Can Pastors Have a Beer?

Christian Post ^ | 08/07/2017 | Shane Idleman

[SeekAndFind]

A few years ago, I attended a conference where pastors were encouraged to meet at a pub after the general sessions. A few of these pastors could exercise their liberty, but why publicly? I wondered how many people at the conference stumbled because of it.

The demands of life often tempt us to seek gratification in alcohol and other things. We must be on high alert. The enemy uses "opportune times" to draw us away from God. (cf. Luke 4:13.) The line is so thin that it is often hard to determine when we cross over.

The person who consumes alcohol walks a very fine line between freedom and sin, responsibility and carelessness, liberty and abuse — over-indulgence can even disqualify a person from leadership (cf. 1 Timothy 3). This discussion is not about a glass of wine or beer now and then, it's about abusing liberty. Damage done to families and individuals through alcohol use demands a closer look.

Pastor John MacArthur states what many of us feel but seldom discuss, "It is puerile and irresponsible for any pastor to encourage the recreational use of intoxicants — especially in church-sponsored activities. The ravages of alcoholism and drug abuse in our culture are too well known, and no symbol of sin's bondage is more seductive or more oppressive than booze."

I couldn't agree more. The trend of young Christian leaders consuming alcohol on a regular basis is alarming. Many will look back and regret the damage that was done to lives, churches, and their own testimony.

Pastor Darrin Patrick, in his book Church Planter, writes, "I am shocked at the number of them [pastors] who are either addicted or headed toward addiction to alcohol."

David Wilkerson adds, "Alcohol is now the modern golden calf, and millions of people, young and old, male and female, have been seduced by it."

Many counseling appointments are because of alcohol and drug abuse. Add to that the amount of domestic violence cases and the number of abused children because of alcohol, and we would be remiss to ignore its dangers.

We often flaunt liberty and laugh in the face of God's grace by posting our favorite beer brands and wines on Facebook, all under the guise of "exercising liberty." While Romans 14 discusses personal freedoms, it also has strong warnings "not to do anything that will cause others to fall" (vs. 21).

Consider the following:

* Jesus was filled with the Spirit ... holiness flowed from every area of His life. This cannot be said of those who consume alcohol regularly. What is the fruit of today's preoccupation with alcohol? Conversations often turn away from God, if they were there to begin with. We begin to compromise our time and interests; we'd rather head to Vegas than a prayer meeting. Jesus said that "wisdom is justified by her children" (cf. Luke 7:35). Carnal Christians consume alcohol regularly. The harmful fruit that results from a lifestyle focused on alcohol is proof enough.

* The Bible never encourages crossing the line. A preoccupation with alcohol is just one indicator of alcoholism; a preoccupation with drinking at events or social gatherings is another. Some even bring out their private collection of hard liquor after having a few drinks. This is not liberty; it's addiction.

* We assume that the alcohol content today is the same as in Jesus' day. In His day, a little water was often placed into the wine and thus decreased the alcohol content (cf. 1 Timothy 5:23) ... much like an O'douls today. "Strong drink" were drinks with higher alcohol content that led to drunkenness. Craft beer, for example, often has two times more alcohol than mass-produced beer. Those having two pints of craft beer may have the equivalent of five regular beers.

* "Jesus ate and drank with sinners." "But there is no suggestion in Scripture that Jesus purposely assumed the look and lifestyle of a publican in order to gain acceptance..." (John MacArthur). We should fellowship without engaging in the practices of a secular lifestyle. The world will know that we are Christians by our love and by our convictions, not by how well we imitate the world around us. We seldom hear non-Christians say, "I'm turned off by Christians because they seldom compromise." But we do hear, "Christians who say one thing and do another really turn me off." "Be not among winebibbers ..." (Proverbs 23:20).

* Drinking often is now called liberty instead of addiction. Many Christians center everything around alcohol — fellowship, events, birthdays, bible studies, etc. When alcohol is the center of attention, it becomes an idol and an addiction. This is why many will be offended by this article.

* In Jesus' day, society was much more isolated. We cannot calculate how many people are affected by today's social media. A person with 500 "friends" may be encouraging dozens to stumble. It is the selfless motivation of love that keeps us from causing others to stumble (cf. Romans 14).

1 Peter 2:16 reminds us that many use liberty to hide sin: "A cloak for vice," and Galatians 5:13 says we should not "use our freedom to indulge the flesh." If these points raise concerns, I encourage honest repentance. Its often not "if" alcohol consumption causes damage but "when." Why would we willingly walk into the enemy's camp?​

God does not want us to be enslaved to anything. It is important that we take an account of our lives and see if this area has a hold on us. Be honest. How much do you drink? Is it really one drink now and then, or is it throughout the week? Is it a large goblet that holds ¾ of a bottle of wine and do you fill it twice?

Do you make excuses in order to exceed moderation and plan activities around alcohol? Do others comment on your drinking? Do you often argue and try to justify your position? Paul said that even though we have freedom, not everything is good for us. We should not become a slave to anything (cf. 1 Corinthians 6:12). It's time to break free from this flawed liberty.​

- Shane Idleman is the founder and lead pastor of Westside Christian Fellowship in Lancaster, California, just North of Los Angeles

[Gamecock]

No.

Just some branches.

[editor-surveyor]

.
>> “What’s the problem?” <<

He only did red. No white wine for the she-hes.
.

[Gamecock]

DEUTERONOMY 14 25 then you shall turn it into money and bind up the money in your hand and go to the place that the LORD your God chooses 26 and spend the money for whatever you desire—oxen or sheep or wine or strong drink, whatever your appetite craves. And you shall eat there before the LORD your God and rejoice, you and your household.

[Tax-chick]

My pastor doesn’t drink alcohol. He doesn’t say about others’ doing so, even at church events, but he occasionally brings up alcohol abuse in a sermon. He’s a scholarly, understated sort of guy, always visiting the sick.

Our Puerto Rican deacon does drink, and he sometimes speaks very strongly about drunkenness, as well as the issue of spending money on beer when a family has more important needs.

[dubyagee]

I go to a non-denominational church that draws a lot of life’s ‘misfits’, so to speak. A lot of former addicts...I believe they stick to grape juice for this reason. They don’t condemn those who do drink, but they respect those that have had problems with drink and drugs.

And I mean no disregard to anyone struggling with anything by referring to them as misfits — I have my own issues and fit in quite well. Our church bills itself as a’safe place to explore the claims of Jesus Christ’and we have many attendees that would never have felt comfortable in a traditional church setting.

[T-Bone Texan]

My child goes to an Episcopal school and at official functions there is wine. Much wine.

Not for the kids really, but who knows.

I think it is to dampen the pain and malaise of being an Episcopalian.

[T-Bone Texan]

Since you are posting Scripture, I will direct this to you:

I remember a verse that said, in effect, that a widow or widower is to imbibe wine so as to dampen the pain and sadness from the death of their mate.

Any knowledge of that?

[NorthstarMom]

We just left a fundamental baptist church that taught that. It’s not the primary reason we left (nor the secondary or tertiary-alcohol is not that important to us) but false doctrine is false doctrine.

Drunkenness is always a sin.
Idolatry is always a sin.

Having a beer or glass of wine on a regular basis doesn’t automatically lead to drunkenness nor to making alcohol more important than our Lord.

New clothes don’t make one vain. Dessert every Sunday doesn’t make one a glutton.

In my life, I’ve observed the testimony of professing Christians hurt more by financial greed or immodest dress than by alcohol consumption. It hurts very much to hear unbelievers talk about how an outspoken Christian took advantage of someone financially.

[WMarshal]

Jesus wanted a good party so at a wedding he turned perfectly good water into wine.

In a recently discovered version of the book of John, discovered in the Dead Sea Caves of Israel there is a verse immediately after John 2:6 that reads: A wedding asked Jesus why he turned water to wine when water falls from heaven directly from God while wine is the work of man. Jesus looked kindly at the man and said “Ah water. Never touch the stuff, Fish f*** in it.”

So tired of dull, tight ads, idiots who think that consuming a particular food or drink is a sin. It is the overindulgence or lack of control that is the sin, not the thing itself.

[Fantasywriter]

Thanks for that information. May God bless you and what sounds like a very special church.

[jonno]

"...the deadly sin of gluttony. You can be 50 or 100 or however many pounds overweight, but DON’T TOUCH ALCOHOL!"

Agreed - we chafe at the idea that salvation has nothing to do with how good we are, and many "believers" have the tendency to be modern-day pharisees:
Luke 18:11
"The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector."

It seems to me that we could reasonably add to the list '...or those who drink, dance, or play bingo'.

But the passage that give me the most pause is in Matthew 7:
"21“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’"

[who knows what evil?]

Given the rampage of obesity driven diabetes in our culture, perhaps preachers should also integrate exhortations on dietary moderation into their sermons.

...and preach it at your local Cracker Barrel. Throw one in about gossip and back-biting while you're at it.

[JamesP81]

The issue I have is when clergy makes the statement that consumption of alcohol is always a sin.

The Bible does not say that. Christians also ought to know better than to declare something to be a sin if God doesn’t. That road ultimately leads to a bad place.

The concern from Paul about placing a stumbling block is well taken. To that end, as a rule I enjoy my adult beverages at home where there is no one around to be stumbled.

[Pollster1]

Sounds similar to Proverbs 31:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Proverbs+31&version=NKJV

31:1 The words of King Lemuel, the utterance which his mother taught him:
2
What, my son?
And what, son of my womb?
And what, son of my vows?
3
Do not give your strength to women,
Nor your ways to that which destroys kings.

4
It is not for kings, O Lemuel,
It is not for kings to drink wine,
Nor for princes intoxicating drink;
5
Lest they drink and forget the law,
And pervert the justice of all the afflicted.
6
Give strong drink to him who is perishing,
And wine to those who are bitter of heart.
7
Let him drink and forget his poverty,
And remember his misery no more . . .

[Nifster]

Interestingly enough one oh Jesus’ miracles was to provide wine for a wedding celebration

All the self righteous pastors who tell you what to do and how to live are ridiculous. A drink does not make one a drunkard.

If they don’t want to drink good for them. If they do drink don’t be a drunkard

[Nifster]

Some Protestant denominations are hard liners....some Baptists are against drinking and dancing and certain kinds of music

[Sheapdog]

If one looks at the extensive records of the people involved in transcribing and putting together the KJV 1611 one will see the meal plans for Breakfast lunch and dinner. Also three groups had different food based on their wealth and status. If I recall the lowest level had two mugs of mead at breakfast along with their meals. That would mess the average person up today and they would be considered a drunkard. Different for cultures and what people are used to.

[metmom]

It is a fine line to walk.

Alcohol can be too easily abused, but I also see the current trend towards more open drinking as a push back against the strict legalism that once was a hallmark of the church.

[Fantasywriter]

That’s very interesting. To think such records were kept and preserved.

I had a friend who made a large batch of mead. I don’t think the alcoholic content needs to be particularly high.

Found this, which may be of interest:

‘Many variants of mead have been found in medieval recipes, with or without alcoholic content. However, the honey-based drink became less common as a table beverage towards the end of the period and was eventually relegated to medicinal use.’

http://www.castlesandmanorhouses.com/life_05_drink.htm

[JimRed]

Beer. Fluid, carbohydrate and pain killer. The ideal recovery beverage after a hard session of rec b’ball! Three pints in a two hour session does not cause drunkenness, just a bit of relaxation.

But if you can’t stop yourself at your sufficiency, it is best to not indulge.