Posted on 06/08/2018 8:54:57 AM PDT by Salvation
There are a lot of “solos” sung by our Protestant brethren: sola fide (saved by faith alone), sola Scriptura (Scripture alone is the rule of faith), and sola gratia (grace alone). Generally, one ought to be leery of claims that things work “alone.” Typically, many things work together in harmony; things are interrelated. Very seldom is anyone or anything really “alone.”
The problem with “solos” emerges (it seems to me) in our mind, where it is possible to separate things out; but just because we can separate something out in our mind does not mean that we can do so in reality.
Consider, for a moment, a candle’s flame. In my mind, I can separate the heat of the flame from its light, but I could never put a knife into the flame and put the heat of the flame on one side of it and the light on the other. In reality, the heat and light are inseparable—so together as to be one.
I would like to argue that it is the same with things like faith and works, grace and transformation, Scripture and the Church. We can separate all these things out in our mind, but in reality, they are one. Attempting to separate them from what they belong to leads to grave distortions and to the thing in question no longer being what it is claimed to be. Rather, it becomes an abstraction that exists only on a blackboard or in the mind of a theologian.
Let’s look at the three main “solos” of Protestant theology. I am aware that there are non-Catholic readers of this blog, so please understand that my objections are made with respect. I am also aware that in a short blog I may oversimplify, and thus I welcome additions, clarifications, etc. in the comments section.
Solo 1: Faith alone (sola fide) – For 400 years, Catholics and Protestants have debated the question of faith and works. In this matter, we must each avoid caricaturing the other’s position. Catholics do not and never have taught that we are saved by works. For Heaven’s sake, we baptize infants! We fought off the Pelagians. But neither do Protestants mean by “faith” a purely intellectual acceptance of the existence of God, as many Catholics think that they do.
What concerns us here is the detachment of faith from works that the phrase “faith alone” implies. Let me ask, what is faith without works? Can you point to it? Is it visible? Introduce me to someone who has real faith but no works. I don’t think one can be found. About the only example I can think of is a baptized infant, but that’s a Catholic thing! Most Baptists and Evangelicals who sing the solos reject infant baptism.
Hence it seems that faith alone is something of an abstraction. Faith is something that can only be separated from works in our minds. If faith is a transformative relationship with Jesus Christ, we cannot enter into that relationship while remaining unchanged. This change affects our behavior, our works. Even in the case of infants, it is possible to argue that they are changed and do have “works”; it’s just that they are not easily observed.
Scripture affirms that faith is never alone, that such a concept is an abstraction. Faith without works is dead (James 2:26). Faith without works is not faith at all because faith does not exist by itself; it is always present with and causes works through love. Galatians 5:6 says, For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth anything, nor uncircumcision; but faith working through love. Hence faith works not alone but through love. Further, as Paul states in 1 Corinthians 13:2, if I have all faith so as to move mountains but do not have love, I am nothing.
Hence faith alone is the null set. True faith is never alone; it bears the fruit of love and the works of holiness. Faith ignites love and works through it. Beware of the solo “faith alone” and ask where faith, all by itself, can be found.
Solo 2: Grace alone (sola gratia) – By its very nature grace changes us. Again, show me grace apart from works. Grace without works is an abstraction. It cannot be found apart from its effects. In our mind it may exist as an idea, but in reality, grace is never alone.
Grace builds on nature and transforms it. It engages the person who responds to its urges and gifts. If grace is real, it will have its effects and cannot be found alone or apart from works. It cannot be found apart from a real flesh-and-blood human who is manifesting its effects.
Solo 3: Scripture alone (sola Scriptura) – Beware those who say, “sola Scriptura!” This is the claim that Scripture alone is the measure of faith and the sole authority for the Christian, that there is no need for a Church and no authority in the Church, that there is only authority in the Scripture.
There are several problems with this.
First, Scripture as we know it (with the full New Testament) was not fully assembled and agreed upon until the 4th century.
It was Catholic bishops, in union with the Pope, who made the decision as to which books belonged in the Bible. The early Christians could not possibly have lived by sola scriptura because the Scriptures were not even fully written in the earliest years. And although collected and largely completed in written form by 100 AD, the set of books and letters that actually made up the New Testament was not agreed upon until the 4th century.
Second, until recently most people could not read.
Given this, it seems strange that God would make, as the sole rule of faith, a book that people had to read on their own. Even today, large numbers of people in the world cannot read well. Hence, Scripture was not necessarily a read text, but rather one that most people heard and experienced in and with the Church through her preaching, liturgy, art, architecture, stained glass, passion plays, and so forth.
Third, and most important, if all you have is a book, then that book needs to be interpreted accurately.
Without a valid and recognized interpreter, the book can serve to divide more than to unite. Is this not the experience of Protestantism, which now has tens of thousands of denominations all claiming to read the same Bible but interpreting it in rather different manners?
The problem is, if no one is Pope then everyone is Pope! Protestant “soloists” claim that anyone, alone with a Bible and the Holy Spirit, can authentically interpret Scripture. Well then, why does the Holy Spirit tell some people that baptism is necessary for salvation and others that it is not necessary? Why does the Holy Spirit tell some that the Eucharist really is Christ’s Body and Blood and others that it is only a symbol? Why does the Holy Spirit say to some Protestants, “Once saved, always saved” and to others, “No”?
So, it seems clear that Scripture is not meant to be alone. Scripture itself says this in 2 Peter 3:16: our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, also wrote to you, Our Brother Paul speaking of these things [the Last things] as he does in all his letters. In them there are some things hard to understand that the ignorant and unstable distort to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures. Hence Scripture itself warns that it is quite possible to misinterpret Scripture.
Where is the truth to be found? The Scriptures once again answer this: you should know how to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of truth (1 Tim 3:15).
Hence Scripture is not to be read alone. It is a document of the Lord through the Church and must be read in the context of the Church and with the Church’s authoritative interpretation and Tradition. As this passage from Timothy says, the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth. The Bible is a Church book and thus is not meant to be read apart from the Church that received the authority to publish it from God Himself. Scripture is the most authoritative and precious document of the Church, but it emanates from the Church’s Tradition and must be understood in the light of it.
Thus, the problems of “singing solo” seem to boil down to the fact that if we separate what God has joined we end up with an abstraction, something that exists only in the mind but in reality, cannot be found alone.
Here is a brief video in which Fr. Robert Barron ponders the Protestant point of view that every baptized Christian has the right to authoritatively interpret the Word of God.sss
Faith is at heart an action word. The term might better be written 'faithe', as a verb, an action word: pistis / pisteuo.
The trick of verbiage is common to the deceptive Catholic mind, as in conflating the body of ALL believers with the word church used to designate an Organization. At the heart this is a purposed deception aimed at conflating Catholic Church with the body of all believers, which is a lie from the pit of Hell.
The Bible, The Word of God tells us that the demons know Whom Jesus is and they tremble. He is not their savior, therefore they do not have 'faith' in Him as savior. But you just deceived readers by pairing the word used to denote saving by Jesus via faithing in Him, with the demons for whom He is not the Savior of them. Do you do this to deceive yourself into accepting more and more mysticism and signs and wonders, rather than exercising faithing in Jesus as (not will be but in the exact now) your now Savior?
You may try to mentally excuse yourself by thinking I am picking at minor points. That too is a self deception, for this issue is the heart of the matter, the central meaning of God with us, not with demons, with us!
When someone faiths in Jesus as their Lord and Savior, the Holy Spirit of GOD is in their human spirit, like a spark of new life. The Presence of His Spirit in the now alive human spirit does not force righteous living as a despot would do. It urges righteous choices wafted from spirit to soul, to the behavior mechanism of mind, emotions, and will, and we grow from infancy in HIS family to maturity. It is a process euphemistically called sanctification. It is not Salvation, for that had to have already happened in order that GOD's Spirit is put in the dead human spirit.
How can I be so sure what I am writing to you is accurate? well, I have been reading what Paul was given by GOD to write to us on these matters. The simplest starting point is Paul's reference to milk and meat ... those still in infancy need milk and cannot digest meat. Those growing in faith and knowledge move to meat and eventually to strong meat.
I gave you an example of a strong 'byte' of meat when I referred to the water of birth as what Jesus referred to in John 3 speaking with Nicodemus. To a milk dependent believer that is hard to digest because they want to equate water to adult baptism since it is so much easier to assimilate in the new Christian perspective.
You conflated in referring to demons having faith: faith as used for describing salvation is not in anyway related to demons knowing Whom Jesus is, for He is not their savior since they already chose Him not. They have faith that He will eventually send them to eternal Hell. [ Now resist that demonic temptation to argue that a searching Christian is exercising the same sort of faith by weighing issues of heaven and hell.]
One last question from an old man: when you seek assistance or miraculous from someone 'in the Holy family, Mary specifically, are you really living that 'trust in the Lord with all your heart, leaning not to your own understanding? If you are truly honest, the answer is obvious, you are not. You are giving yourself an excuse to continue in your mysticism. The influence of the mystery religions is like that ...
She was in the right place at the right time and had the right lineage.
She was blessed because she had the privilege of giving birth to the Messiah, an honor I am sure that every young Jewish girl hoped for.
From what I’ve read about Her, Mary truly is on a mission from God and there is no one or nothing else like Mary.
Luke 7:28 I tell you, among those born of women none is greater than John. Yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.”
In that light, I cringe and pull back a bit from the Protestants when they go after Mary and also go after those who acknowledge Her as Mother of God.
We don't *go after* Mary.
We go after the error taught about her, making her out to be more than she was.
And she's not the *mother of God*. The only identifier used by the Holy Spirit in regard to her was *mother of Jesus.*
The Holy Spirit is clear in Scripture in calling Mary *the mother of Jesus*.
John 2:1 On the third day there was a wedding at Cana in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there.
John 2:3 When the wine ran out, the mother of Jesus said to him, “They have no wine.”
Acts 1:14 All these with one accord were devoting themselves to prayer, together with the women and Mary the mother of Jesus, and his brothers.
Bud, I don’t recall saying what you just said, but accept that is how you read it.
I used to pray for the same stuff everyone else does, mostly getting/keeping the girlfriend, stuff. Now, after a few years of Job time, I try to just be thankful and ask for blessings and protection for me and mine and for my neighbors, too.
Walking the dogs at night in copperhead country can be hazardous, so I pray to Jesus first before we go for protection against all serpents, in whatever form they may take and from whatever poisons they may carry.
There have been two times so far that I credit Him for the save, and He knows how many others that I don’t know about but am grateful for.
I really can’t claim any good thing in my life as my own or from my own efforts. It’s all from my Father. Mid-Job time, I had two major head traumas in two years, either of which kills people every day, or they have to relearn the alphabet or how to walk or whatever, if possible.
Me, mostly just a reboot. For the better..I think.
The prayers I try to memorize and recite beyond the Lord’s Prayer are the Hail Mary and the prayer to St. Michael. No statues, though, carved, poured or printed.
If that condemns me to hell? Okey dokey.
It’s a bad habit that gets in the way of message and meaning.
I have to admit that I’m still not friends with brevity or the clock in spite of time spent.
Ok.
We often have different opinions about the same things, but whether I am right or wrong, I know you will be steadfast in your understanding and very consistent with your posts, just as you have been from the first post until now.
The world may rock and roll, but you’re standing rock solid where you are.
To me, that’s Biblical. Gotta respect that.
Then a few lines later, you admitted/asserted: "The prayers I try to memorize and recite beyond the Lord’s Prayer are the Hail Mary and the prayer to St. Michael."
My footnote to you was: when you seek assistance or miraculous from someone 'in the Holy family', Mary specifically, are you really living that 'trust in the Lord with all your heart, leaning not to your own understanding'? If you are truly honest, the answer is obvious, you are not.
Do you count Michael in 'the Holy family'? Do you count The Catholic Mary in 'the holy family'? Do you have enough discernment to see you have verified that you are not trusting in the Lord with ALL your heart, since you are praying to someone other than the Lord?
'A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas.'Proverbs 30:20 Such is the way of an adulterous woman; she eateth, and wipeth her mouth, and saith, I have done no wickedness. Examine yourself is what I leave you with ...
How on Earth did an ANGEL ever get to be a SAINT??
In name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. St. Michael the Archangel, illustrious leader of the heavenly army, defend us in the battle against principalities and powers, against the rulers of the world of darkness and the spirit of wickedness in high places.
You are exactly right and those two prayers are to do exactly what you said.
Thank you for the correction of such a blatant error as that. I embarrass myself.
I see do Mary as Family, but Michael as lower in the hierarchy.
Same team, but not Family. The archangels are outlandishly powerful and with a job to do.
So, you’re right, but I do have trouble seeing it in that way.
I guess it’s because tespect and acknowledging them for what they do for us is just me being me, as that’s more or less the way I am with everybody. Trust me when I say you want to deliver a pizza to my house or wait on my table.
Besides, I think His other angels are around sometimes, too, so you never know if the pizza guy might actually be an angel in disguise, maybe doing a situational heart check/test on ya, right?
I think I encountered one in a grocery store parking lot once. Weirdly odd then and still now to think about it. Something different anyway.
Anywho... you’re right. Thanks for the correction. I sure screwed that one up, huh?
How on Earth did an ANGEL ever get to be a SAINT??
So, basically, they’re referred to as Saint so and so, since archangels are holy.
To me, it’s not exactly the same as referring to someone by their rank and name, but kinda like that.
I’m still learning and relearning while taming my own stubborn self, and most of the time I have to remind myself that I should say the prayer to St. Michael.
Why not pray to God directly? I mean, he’s reconciled you to Himself through the Lord Jesus Christ; that’s a great gift and privilege.
He’s even promised that the Holy Spirit himself will intercede for you ‘with groans too deep for words’ as Scripture says, so there’s not even any worries about your prayers being insufficient.
Now, a prayer to be protected by the angels of the Lord, well, that’s another story!
Then a GOOD place to find out what 'saint' REALLY means is to read your bible.
Rome takes a perfectly good word as then re-uses it in a way that DOES confuse folks.
 'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone, ' it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less.'
'The question is,' said Alice, 'whether you can make words mean so many different things.' 'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.' |
In the morning I roll out of bed and pray to Him, the Holy Father, directly, on my knees, to start my day in gratitude for it and for my life, then asking Him to bless my day/path and be with me in all things.
Again before meals, I pray to God, the Father, directly, thanking Him for the day and for the meal I am about to receive. If it be His Will, I ask Him to bless the meal and also all those who brought such good stuff from Him to me, every step in between, please bless them all.
At breakfast, I also ask for blessings for my family, friends and neighbors, my enemies and those who think of me as an enemy.
Throughout the day, I tend to have Him in my thoughts, pondering how things work, the various rules and Laws that govern us and the world I can see and the worlds that I can’t and why. I know it all fits together and in studying creation, I get to know its Creator better. I wonder if thinking about Him so much is getting close to “constant prayer” that I’ve read about.
Before bed, I end the day as I started it, on my knees, in gratitude, asking for His Blessings.
Fwiw, I didn’t do any of the above before. Occasionally a prayer or two, but nothing like I do now. This post is the first time and place I’m admitting to it in such detail, though, and only because you seem to accusing me of being foolish or ignorant.
Since I often am both of those, I too often feel the need to defend myself instead of being receptive. I hope this is not one of those times.
Anywho, l’m sure I’m doing it wrong, but the emotions that flow are real enough.
Fwiw, messages like today’s random message help me, both when I first read it and again today. This message helps makes it all real to me in ways other things and commentaries don’t and motivates me to learn more.
Learn The Holy Rosary
Signs Of The End Of Times
June 2, 1988
Holy Rosary? ... Matthew 6:7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.
There are a few prayers that are helpful when used like a mantra.
The Lord’s Prayer is one. The Jesus prayer is another and was new to me:
“Lord Jesus, Son of God, have mercy on me, the sinner.”
Some say “a sinner” and I believe it’s the Orthodox who say “the sinner”, which is how I first heard it.
Such would not seem a “vain repetition” to me, but what do I know?
You look at me and my life, you don’t see gumption, you see Gump. Forest Gump.
“Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, the sinner.”
There, that’s better. Sorry about that...
No excuse, but just too many things going on at once these days for my limited mental bandwidth to handle well, and I’m struggling to do it all, let alone get it all right, like with that post to you yesterday.
“Dear Lord, please send that one whom I can love and help and who can love and help me.”
There is a degree of self pride in the repetitions, a 'warm fuzzy' that the mind retreats to as if earning something for repeating the memorized runs while fingering the beads. Moslems do it, too, using their memorized phrases.
Why was David ' a man after God's own heart '? Was it because David would fall into a repetitious chant when approaching The Lord? Or was it because David's heart and mind were always open to the still small voice, not making mental repetitive noise (grey mental sound) with a memorized chant? Neither, it was because David did to a high degree what Abraham did, he believed God.
Mantras and chants are spinning the behavior mechanism upon self ... which is a stealthy source of pride, closing off the soul from spiritual input.
You have a huge clue in your reference to pondering on the things of God all day long. If this leads to falling into chants and repetitive mantras then you are closing the door to the still small voice. If, on the other hand, it leads to joy and peace, and awe of Whom It IS that has brought you into HIS family, well, the difference ought to be obvious.
When Jesus taught us The Lord's Prayer, He was not establishing a mantra to be repeated as if a talisman for protection, He was giving a form for fashioning our prayers, to personalize our praise and our needs in communication with our Heavenly Father, with Him, Jesus, God with us. God honors specific requests and is shut out by mind-numbing repetitions.
In the Old Testament you will find the story of a Prophet who was being hounded by Baal worshipping pagans. This prophet was in need of listening for the still small voice. You will find the story in 1 Kings 19. The mantras and repetitions chanted are like the great wind and the earthquake. Those prevented the Prophet from hearing the still small voice, for GOD was not in the wind and the earthquake.
Read the whole story and see what God tells you in the hearing.
We have no beads; but a LOT of today's 'praise & Worship' songs consist of too many repetitions for me.
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