Posted on 03/30/2002 7:53:37 PM PST by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
The son didn't need any mediator between himself and his father. He didn't need to perform any sacrifice, either. He repented and returned. That's all that was required of him.
SD
Paul describes the Church as the bride of Christ. If one believes that the Church is the body of those who are saved (whether visibile or invisible) then it seems to me that they are the same thing.
Heck, if Isaiah 12:2 didn't convince you, then you're hopeless. ;o)
Behold, God is my salvation;
I will trust, and will not be afraid;
for God YHWH is my strength and my song,
and He has become my salvation. (Isaiah 12:2)
How can God "become" something? Isn't He unchanging?
Unless, that is, He became salvation by becoming man.
SD
GOTTA LOVE THOSE PROPHETS.
Yes, but we need to use human language to talk about Him.
Also, "He has become my salvation" could just as easily suggest a change in me, don't you think?
Unless, that is, He became salvation by becoming man.
"Has become". Present perfect tense. Are you suggesting that Jesus was born 700 BCE?
It could. But it doesn't.
"Has become". Present perfect tense. Are you suggesting that Jesus was born 700 BCE?
Who says the prophet was only capable of speaking about himself in the present tense?
SD
GOTTA LOVE THOSE PROPHETS.
Uh, ventana, the "by becoming man" part was Dave's addition. ;o)
On the other hand...
God is not man, that he should lie,
or a son of man, that he should repent. (Numbers 23:19)
Yep, gotta love them prophets! ;o)
That's your opinion.
Who says the prophet was only capable of speaking about himself in the present tense?
Nope, Dave, you can't have it both ways. You have claimed that it doesn't refer to the prophet. So you have to accept that he is referring to God. So Isaiah is saying that "God has become my salvation" -- which means that this happened at or prior to the time Isaiah wrote the passage.
Not according to John the Beloved:
Right.
1 John 2 4He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.
Whose point are you arguing? I am arguing that we need to work out or faith, and that faith is accompanied by righteous works, to be genuine. That we are not saved just by saying we have faith, but by living and persevering in the faith all of our days.
This is exactly what John says here. One who says "I know Him" but does not keep the Commandments is a liar.
How much more clear does this have to be? We are saved not by saying we have faith, but by living it.
By living the faith you can know that you are saved. Not by just one day saying you have faith.
SD
The parts I wished to emphasize were God is not a man and nor a son of man.
Yep. it is the walking the walk that gets us there.
v.
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