Why Heretics Hate Mary and We Should Love Her More

One Peter Five ^ | August 5, 2019 | Timothy Flanders

[Iscool]

St. Jerome shews, by divers examples, that this expression of the Evangelist was a manner of speaking usual among the Hebrews, to denote by the word until, only what is done, without any regard to the future.
Thus it is said, Genesis 8. 6 and 7, that Noe sent forth a raven, which went forth, and did not return till the waters were dried up on the earth. That is, did not return any more.

So this is what some Catholic commentator stated about the issue...Whether it was Jerome or not, I don't know...

[7] "Did not return": The raven did not return into the ark; but (as it may be gathered from the Hebrew) went to and fro; sometimes going to the mountains, where it found carcasses to feed on: and other times returning, to rest upon the top of the ark.

Hogwash...And I'll show you why...This is the actual scripture;

Gen 8:7  And he sent forth a raven, which went forth to and fro, until the waters were dried up from off the earth. 

There is absolutely no suggestion that the raven landed anywhere...The fact that Noah knew the bird was flying back and forth, no doubt to all points on the compass lets us know the bird only landed on the ark until the waters were dried up...AND,

Gen 8:8  Also he sent forth a dove from him, to see if the waters were abated from off the face of the ground; 
Gen 8:9  But the dove found no rest for the sole of her foot, and she returned unto him into the ark, for the waters were on the face of the whole earth:

Little odd that the raven could find land but the dove couldn't eh???

Also Isaias 46. 4, God says: I am till you grow old. Who dare infer that God should then cease to be:

Sheesh...You don't even read your own Douay Catholic scripture...Here it is...

[4] Even to your old age I am the same, and to your grey hairs I will carry you: I have made you, and I will bear: I will carry and will save.

It doesn't even have til or until in it...Where are you getting your junk from???

Here's the actual scripture...

Isa 46:3  Hearken unto me, O house of Jacob, and all the remnant of the house of Israel, which are borne by me from the belly, which are carried from the womb: 
Isa 46:4  And even to your old age I am he; and even to hoar hairs will I carry you: I have made, and I will bear; even I will carry, and will deliver you. 

God saith to his divine Son: Sit on my right hand till I make thy enemies thy footstool. Shall he sit no longer after his enemies are subdued?

That's exactly right...And when Jesus stand up, people better start worrying...

[Iscool]

And it would not be *cousin*.

There's already a word for cousin used in the scripture so we know Jesus siblings are not cousins, or kin...What seals the deal is Jesus' sisters...

sisters
ἀδελφή
adelphē
ad-el-fay'
Feminine of G80; a sister (natural or ecclesiastical): - sister.

Unless there were some nuns floatin' around back then, Jesus' sisters were natural sisters...

[ravenwolf]

Matthew 27:55-56 55 Many women were there, watching from a distance. They had followed Jesus from Galilee to care for his needs. 56 Among them were Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Joseph, and the mother of Zebedee’s sons.

John 19:25 25 Near the cross of Jesus stood his mother, his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene.

luke 6;14
Simon (whom he named Peter), his brother Andrew, James, John, Philip, Bartholomew, 15Matthew, Thomas, James son of Alphaeus,

Alphaeus and Clopas are said to be one and the same.

Clopas is the husband of the mother of james and Joses

And it is this mary who is the mother of James and Joses .

Jesus had brothers and sisters but Jesus was Mary`s only child.

also I would remind you that the jews knew nothing about it
so what they said about brothers and sisters mean nothing,
do you think they believed God was the father of jesus?.

Mary was special and I think God kept her that way, this has nothing to do with Jewish tradition this happened to be the greatest miracle God has ever peformed, don`t take it so lightly if you really believe.

You should hang your head in shame trashing The mother of the son of God the way you do.

[smvoice]

You know Jesus did stand one time already.
Acts 7:55-56. Stephen’s vision of heaven just before he is martyred:

“But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up steadfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God.”

“And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man, STANDING on the right hand of God.”

This was Israel’s third and final strike. Strike one was Israel rejecting God the Father after He told them that Christ was His beloved Son. Strike two was rejecting Christ and demanding His death. Strike three was rejecting the Holy Spirit at Pentecost and becoming more and more rebellious until THEY actually murdered Stephen.
They rejected the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. At that point their fate was sealed.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

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[Mrs. Don-o]

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[smvoice]

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[Elsie]

Mary was the mother of God, talk about hypocrictical.

Jesus existed BEFORE Mary was even born.

He was NOT 'carnate' at that time.

When the GODhead decided (all 3 of them) that the 'time had come'; Then THIS occurred:

Matthew 1:18 D-R
Now the generation of Christ was in this wise. When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child, of the Holy Ghost.

To claim that Mary is the mother of GOD, is simply incorrect.

To continue to make the claim, after being shown multiple times the writing that states otherwise; well, let's just say it's a wee bit more than mere obstinance.

[Elsie]

UNTIL means something quite different to a dyed-in-the-wool Catholic; it seems.

[Elsie]

The “brothers” of Jesus were the sons of Clopas, not Joseph.

You've stated your case; now - show your evidence.

[Elsie]

...from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed. But the Catholics will go WAY overboard in their, ahem, veneration of me.

---

Litanies of Our Lady of Mount Carmel

 

BEFORE EACH OF THE FOLLOWING SALUTATIONS SAY:
"Our Lady of Mount Carmel,"
AND AFTERWARDS: "Pray for us Sinners."

Queen of Heaven,
Victorious over Satan,
Most Obedient Daughter,
Most Pure Virgin,
Devoted Spouse,
Mother Most Tender,
Model of Perfect Virtue,
Sure Anchor of Hope,
Refuge in Sorrow,
Dispensatrix of the Gifts of God,
Bastion Against Our Enemies,
Our Aid in Danger,
The Way Leading to Jesus,
Our Light in Darkness,
Our Consolation at the Hour of Death,
Advocate of the Most Abandoned Sinners,
For the Hardened in Vice,
For Those who Offend Thy Divine Son,
For Those Who Neglect to Pray,
For Those Who are in Agony,
For Those Who Defer Their Conversion,
For Those Suffering in Purgatory,
For Those Who Do Not Know Thee.

 

Let Us Pray.

 
  

Our Lady of Mount Carmel, glorious Queen of Angels, channel of God's tenderest mercy to man,
refuge and advocate of sinners, with confidence I prostrate myself before thee, beseeching thee to obtain for me [Mention request silently].

In return I solemnly promise to have recourse to thee in all my trials, sufferings and temptations,

and I shall do all in my power to induce others to love and reverence thee and to invoke thee in all their needs.

I thank thee for the numberless blessings which I have received from thy mercy and powerful intercession.

Continue to be my shield in danger, my guide in life, and my consolation at the hour of death.

 

Amen.
 

[Elsie]

One thing is certain, it is not the correct interpretation of scripture that saves.

If this is not certain; is there anything that IS?

[Elsie]

A deeper issue, do you believe Mary the Mother of Jesus could impart Spirit Life to the being she conceived in her womb?

Ecclesiastes 12:6-7 
 
Remember Him before the silver cord is snapped, 
and the golden bowl is crushed, 
before the pitcher is shattered at the spring, 
and the wheel is broken at the well, 
before the dust returns to the ground from which it came, 
and the spirit returns to God who gave it.

[Elsie]

Some in their traditions have ground the 'rock' of Peter into mystical fairy dust.

Surely not THESE guys!!

As regards the oft-quoted Mt. 16:18, note the following Early Church Fathers promise in the profession of faith of Vatican 1:

 

 

 • Basil of Seleucia, Oratio 25:

'You are Christ, Son of the living God.'...Now Christ called this confession a rock, and he named the one who confessed it 'Peter,' perceiving the appellation which was suitable to the author of this confession. For this is the solemn rock of religion, this the basis of salvation, this the wall of faith and the foundation of truth: 'For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Christ Jesus.' To whom be glory and power forever. — Oratio XXV.4, M.P.G., Vol. 85, Col. 296-297.

 

• Bede, Matthaei Evangelium Expositio, 3:

You are Peter and on this rock from which you have taken your name, that is, on myself, I will build my Church, upon that perfection of faith which you confessed I will build my Church by whose society of confession should anyone deviate although in himself he seems to do great things he does not belong to the building of my Church...Metaphorically it is said to him on this rock, that is, the Saviour which you confessed, the Church is to be built, who granted participation to the faithful confessor of his name. — 80Homily 23, M.P.L., Vol. 94, Col. 260. Cited by Karlfried Froehlich, Formen, Footnote #204, p. 156 [unable to verify by me].

 

• Cassiodorus, Psalm 45.5:

'It will not be moved' is said about the Church to which alone that promise has been given: 'You are Peter and upon this rock I shall build my Church and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it.' For the Church cannot be moved because it is known to have been founded on that most solid rock, namely, Christ the Lord. — Expositions in the Psalms, Volume 1; Volume 51, Psalm 45.5, p. 455

 

• Chrysostom (John) [who affirmed Peter was a rock, but here not the rock in Mt. 16:18]:

Therefore He added this, 'And I say unto thee, Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church; that is, on the faith of his confession. — Chrysostom, Homilies on the Gospel of Saint Matthew, Homily LIIl; Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf110.iii.LII.html)

 

• Cyril of Alexandria:

When [Peter] wisely and blamelessly confessed his faith to Jesus saying, 'You are Christ, Son of the living God,' Jesus said to divine Peter: 'You are Peter and upon this rock I will build my Church.' Now by the word 'rock', Jesus indicated, I think, the immoveable faith of the disciple.”. — Cyril Commentary on Isaiah 4.2.

 

• Origen, Commentary on the Gospel of Matthew (Book XII):

“For a rock is every disciple of Christ of whom those drank who drank of the spiritual rock which followed them, 1 Corinthians 10:4 and upon every such rock is built every word of the church, and the polity in accordance with it; for in each of the perfect, who have the combination of words and deeds and thoughts which fill up the blessedness, is the church built by God.'

“For all bear the surname ‘rock’ who are the imitators of Christ, that is, of the spiritual rock which followed those who are being saved, that they may drink from it the spiritual draught. But these bear the surname of rock just as Christ does. But also as members of Christ deriving their surname from Him they are called Christians, and from the rock, Peters.” — Commentary on the Gospel of Matthew (Book XII), sect. 10,11 ( http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/101612.htm)

 

• Hilary of Potier, On the Trinity (Book II):

Thus our one immovable foundation, our one blissful rock of faith, is the confession from Peter's mouth, Thou art the Son of the living God. On it we can base an answer to every objection with which perverted ingenuity or embittered treachery may assail the truth."-- (Hilary of Potier, On the Trinity (Book II), para 23; Philip Schaff, editor, The Nicene & Post Nicene Fathers Series 2, Vol 9.

[Elsie]

But only that if jesus is God in the flesh Mary would have to be his mother, just so simple. you

A women loses many children before birth and she and her husband decide to try a surrogate to carry the next embryo to term.

Now; just WHO will be the actual mother?

The one who CONCEIVED the child; or the other one, who supplied the nurtrients?

[Elsie]

You should hang your head in shame trashing The mother of the son of God the way you do. for claiming that Mary and Joseph never had sexual relations; EVER!

[Elsie]

(Therefore stand fast and hold the traditions you were taught, by word or by our epistle.2 Thess. 3:6)

Good advice.

Too bad that Rome added a LOT more 'traditions' after this was penned.

[smvoice]

Your tagline is wrong. You are quoting 2 Thess. 2:15.
2 Thess. 3:6: “Now we command you, brethren, in the name of Jesus Christ, that he withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the TRADITION which he RECEIVED of US.”
Who is the “US” to whom he is referring?
All you need to do is read the opening salutation. Paul refers to “Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus.”

[Elsie]

Galatians 4:4-7 English Standard Version (ESV)

4 But when the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons.
6 And because you are sons, God has sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!”
7 So you are no longer a slave, but a son, and if a son, then an heir through God.

[metmom]

Why do I care?

Because of all the people who have been snookered by a lie who wear the thing thinking it will actually keep them from going to hell.

It's not hypocritical in the least and my assurance of salvation and the work Christ is doing in me is no reason for me to not care about the eternal destiny of others.

Do you know the difference between hope and faith?

Yes, faith is the assurance of things hoped for. IOW, knowing that we have them instead of hoping that maybe in the end, when it's too late to do anything about it, I'll find out when I die if I make it into heaven or not.

Only Catholicism would relabel faith as *presumption* and make a sin out of something that is not a sin.