Posted on 03/30/2002 7:53:37 PM PST by malakhi
Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
Who met this condition? To say "no" is disobedient. To work after saying NO is to work because you will it, not because He does.
To say "NO" is defiant and disrespectful, but not disobedient. This is because obedience/disobedience is in the complying/not complying of the subject of a command.
Even if you were to say "Yes" to a command, and then, immediately, proceeded to comply with the command, you would still be doing it because you willed it. It is simply that you have bent your will to comply with that of another.
The clue, for me, is that you are both choosing the same son that the Priests did. Are you saying that the priests were right?
As JH previously stated, JESUS, when dealing with the Pharisees, often ask questions of them which had very obvious answers, and, just as obviously, reflected badly upon the Pharisees. As JH further said, in most of these cases, the Pharisees realized what Jesus was doing and would, simply, refuse to give Him an answer.
Are you saying Jesus was saying sinners went to Heaven?
Well, of course sinners (in that they have sinned) go to heaven! Forgiven sinners! That's what the publicans and harlots were who JESUS was speaking of. They had been sinners, but had listened to and believed JESUS' preaching, and so, had received forgiveness of their sins.
This is exactly what the Pharisees were unwilling to do. The Pharisees thought that they had it all in the bag, due to their works. When JESUS would explain to them that they needed forgiveness just like publicans and harlots, they were highly insulted. The Pharisees steadfastly refused to hear JESUS' message and so, their sins (the chiefest of which was pride) continued unforgiven.
I would recommend more study of the Gospels to check this out.
Why not start with the following passages and proceed from there ...Luke 7:36 Now one of the Pharisees invited Jesus to have dinner with him, so he went to the Pharisee's house and reclined at the table.
37 When a woman who had lived a sinful life in that town learned that Jesus was eating at the Pharisee's house, she brought an alabaster jar of perfume,
38 and as she stood behind him at his feet weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears. Then she wiped them with her hair, kissed them and poured perfume on them.
39 When the Pharisee who had invited him saw this, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet, he would know who is touching him and what kind of woman she is-- that she is a sinner."
40 Jesus answered him, "Simon, I have something to tell you." "Tell me, teacher," he said.
41 "Two men owed money to a certain moneylender. One owed him five hundred denarii, and the other fifty.
42 Neither of them had the money to pay him back, so he canceled the debts of both. Now which of them will love him more?"
43 Simon replied, "I suppose the one who had the bigger debt canceled." "You have judged correctly," Jesus said.
44 Then he turned toward the woman and said to Simon, "Do you see this woman? I came into your house. You did not give me any water for my feet, but she wet my feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair.
45 You did not give me a kiss, but this woman, from the time I entered, has not stopped kissing my feet.
46 You did not put oil on my head, but she has poured perfume on my feet.
47 Therefore, I tell you, her many sins have been forgiven-- for she loved much. But he who has been forgiven little loves little."
48 Then Jesus said to her, "Your sins are forgiven."
49 The other guests began to say among themselves, "Who is this who even forgives sins?"
50 Jesus said to the woman, "Your faith has saved you; go in peace."
Luke 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:
18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
Sure I know what you mean. Mack and I were just talking how quiet it has been around here this evening. It's sad but probably for the best. She finally gets to relax. We're trying to figure out if the other two realize where she is. Do dogs know that sort of thing? I keep thinking of the movie "Where the Red Fern Gorwns" Do you suppose that is true, not about the fern but that one animal grieves for another?
Becky
I think so although what we experience as grief probably isn't quite the same as what an animal experiences. But there seems to be something there, especially with dogs.
I should have guessed...they seem to have just about every kind of Dummy or Idiots book out there. :-)
I should have guessed...they seem to have just about every kind of Dummy or Idiots book out there. :-)
I should have guessed...they seem to have just about every kind of Dummy or Idiots book out there. :-)
Doug, whatever did you think I was talking about?
I don't know. Judging from my past inability to correctly sort things out I'm afraid to say anything. :-)
And to obey his commandments.
Matthew 23:
[1] Then said Jesus to the crowds and to his disciples,
[2] "The scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses' seat;
[3] so practice and observe whatever they tell you, but not what they do; for they preach, but do not practice.
No, because Calvinists do not believe in OSAS, they believe in 'perservation of the Saints' which is different.
In other words, you may be one of the 'elect' but only your fruit will tell and then not fully until the end of your life.
You could be 'deceived' into thinking you were one of the elect.
Once saved always saved states that once a profession of faith has been made, that person (if he meant it) is now in union with Christ, one Body with Him and His bride.
It is that relationship that is the basis of 'OSAS' not unconditional election.
That is the Dispensational Baptist view.
Here is a further one. From the Arminian perspective, how could we know that no one in heaven will exercise free will (and free will is a part of being truly human and the only position consistent with a God of love, they say) and decide to leave heaven or choose to disobey. Would not the absence of free will in heaven be a tryannical action on the part of God?
In the Church age, your choice for God is final.
Free will is an issue in the flesh, not in the Resurrection body, when our will will unite with God's.
The believer in heaven can no more reject God then can the Holy angels who chose for God when Lucifer rebelled.
That you can sin now is an aspect of your free will which even Calvinists admit, but 'freedom' will not longer be there either.
Unless you want to say that that God is responsible for your sinning.
Amazing how philosophical speculation is more important to a Calvinist then what the Bible says (Col.2:8)
Here is another view:
The Seven Churches of The Revelation
or
Google : < "Seven Churches" Revelation >
chuck <truth@YeshuaHaMashiach>
Chapter1. horses been around 60 million years, not a theory but a fact
Chapter2. different roles for horses. required a lot of concentration to read.,
Chapter3. different kinds of horses and identification. Lot' of detail. Fell asleep reading. Will have to review
Chapter4. bloodlines. I skipped it for now
Chapter5. Here we go
no markings the same. useful to identify if stolen
never walk directly behind a horse. duh!
Chapter6. Among a list of other things, don't give your horse: marijuana, tobacco, or St. John's wort! What have some horse owners been up to, that they would have to put something like this in a book? Guess it explains chapter 1. lol
I guess my dog never read this book....I don't know if I should put a smiley or sad face after that remark:) :(
What have some horse owners been up to, that they would have to put something like this in a book?
Well...my horse gets beer:) The book sounds like it belongs in the bathroom, and not for reading:) Just kidding.
Did you go shopping for one yet?
Becky
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