Posted on 03/30/2002 7:53:37 PM PST by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
Quester: Whosoever is born of God (a one-time event) will overcome the world
Please note the 2 different words. Sounds to me more like God-ly (God led) actions overcome the world for those who believe.
v.
1 John 5:2 This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands.
3 This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome,
4 for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith.
5 Who is it that overcomes the world? Only he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.
Was leaving out the part about "to obey His commands" intentional?
Verses 2 & 3 do not speak explicitly to overcoming, which was the issue at hand.
You might want to rethink that.
3 This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome,
4 for everyone born of God overcomes the world.
I John 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world.
Quester: Whosoever is born of God (a one-time event) will overcome the world.
Please note the 2 different words. Sounds to me more like Godly (God led) actions overcome the world for those who believe.
Whatever else is ... true christians are born of God.
Same Apostle ...John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Wow...don't make be backtrack through all the posts to see who wrote "you have freepmail" before me. :-)
Sure, I'll get a reply back to you sometime this weekend.
Thanks...I really appreciate it.:-)
I have always thought that God was unchanging and man's basic nature was unchanging. Therefore scripture is applicable with adaptations for times and places,no matter the original addressees,although that also can be very important.
I think many go beyond the limits when interpreting and others fail to see what is clearly there.To me,trying to expand the letters to encompass the ages of the churches is an example of stretching the limits.
Nonetheless,I always appreciate your responses because they often open up a view that I had not considered.
How about this ?
Those who believe that Jesus is the Son of God ...
... are born of God,
... will love God and those others begotten of God,
... and will keep His commandments.
Correction!
How about this ?
Those who believe that Jesus is the Son of God ...
... are born of God,
... will love God and those others begotten of God,
... will keep His commandments,
... and will overcome the world.
I'm all for that. Nonetheless, keeping the commandments is still a part of overcoming. :-)
Who would of thunk it? :)
You find your policy?
BigMack
I'll go diggin around now.
When he was about six,they said it was nothing more than the fact that he had an extremely,thin chest wall and they could hear more going on under his chest wall than they could in others. As he put on weight the murmur disappeared.
Nonetheless,prayers are always a good thing and maybe all the extra prayers will make her a sweeter,holier little girl than the ordinary child. I often wonder why some children and adultsseem to have more inate virtues than others and consider that it just might be attributable to prayers sent up by relatives who love them.
Yes, one and the same.
This assigning Biblical church identities to current denominations is something new to me, and XSt linked to it the other day as well. Is this something you still believe? Any links to reasons why, rather than them just being the Churches back then?
Most prophetic stories have duel meanings or can be applied at any time in history.
Personally I believe it's there for all men to read at any time in history, and to judge whether or not he fits into any of those seven categories.
Which ever one your in, God either admonishes you to turn around, or he congratulates us on the others.
JH :-)
Reward for enduring temptation, = The crown of life.
Penalty for not enduring Life? = You were never a believer, Gods Spirit was never in you, so you suffer the same as all non believers.
James 1:12 Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
One will not simply receive the crown because he endured temptation, he will only receive it if he first loved the Lord, which gave him eternal life, not enduring the temptation. Two different things here, salvation and rewards.
You must be given salvation, before God will give you your rewards. Read it again
JH :-)
Kim, the danger-prone teenage daughter of Counter Terrorism Unit special agent Jack Bauer, fits a certain niche in these frantic times. Without meaning to, she has come to represent the vapidity and naive innocence of a Britney Nation caught up in something deadly serious, with only her wits and the occasional visibility of her nipples to save her. ...
Kim is us. We are Kim. Every time your cell phone doesn't work, every time you get kidnapped, every time you lose your car keys or, say, can't get away from trained assassins, or every time you're stuck in traffic (or causing a jam, like the time you set that deputy's vehicle on fire, or the time the cops found your boss's dead wife in the trunk of the car, which, technically, you stole from him), every time your boyfriend loses his leg trying to help you thwart disaster, just think of Kim and know you're not alone.
So is it your conclusion, that we who believe that eternal life is a free gift of God, and the works and overcoming and endurance’s we face in life are rewarded after we're given eternal life, that we are not working to change our lives and endure as much as you, who are solely depending on your works to get you there?
If you feel they are different, can you explain why?
Let me try. I smoked for over 35 years. I had stopped many times, and once for over 11 years, but I always came back, and it was harder every time to stop.
I used every head game I could come up with, from keeping my smokes locked in the trunk of the car and having to go out every time I needed a fix, to smoking cigars that I hated the taste, thinking I would stop, but I simply developed a taste for them.
One day as I prayed, I found my self-asking God to give me the strength to quit, but not for myself, but for my wife.
She had lost her first husband to smoking, and here I was starting to put her through the same thing again, plus the danger to her health from 2nd hand smoke.
I left my pipes, tobacco and lighters on the outside table, and never smoked again.
I didn't struggle with my will power, or summon my inner strength, or beat my chest, God healed me and I walked away from smoking with no more then a few dreams that I was smoking again.
Now, will I be given a reward for quitting the habit because I did it unselfishly for my wife, or will God say, no rewards for you, you made me do all the work for you?
I will gladly give God all the credit, but I doubt He wants it, and possibly my faith will warrant some consideration also.
Does God only consider us overcomers if we struggle and sweat by our own powers to do it on our own? If so, why did Jesus die for us if we could have become perfect on our own?
Please read John 1:12 and 13 several times.
V-12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:,/b>
13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Does this not tell us that it's not by our own human birth or our will power of the flesh that we become the sons of God?
Tell me how you read Verse 13.
JH :-)
Does God only consider us overcomers if we struggle and sweat by our own powers to do it on our own? If so, why did Jesus die for us if we could have become perfect on our own?
Jim, if you are still asking these same, misguided questions now, after everything, then you simply are not listening to anythign being said.
Nobody here is saying that we can do things "on our own" to attain salvation. Nobody is solely depending on his own works. Nobody thinks we can become perfect on our own.
You are still fighting against a caricature.
SD
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