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To: af_vet_1981

I think that the standard Catholic approach is to worship Mary which is idol worship. Mary was specially picked to be the mother of Jesus, but she was a sinful person just like anyone.

Only Jesus was sinless, the only Son of God and only Jesus should be worshipped.


47 posted on 03/06/2022 6:51:20 PM PST by Jim W N (MAGA by restoring the Gospel of the Grace of Christ (Jude 3) and our Free Constitutional Republic!)
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To: Jim W N
You did not answer the question, "Do you think Mary is a goddess ?"

Instead, I understood you to assert that Mary was totally depraved according to John Calvin ("a sinful person just like anyone"). Is that what you believe ?
48 posted on 03/06/2022 6:56:56 PM PST by af_vet_1981 (The bus came by and I got on, That's when it all began)
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To: Jim W.; MHGinTN; aMorePerfectUnion; metmom; Old Yeller
I think that the standard Catholic approach is to worship Mary which is idol worship.

I worshipped Mary, when I was a Catholic. Now, I am an ex Catholic, and I don’t do that anymore. 🤗

53 posted on 03/06/2022 9:30:26 PM PST by Mark17 (USAF ATCer, Retired. Father of USAF pilot. ATCers & pilots, the only required elements of aviation.)
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To: Jim W N
"I think that the standard Catholic approach is to worship Mary which is idol worship."

Well, you see that Catholics argue that they do not use the word that is only used for worship, therefore even though they can engage in adulation and behavior that can describe worship in the Bible, and more than one word is used for worship, then Catholics deny that they worship Mary. All the while claiming that we worship the Bible (and which they claim Rome gave us and therefore fallaciously reason that we should follow her, and essentially make a god out of her, while it is Scripture that speaks as wholly inspired of God, not popes and councils, and Scripture is what directs us to worship God, and not to think of mortals above that which is written - 1 Cor. 4:6 - which Catholics can really "jump the shark" in doing).

One would have a hard time in Bible times explaining kneeling before a statue and praising the entity it represented in the unseen world, beseeching such for Heavenly help, and making offerings to them, and giving glory and titles and ascribing supernatural attributes to such which are never given in Scripture to created beings (except to false gods), including having the uniquely Divine power glory to hear and respond to virtually infinite numbers of prayers individually addressed to them.

Moses, put down those rocks! I was only engaging in hyper dulia, not adoring her. Can't you tell the difference?

1 Corinthians 3:21 states, “Therefore let no man glory in men. “ and 1 Corinthians 4:6 states that ye might learn in us not to think *of men* above that which is written.” Although this is in the context of sectarianism due to Corinthians elevating particular leaders above that which is written in Scripture, the principle applies to elevating Mary above that which is written.

It should be stated that my objection is not to Mary being honored as the holy chosen vessel to bring forth Christ, but to the excess ascriptions, appelations, exaltation, and adoration (and the manner of exegesis behind it), ascribed to the Catholic Mary, whether officially or by Catholics (with implicit sanction of authority). And which presumes that bowing down to a statute and attributing to the person it represent attributes and glory that are uniquely ascribed to God/Christ in Scripture, including the power to hear in Heaven incessant multitudinous mental prayers addressed to them from earth and respond to them, and imploring such for heavenly aid, would be understood and vindicated as merely being "hyperdulia," and not "latria" (which Rome states is the manner of adoration reserved for God).

As making that distinction itself is presumptuous, the Scriptures do not sanction religiously bowing down to any statue in supplication, nor supplies even one single prayer to anyone in Heaven but the Lord (crying "Abba, Father," Gal. 4:6; not "Mama, Mother"), nor in instructions on who to pray to ("our Father who art in Heaven," not "our Mother").

Note that many Catholic Marian attributions much parallel even that of Christ. For in the the Catholic quest to almost deify Mary, it is taught by Catholics*,

Mary was a holy, virtuous instrument of God, but of whom Scripture says relatively little, while holy fear ought to restrain ascribing positions, honor, glory and powers to a mortal that God has not revealed as given to them, and or are only revealed as being possessed by God Himself. But like as the Israelites made an instrument of God an object of worship, (Num. 21:8,9; 2Kg. 18:4) Catholics have magnified Mary far beyond what is written and warranted and even allowed, based on what is in Scripture.

In addition, although (technically) Mary is not to be worshiped in the same sense that God is worshiped, yet the distinctions between devotion to Mary and the worship of God are quite fine, and much due to the psychological appeal of a heavenly mother (especially among those for whom Scripture is not supreme), then the historical practice of Catholics has been to exalt Mary above that which is written. As the Catholic Encyclopedia states, "By the sixteenth century, as evidenced by the spiritual struggles of the Reformers, the image of Mary had largely eclipsed the centrality of Jesus Christ in the life of believers." (Robert C. Broderick, ed., The Catholic Encyclopedia, revised and updated; NY: Thomas Nelson Publishers, 1987, pp.32,33)

The practice of praying to departed saints and Mary was one that developed, helped by pagan influences, for Scripture provides no example of any believer praying to anyone in Heaven by the Lord, and reveals that doing otherwise was a practice of pagans, including to the “Queen of Heaven.” (Jer. 44:17,18,19,25). The Catholic Encyclopedia speculates that a further reinforcement of Marian devotion, “was derived from the cult of the angels, which, while pre-Christian in its origin, was heartily embraced by the faithful of the sub-Apostolic age. It seems to have been only as a sequel of some such development that men turned to implore the intercession of the Blessed Virgin. This at least is the common opinion among scholars, though it would perhaps be dangerous to speak too positively. Evidence regarding the popular practice of the early centuries is almost entirely lacking...,” (Catholic Encyclopedia > Devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary) Yet, as expected, it imagines this practice came from the apostles and NT church, but which never exampled or instructed it, and instead showed that the believer has immediate access to God in the Divine Christ, (Heb. 10:19), who is the all sufficient and immediate intercessor between God (the Father) and man. (Heb. 2:17,18; 4:15,16) To the glory of God

86 posted on 03/07/2022 11:41:35 AM PST by daniel1212 (Turn to the Lord Jesus as a damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save U + be baptized + follow Him!)
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