Phoenix's alternative New Times. Laake ordered an assistant to bring a dozen long-stemmed American Beauties to the ceremonies, so that the roses could be given to her at the award ceremony, at which Laake gave "an offensively self-congratulatory acceptance speech." According to Sterling, Laake remains the only recipient to demand roses. Sterling also says that Laake picked fights with other editors and writers on the New Times' staff who she perceived as a threat

Sterling reads "Secret Ceremonies" differently than most Mormons, calling it a "fascinating and compelling read about Laake's struggle to survive waves of self-destructive depression." She says Laake blamed Mormonism and the men in her life for "terrible dark spells that followed giddy manic highs."

After writing Secret Ceremonies," Laake developed breast cancer, and blamed the side effects of chemotherapy for preventing her from writing again. "I often wondered whether she was actually paralyzed by depression," says Sterling. Laake then moved repeatedly between Phoenix and Charleston, South Carolina. Sterling says she last saw Laake after her mother died. During dinner with friends, she fell apart and cried over the refusal of local LDS Church officials to let her give a eulogy at her mother's funeral or sit at the front of the church with the family. According to Sterling, Laake couldn't understand that her attack on Mormonism in "Secret Ceremonies" was the reason.

Source:

Secret grief

[CARepubGal]

Rest: You are the one who backbites, personally attacks and really brings a "spirit of contention" into the room. Please leave me and my mote alone and I will avoid pointing to the beam in your eye.