Posted on 08/03/2018 9:55:47 PM PDT by unlearner
LEXINGTON, Kentucky, Pro-homosexual dissident 'Catholic' groups see in Pope Francis' ‘changing’ of the Church’s teaching on the death penalty the hope that the Church will one day also change its teaching against homosexuality.
New Ways Ministry called the change in the Catechism proof that "Church teaching can change."
"It's important for Catholic advocates for LGBT equality to take note of this change because for decades Catholic opponents of LGBT equality argued that it is impossible to change church teaching. They often pointed to the fact that condemnations of same-sex relationships were inscribed in the Catechism, and so were not open for discussion or change. Yet, the teaching on the death penalty is in the Catechism, too, and, in fact, to make this change in teaching, it was the text of the Catechism that Francis changed," the group stated on its website.
New Ways Ministry, which works to "promote the acceptance of LGBT people," said that Pope Francis' move will help advance "LGBT equality" in a number of ways.
"First, we now have a clear, explicit contemporary example of church teaching changing, and also a look into how it can be done: with a papal change to the Catechism," it stated.
"Second, we can see that the process that brought about this change has been decades of theological debate and discussion, and not just a papal whim. That means the theological and even ecclesial discussions and debates right now about LGBT people have great potential to shape future changes in church teaching in regard to those topics," it added.
The pro-gay group was not the only one to see the significance of Pope Francis' rewrite of the Catechism.
In a post that appeared yesterday on Twitter, Lexington-based “Fortunate Families” wrote:
The church cannot change its teaching. That is what so many others say about other topics, for example regarding LGBTQ persons. But doctrine develops. Today’s news is a sterling example.
"The idea first floated by [the] Pope on Catechism’s 25th anniversary last fall to signify development of doctrine,” the tweet continued, “rescript issued today sees Francis issue edit of the 1994 official text, now deeming capital punishment ‘inadmissible’-- the new formulation.”
“Development of doctrine”, legitimately used to describe how the Catholic Church refines and expands, but never undermines or rejects, what was taught earlier, has now been interpreted by some to mean the erasure of settled Church teaching.
Critics say Pope Francis attempted to do that yesterday when he promulgated a new teaching concerning the death penalty in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, saying that it was “inadmissible.” The perennial teaching of the Church, based on Scripture and unanimously accepted by the Church Fathers and every pope until Francis, is that legitimate civil authority may impose the death penalty on a malefactor. Although both Saint John Paul II and Benedict XVI were strongly opposed to capital punishment--and John Paul’s Catechism strongly circumscribed it--neither pope denied this principle.
Pope Francis’ innovation has already become a club for American liberals to beat conservatives with. Jane Fleming Kleeb, Chair of the Democratic Party in Nebraska, has tweeted “Let's be clear Nebraskans, @GovRicketts is going against the teachings of the church. We can change leaders by voting different on Nov. 6--Democrats are against the death penalty.”
Fortunate Families, founded in 1992 by Mary Ellen and Casey Lopata, the Catholic parents of a same-sex attracted man, is a group of Catholic religious and laypeople who dissent on authentic Church teaching regarding sexuality and marriage. From 2010 until this July Fortunate Families was part of a coalition with Call to Action, the banned Dignity, and the censured New Ways ministry.
Astonishingly, since November 2017 Bishop John Stowe, OFM of Lexington has served as the dissident group’s “ecclesial advisor”. Stowe is one of the five bishops who have endorsed Fr. James Martin’s pro-LGBT book Building a Bridge. The bishop was appointed to the Lexington diocese by Pope Francis in 2015.
Fortunate Families was last in the news when a Lexington Catholic church stretched an LGBT flag across its front lawn. The first executive director of the group, Stan “JR” Zerkowski, is a parishioner at St. Paul’s parish, and told media that he hoped the banner got wide publicity.
“This is a church that is open to all people and I hope this sign gets that across,” he said in the TV report. “I don’t think a Catholic Church has ever had a sign like this before in front of it during Pride Week or any other time. However, in other parts of the country we see this regularly.”
The banner read “LBGTQ+ Catholic /Family, Friends & Allies/all are welcome”, insinuating that at other Catholic churches Catholics who experience same-sex desires or suffer from gender dysphoria are barred from the worship of God.
Former homosexual Joseph Sciambra retweeted the group’s Twitter message, saying “Bishop Stowe’s ‘Fortunate Families’ believe that the [Catechism of the Catholic Church] will also ‘change’ in terms of homosexuality. FF operatives are embedded within several dioceses around the US.”
Sciambra, a survivor of the San Francisco 1990s “gay scene”, is dedicated to helping people with same-sex attractions avoid being trapped in what he says is a dangerous way of life.
Almost as old as you but better-looking.
Ohh...”narrow, right-leaning views”. You sound almost, dare I say it, progressive!
I’m pretty much a trad in temperament and love the preV2 church... but when I kept encountering negativity, ignorance and anti-semitism, I had to pull back a bit. I won’t indulge hatred under the guise of faith.
*********************
I can assure you that I have not "whined to the moderators" on any of your posts on this thread.
Perhaps with your pinging to the mods they reviewed your post(s) and chose to delete it.
You're not very good at playing chess.
So one day it’s tennis and the next day it’s chess?
Thanks for the support. I’m used to our friend bashing straw men to avoid the point at hand. Much easier to attack the poster than address the point!
Either one it's the same result.
“Catholics don’t care if the Pope is a heretic or apostate?”
I can’t speak for others, but I took this comment to mean that most don’t let it worry them, rather than not caring at all.
“Freeper Catholics think that the Pope is a heretic. A very dangerous one, too.”
Without reading the Caucus posts except for what I see in the headlines and on the main page, I was starting to gather that. However, I did not realize it was possible to hold that view and be Catholic.
“But that doesn’t mean we leave the Church like silly, frightened sheep. Not after 2,000 years we don’t.”
Protestants do not see the Reformation as “leaving the Church” because Protestants consider that the people themselves are the Church. So, in essence, it is impossible to leave. But this definition refers to the Invisible Church.
That being said, is the Catholic remedy to this to speak out and wait until the current Pope is replaced? I’m just a bit confused with how these apparently contradictory views can be held. Again, I’m not intending to be argumentative. Am I correct in my understanding that you believe in Apostolic succession, but that it is also possible for even a Pope who was ordained by God to be Pope to turn out to be a heretic? Or would that mean that the officially recognized Pope is not the true Pope, but the true Pope is someone else, perhaps somewhere in hiding?
And is there ever a point at which corruption on the inside of the Visible Church or its leaders would warrant, in your mind, the type of Reformation that started the Protestant movement? Or is the remedy always within the hierarchical organization of the Visible Church? I may be asking these question in a wrong way or misusing the terminology, but hopefully you can follow what I’m getting at.
And regardless of the means by which the Pope’s errors are addressed, how likely is it that the Catholic Church as a whole could change its official public stance on abortion and homosexuality? I’ve always assumed that these were things that could never change.
Maybe you should hang out with a better class of people if all you surround yourself is with negativity, ignorance & anti-semitism. I hang out with my Catholic family and friends and we love the world.
Ya do???
No one reported your violations of the Religion Forum guidelines.
I found them by reading the thread.
Keep doing that and I will restrict your posting privileges.
Even the post I am replying to is a violation.
King James Bible
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world.
If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
Oops, forgot the reference to where the verse is in God’s Word:
1 John 2:15
Most of you people interpret the Bible any old way you see fit unlike the Church’s teachings. I don’t pay any attention to your blatherings on the subject. Good night.
My sister lives in highly Catholic WNY in the immediate Buffalo area and she says that all the Catholics she knows just LOVE the new pope.
The mods don’t delete posts unless they violate the RF guidelines, not because someone allegedly complained.
If you don’t want your posts deleted, then try posting according to RF guidelines and there will be no reason for the mod to delete them.
The responsibility for the content of the post is strictly that of the person writing it.
Couldn’t prove it by me.
Posting Scripture is *blatherings?
Even after all these years, it never ceases to amaze me the low view Catholics have of Scripture.
He asked you a yes or no question and that's the kind of response he gets?
Unreal.......
“So one day it’s tennis and the next day it’s chess?”
Yes, every day is a different sport. Weekly activity is posted in the clubhouse each Friday for the following week.
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