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Luther Thought Purgatory was an Open Question?
Beggars All Reformation and Aplogetics ^ | May 04, 2013 | James Swan

Posted on 11/05/2018 1:55:29 PM PST by boatbums

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To: Mark17

Well it’s not Guns N Roses but that’s probably considered a good thing by most fans of the song :)

Cool song. Nice moody atmosphere in the music.


141 posted on 11/06/2018 1:27:28 AM PST by dp0622 (The Left should know if Trump is kicked out of office, it is WAR!)
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To: dp0622
Another one you might like.
142 posted on 11/06/2018 1:32:03 AM PST by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: Mark17

That there is pretty funny :)

I wonder why comments on the song are disabled.

It’s funny. I think my cat is a fascist.


143 posted on 11/06/2018 1:38:14 AM PST by dp0622 (The Left should know if Trump is kicked out of office, it is WAR!)
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To: dp0622
It’s funny. I think my cat is a fascist.

:-)

144 posted on 11/06/2018 1:39:23 AM PST by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: boatbums
So, even though we cannot precisely determine where Jesus was and what He did during those three days, it seems apparent that He presented the gospel message (not to have them get saved) to those in spirit prison and possibly also to those in Abraham's bosom. https://carm.org/where-did-jesus-go-after-he-died-cross

Yes, I think Jesus went to Hades, and led the righteous dead, from Abraham's bosom to Heaven.
My opinion is, the spirits in prison, were the unsaved dead. I think He said something to them too, like their doom, in the lake of fire, was sure, and fixed, FOREVER. If any of them ever thought they were going to get a second chance at Heaven, He put the kabash on that rumor.

145 posted on 11/06/2018 1:52:04 AM PST by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: ebb tide
Those verses are not clear.

But this continues to illustrate the problem for the Roman Catholic....which ECF does the RC draw upon for they often contradict Rome on the doctrines near and dear to them?

146 posted on 11/06/2018 4:03:31 AM PST by ealgeone (SCRIPTURE DOES NOT CHANGE!)
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To: ebb tide

“The Virgin birth of Jesus Christ is also in Scripture. Yet many refuse to accept it.”

I accept it because the Holy Spirit inspired it.

Purgatory is no where in Scripture. I obviously don’t believe it.

Christ’s death is sufficient to cover all sin for the person who entrusts himself to Him alone, apart from human efforts and false rituals.


147 posted on 11/06/2018 4:29:19 AM PST by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: ebb tide

None.

I am cleansed by the blood of Jesus and covered with HIS righteousness.

My works will be examined and tested AS IF by fire, to see whether they merit reward in heaven, but they do not determine my salvation and my reward is not heaven. Heaven is already a given for me.

I may not have any reward beyond that, but I’m still going.


148 posted on 11/06/2018 5:44:36 AM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
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To: Mark17
I don’t know any Catholics, who wear the scapular today.

I have seen that in the mall recently.

Hispanics.

149 posted on 11/06/2018 5:47:15 AM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
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To: ebb tide; aMorePerfectUnion

We accept stuff in Scripture as God’s word is Truth.

We do not accept the claims, imaginings, fantasies, and wishful thinking of men who claim things that are not found there.


150 posted on 11/06/2018 5:48:59 AM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
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To: Mark17
I agree with you assessment of those "difficult" verses. I believe the sin unto death, refers to physical death, not the spiritual death of the soul. If a true believer wants to engage in continuous, unrepentant sin, they might be short for the world. I don't believe Ananias and Sapphira lost their salvation, but they surely kicked the crock pot, I mean, kick the bucket. If you want to live a long life, then behave.

Paul addresses that in Corinthians with and man who was sleeping with his father's wife.

1 Corinthians 5:1-5 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.

For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.

151 posted on 11/06/2018 5:53:02 AM PST by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
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To: vladimir998

Oh my dear sweet vlad.

If you hadn’t made an ad hominem AND a personal attack, your earlier rant wouldn’t have been deleted.

It’s something that NPCs do, and Christians shouldn’t.


152 posted on 11/06/2018 6:00:33 AM PST by Luircin
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To: vladimir998

Nice rant you’ve given there.

But you’re not arguing against me, you’re arguing against the Word of God.

“10 For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it. 11 For he who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” If you do not commit adultery but do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12 So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty.”

So yeah, stealing a pen makes you just as guilty before God as murdering someone.

You’re not arguing against me; you’re arguing against God.

And all the ‘I hate Protestants with a hot hot hate’ ranting on FR won’t change that, vlad.


153 posted on 11/06/2018 6:06:43 AM PST by Luircin
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To: Luircin
So yeah, stealing a pen makes you just as guilty before God as murdering someone.

That's a difficult concept for Roman Catholics to understand. They seem to focus on just the "biggie" sins...and then only if they actually do them. They forget the thought aspect of sin.

One sin....I'd even say, the mere thought of stealing the pen, would be sufficient to deny you Heaven if you were trying to keep the Law.

Are there different consequences here on earth? Yes. You probably won't go to jail for stealing a pen from work.

However, you could be fired.

154 posted on 11/06/2018 7:35:00 AM PST by ealgeone (SCRIPTURE DOES NOT CHANGE!)
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To: metmom
I have seen that in the mall recently.

Hispanics.

Well, I figured there might be some around. It’s been many years since I wore one, but, as I recall, I think it was made of wool, and was very uncomfortable against the skin. Don’t the Mormons have something similar to this?

155 posted on 11/06/2018 7:40:48 AM PST by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: Mark17

It’s nothing more than witchcraft with a new coat of paint.

Try to force God to do something by performing the right rituals, wearing the right clothes, saying the right words.

Very definition of sorcery in the Bible.


156 posted on 11/06/2018 7:44:04 AM PST by Luircin
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To: All

I wonder how familiar Luther was with Dante Alighieri’s “Divine Comedy”? The epic poem was completed in 1320, so it was already a classic at the time Luther was alive.


157 posted on 11/06/2018 7:53:35 AM PST by Jack Black
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To: RegulatorCountry
The claim was made out of bias against Protestants by a Catholic as it always is, ergo pointing out that anti-Semitism had been practiced to an odious degree by Rome for over a thousand years at that point is fair game.

What claim? That Luther was a terrible anti-Semite. That's not really a claim, it's an obvious fact.

Who are you saying has bias against Protestants? Anyone who points out the fact of Luther's anti-Semitism (say by reading or quoting his long book on the subject)?

You seem to want to turn criticism of a single individual into a team sport, where anyone who criticizes Luther is automatically a Protestant-hating Catholic. That's an unfortunate response, and not true.

One can point out that Luther was a terrible anti-Semite without being biased against all Protestants, past, present and future.

I think the important thing with any organization is that they admit the obvious failings of their founders and previous leaders and work to do better.

Lutherans, Catholics, Protestants and all Christians have a lot of work to do.

Pointing out that anti-Semitism was widespread in the Christian religion since early on, as you have, and naming those most responsible for it, is, I agree, a fair and even important task.

This article is a good stepping off place: Christianity and anti-Semitism.

158 posted on 11/06/2018 8:52:33 AM PST by Jack Black
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To: Jack Black

The constant refrain on the FR religion forum from Catholics is that Luther was anti-Semitic, which coming from members of another religious group that was every bit as anti-Semitic, strikes many as hypocritical.


159 posted on 11/06/2018 9:01:43 AM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry
Thanks, I don't really have any background on those discussions, having never participated in them. Is there a ping-list for non-devotional non-caucus religious threads?

Those would be of great interest to me.

160 posted on 11/06/2018 10:44:21 AM PST by Jack Black
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