A Brief Critique of Hyper-Calvinism

A Puritan's Mind ^ | C. Matthew McMahon

[Jerry_M]

More information on the subject can be found in A Primer on Hyper-Calvinism.

[JenB]

So that whole long essay was just saying that Calvinism, like any other idea, can be taken to silly extremes? Even I can see that that's hardly logically consistent; after all, God uses us to convert others. Since we don't know which currently unsaved wretch is actually elect, we have to witness to all of them, right? Anyway thanks for the explanation. Makes more sense than that essay. Half those big words probably weren't even English.

[drstevej]

My view is that the atonement was sufficient for and provided for all but efficient for the elect only. Only in the case of the elect is the gift of faith imparted through regeneration by the Holy Spirit. My view of irresistable grace is aligned with Calvinism.

Now, I see the logic of making the extent of the provision equal to the extent of it's application, I just find key texts that keep me from connecting the dots. Both the work of Christ on the Cross and the work of the Spirit in regeneration are required in the redemption of the elect.

[Jerry_M]

"They consider it a silly argument on Hyper-Calvinism's part."

So?

There has been no dearth of "silly arguments" on these threads.

BTW, have you taken time to think about what I said to you yesterday? If you think that glorified saints in heaven will retain the freedom to rebel against God, yet NEVER will, how is that logically different from my believe that unelect sinners retain the freedom to please God, yet NEVER will?

[Gargantua]

Actually, being a "Christian believer" means a number of things, including that we are obedient to Christ's Biblical commands to us.

Among these is the active participation in God's Harvest of souls through witnessing, prayer, and evangelical works. ALL of the believers in Christ are called to be disciples of Jesus, and are commanded to spread the gospel to both the un-churched and the falsley churched.

[Jerry_M]

I think that we are on the same page somewhat. In the end analysis, not all sin is atoned for since hell will be populated with those who have no covering for their sin. If the atonement is limitless, then all are saved.

[Jerry_M]

Re. 45. Agreed.

Jesus said (numerous times), If you love me, you will keep my commandments.

[xzins]

...How?...

The Holy Spirit awakens and convicts through prevenient grace and the person chooses to place their confident trust in the revealed truth or to reject/ignore.

Calvin's answer would be that God has once for all determined both whom he would admit to salvation and whom he would condemn to destruction.

That's where hyper-Calvinists get their belief that regeneration precedes belief in Christ. That determinism working with total inability.

[CCWoody]

Since we don't know which currently unsaved wretch is actually elect, we have to witness to all of them, right? ... Half those big words probably weren't even English.

Ha, sometimes in these discussions, I feel like I need some kind of special dictionary to understand what is going on. LOL

[xzins]

What I learned in this article is that hyper-Calvinism includes a number of points more than you all have been letting on.....you've insinuated that hyper-Calvinism relates to the primitive baptists (eg) not witnessing.

Therefore, since I've added to my own understanding more information about what constitutes hyper-Calvinism, I'd say I had a fairly open mind.

[Jerry_M]

In my 46, the "somewhat" in the first sentence could be misleading. If I was a better wordsmith I would speak about difference in terminology, not differences in core understanding. I meant to imply a semantic difference, but was woefully unsuccessful.

[xzins]

I've not had much opportunity, but I keep trying to see how prevenient grace applies in heaven. I don't see a necessity for prevenient grace in heaven. I'd be nice to have all the tenets side by side in some kind of list.

[Jerry_M]

Believe what you want. As you have told me before, why should I care what you believe?

Did you go to the Primer on Hyper-Calvinism yet? You might just get a different perspective on the topic.

[Jerry_M]

" I don't see a necessity for prevenient grace in heaven."

Well, seeing as it is a "man-made construct" (thanks wc), and doesn't exist on earth, why would you expect to find it in heaven?

[xzins]

I saved the link to my read file. His opening statement appears similar to the one in the article above.

[Jerry_M]

"Therefore, since I've added to my own understanding more information about what constitutes hyper-Calvinism, I'd say I had a fairly open mind."

All that you have demonstrated here is the fact that you now contend that all who believe that regeneration precedes conversion are hyper-Calvinists.

As a result, you now feel free to dismiss every Calvinist as a "hyper". Of course, I might just make my own conclusions, and start considering every non-Calvinist to be a "universalist". After all, you folks believe in an unlimited atonement, don't you?

[JenB]

That was an excellent link, much clearer than the posted article. Now I know for certain that I'm not a hyper-Calvinist, nor does my church promote hyper-Calvinism. Also the related essay on supralapsarianism was informative - at least I know what it is now even if I can't spell it! I guess I'm more of an infralapsarian Calvinist.

Anyway this is an interesting debate, I just hope it doesn't get as dirty as a lot of other Calvinist/Arminianist threads.

[xzins]

doesn't exist on earth

The term "prevenient grace" is certainly a term which a man came up with. It describes, however, a bible truth.

The truth is that "the Holy Spirit exerts influence on the consciences of men apart from the Holy Scriptures. Paul says that "the law of God is written in the heart of every human (Rom 1:19; 2:15); and that God has never left Himself without a witness (Act 14:17). Therefore, it is the grace of the Holy Spirit that prepares the heart of a man who is helpless in sin.

[Jerry_M]

"Anyway this is an interesting debate, I just hope it doesn't get as dirty as a lot of other Calvinist/Arminianist threads."

You and me both!

(Glad that I could help, with the unintended consequence being your introduction to lapsarian speculative theology.)

[Jerry_M]

"Therefore, it is the grace of the Holy Spirit that prepares the heart of a man who is helpless in sin."

A Calvinist would change you statement to read:
Therefore, it is the grace of the Holy Spirit that regenerates the heart of a man who is dead in sin.

You don't believe that men are "dead in trespasses and sins", only that he has a spiritual cold. You think he needs "chicken soup" (prevenient grace), I believe that he needs a "new heart of flesh" transplant (saving grace).