Posted on 04/07/2015 11:37:31 AM PDT by RnMomof7
MARY'S VIRGINITY
The Bible gives us many ways whereby we can clearly identify the Messiah. One of these ways is called a "sign" and is specifically linked to his miraculous birth. In the Book of Isaiah we read:
Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel (Isa. 7:14, KJV).
Along with many other Scriptures, that passage clearly points us to the Lord Jesus, the Anointed One, who was born of a "virgin". But even among those who agree that Mary was a virgin, at that point in time, there arises a controversy, that being: Did she stay a virgin after Jesus was born? Let's go to the Scriptures to find the answer:
And Joseph, having risen from the sleep, did as the messenger of the Lord directed him, and received his wife, and did not KNOW her TILL she brought forth her son -- the first-born, and he called his name Jesus (Matthewt. 1:24,25, Young's Literal).
The Greek word translated "know" in that verse is ginosko. It is also used at Luke 1:34, where it carries the same meaning:
And Mary said unto the messenger, "How shall this be, seeing a husband I do not know?" (Young's Literal).
Mary couldn't understand how she could possibly give birth without first coming to "know" her husband, that is, having sexual union. This is the meaning here and in Matt. 1:25 of ginosko. Such did not happen between Joseph and Mary "till" Jesus was born (Matt. 1:25).
Please note: Had the Holy Spirit wanted to convey the thought that Mary was a perpetual virgin her whole life through, He could have stopped Matt. 1:25 before the words: "TILL she brought forth her son." Then the sentence would have taught Mary was a perpetual virgin by reading: "Joseph ... did not know her" or as the NIV would have read: "But he had no union with her." This, however, is NOT how the Biblical record reads! That verse states, by implication, that there was a point in time that Joseph and Mary had sexual union, that is, after Jesus was born. This is in perfect agreement with Isa. 7:14, and the other passages on this topic, yet to be cited in this article.
Let's move on to a clear supportive text from Luke's Gospel:
"And she gave birth to her FIRSTBORN, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn" (Luke 2:7, NIV).
The word "firstborn" is used elsewhere for the oldest of the children. Many examples in Scripture could be cited to prove this. The following are but two:
Joseph named his firstborn Manasseh and said, "It is because God has made me forget all my trouble and all my father's household." The second son he named Ephraim and said, "It is because God has made me fruitful in the land of my suffering" (Genesis 41:51,52).
The sons of Josiah: Johanan the firstborn, Jehoiakim the second son, Zedekiah the third, Shallum the fourth (1 Chronicles 3:15).
Jesus was not called Mary's "only-born" but instead Mary's "firstborn," thereby suggesting Mary had other children, which is indeed the case. A more clear indication of this occurred when Jesus, as a full grown man, came to his hometown (Nazareth) and began to teach. People from there, who apparently knew his family, stated the following in disbelief:
Coming to his hometown, he began teaching the people in their synagogue, and they were amazed. "Where did this man get this wisdom and these miraculous powers?" They asked. "Isn't this the carpenter's son? Isn't his mother's name Mary, and aren't his brothers James, Joseph, Simon and Judas? Aren't all his sisters with us? Where then did this man get all these things?" (Matt. 13:54-56).
According to that text, Mary had at least four other sons, besides Jesus, and at least two daughters. Some argue that the word "brothers," found in this passage, merely means relatives such as cousins. If that is the true intended meaning, then one must wonder why the Greek word meaning "cousin" (anepsios) was not used there as it was in Colossians 4:10:
My fellow prisoner Aristarchus sends you his greetings, as does Mark, the cousin of Barnabas. You have received instructions about him; if he comes to you, welcome him.
Again, in contrast to Col. 4:10, a different Greek word is used in Matthew 13:55 -- adelphos. This Greek word translated "brothers" comes from the word, delphus, which means womb.
Furthermore, we should also focus our attention in upon the word "sisters" in Matthew. 13:56. The Greek word for "sisters" is adelphe. It is also found in the following:
Do not rebuke an older man harshly, but exhort him as if he were your father. Treat younger men as brothers, older women as mothers, and younger women as sisters, with absolute purity (1 Tim 5:1,2).
As in Matthew 13:56, the usage of adelphe in 1 Tim. 5:2 means natural sister born as to the same mother. The context from verse 1 shows the meaning to be the natural family. This is how the same Greek word must be understood in Matthew 13:56, since spiritual sister can't fit the context.
Mary had 7 or more children: Jesus the firstborn (or oldest) and at least 6 others, with at least 2 or more being daughters. But there is even more truth on this subject found in the Old Testament book of Psalms, where it is stated in the first person singular, as being spoken of by Jesus:
"My Own Mother's Sons"
I am a stranger to my brothers, an alien to my own mother's sons; for zeal for your house consumes me, and the insults of those who insult you fall on me (Psa. 69:8,9).
That is a Messianic Psalm, that is, it has application to Messiah Jesus. This is clear since this Psalm is quoted in the New Testament (Jn. 2:17) and shown there to apply to the Lord. The point is: Jesus became "an alien to MY OWN MOTHER'S SONS." This alienation is clearly evident at John 7:3-5. Before we look at that passage, please note that Scripture explicitly declares that Jesus' mother (Mary) had other "sons" (Psalm 69:8)! This verse alone is an irrefutable and devastating blow to the idea that the blessed Mary remained a virgin throughout her lifetime. Remember, Joseph had no sexual union with Mary "till" Jesus, Mary's "firstborn," came into this world.
In Jn. 7:3-5, we read:
Jesus' brothers said to him, "You ought to leave here and go to Judea, so that your disciples may see the miracles you do. No one who wants to become a public figure acts in secret. Since you are doing these things, show yourself to the world." For even his own brothers did not believe in him.
This passage clearly shows the context cannot allow for an interpretation of spiritual "brother," since the same "did not believe in him"! This disbelief in Jesus from his own "brothers," at that point in time, is shown elsewhere:
Then Jesus entered a house, and again a crowd gathered, so that he and his disciples were not even able to eat. When his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for THEY SAID, "HE IS OUT OF HIS MIND." . . . Then Jesus' mother and brothers arrived. Standing outside, they sent someone in to call him. A crowd was sitting around him, and they told him, "Your mother and brothers are outside looking for you." "Who are my mother and my brothers?" he asked. Then he looked at those seated in a circle around him and said, "Here are my mother and my brothers! Whoever does God's will is my brother and sister and mother" (Mark 3:20,21,31-35).
Yes, you read Scripture right. Even Mary, and her other sons, at one point during Jesus' ministry, thought Jesus was "out of his mind"! This, however, doesn't mean that they didn't afterwards come to believe on Jesus and get filled with the Holy Spirit, for they were in the Upper Room on the day of Pentecost with the other 120:
They all joined together constantly in prayer, along with the women and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brothers (Acts 1:14).
There is additional proof that Jesus' half-brothers came to faith in him. This is shown in 1 Cor. 9:5:
Don't we have the right to take a believing wife along with us, as do the other apostles and the Lord's brothers and Cephas?
There we learn that the Lord's half-brothers were married, as was Cephas (another name for Peter, Jn. 1:42). These husband-wife couples traveled together, as they served God.
Furthermore, regarding Jude and James, who were named in Matthew 13:55 as Jesus' "brothers," we read the following:
Jude, a servant of Jesus Christ and a brother of James. To those who have been called, who are loved by God the Father and kept by Jesus Christ (Jude 1).
Notice: The writer of the epistle of Jude was also "a brother (adelphos) to James," but most importantly he was a servant of Jesus Christ. So he clearly came to his spiritual senses.
Furthermore, James, the Lord's brother, is mentioned by Paul in Gal. 1:19:
I saw none of the other apostles -- only James, the Lord's brother (Gal. 1:19 NIV).
This is an important verse for two reasons: (1) It shows that James not only came to faith in Jesus, but became an apostle. (2) Besides becoming an apostle, he was also "the Lord's brother." The phrase "the Lord's brother," used here, can't possibly be limited to mean his spiritual brother, since it is already understood that Jesus' apostles are members of his spiritual family. James was both an apostle and half-brother of Jesus.
So according to Scripture, Mary did not remain a virgin after she gave birth to Jesus. This basic Biblical truth is in direct conflict with what millions of people have been taught, but nonetheless, it is God's word on this subject not any man's. The following is but one quote about Mary's perpetual virginity from the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
"Mary ‘remained a virgin in conceiving her Son, a virgin in giving birth to him, a virgin in carrying him, a virgin in nursing him at her breast, always a virgin" (p. 128, bold emphasis mine).
Dear reader, that quote was from the Catholic theologian, Augustine (who also was the original source of modern-day Calvinism). The following is another important quote which shows how Roman Catholicism counters Matthew 13:55:
"Against this doctrine the objection is sometimes raised that the Bible mentions brothers and sisters of Jesus. The Church has always understood these passages as not referring to other children of the Virgin Mary. In fact James and Joseph, ‘brothers of Jesus,' are the sons of another Mary, a disciple of Christ, whom St. Matthew significantly calls "the other Mary." They are close relations of Jesus, according to an Old Testament expression" (Catechism of the Catholic Church, p. 126, bold emphasis mine).
Friend, examine Matthew 13:54-56 for yourself, which shows the subjects as being from Jesus' hometown, thereby enabling them to identify His own mother Mary and His natural brothers and sisters. That passage is clear about this:
Coming to his hometown, he began teaching the people in their synagogue, and they were amazed. "Where did this man get this wisdom and these miraculous powers?" they asked. "Isn't this the carpenter's son? Isn't his mother's name Mary, and aren't his brothers James, Joseph, Simon and Judas? Aren't all his sisters with us? Where then did this man get all these things?"
That passage can't possibly be referring to "the other Mary," as some want us to believe, but Jesus' own mother!
Moreover, trying to sweep all of the New Testament passages away by stating that the phrase "brothers of Jesus" is merely an "Old Testament expression" is to ignore all the other verses which show Joseph and Mary had sexual union, but not until, Jesus was born. Matthew 1:25 couldn't be more clear, especially when considered with Psa. 69:8, which explicitly shows Mary had other children.
Friend, what you will continue to believe about Mary's perpetual virginity is left entirely up to you. You have read what Scripture declares and what the present-day position from Roman Catholicism declares. But know this, you can't believe both declarations, since they are antithetical to each other. One must be in error.
Why Mention Mary's Virginity?
The truth about Mary's virginity is important to know for several reasons:
(1) According to Catholic tradition from Augustine of Hippo, "heretics" deny Mary's perpetual virginity. Consider what he wrote:
"Heretics called Antidicomarites are those who contradict the perpetual virginity of Mary and affirm that after Christ was born she was joined as one with her husband" (W. A. Jurgens, The Faith of the Early Fathers, p. 166).
Should we conclude that a Christian, who goes by the Scriptural evidence as commanded by 2 Tim. 3:15-17, is a "heretic," because he rejects Mary's perpetual virginity? God forbid!
(2) Another reason why it is important to know the truth about Mary's virginity is because the Mary of Catholicism is not the Mary of the Bible. In other words, the image of Mary, the mother of Jesus, has been changed by Catholicism into something different than the real. She is presented by such as the sinless virgin, Mother of the Church, Mother of Mercies, Door of Paradise, Our Lady of Fatima, The Virgin of the Poor, Lady of the Roses, Co-redemptrix, Queen of Peace, Our Lady of Guadalupe, Mediatrix of all Graces, Mother of God, Refuge of Sinners, Gate of Heaven, Queen of Heaven and more. Consider the following:
"Through Mary to Jesus"
Two other common descriptions regarding her are: "Through Mary to Jesus" and Mary is "Our life, Sweetness and Hope." These pronouncements are more serious than Mary's perpetual virginity, for they are directly related to salvation and can, therefore, affect our eternal destiny.
Let's consider the former, "Through Mary to Jesus." In other words, must we go through Mary to get to the Savior? To find out for sure what the truth is, we must search the Scriptures. If anyone would know, it certainly would be the Lord Jesus. The following is what the Lord Himself taught about us coming to Him:
"Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light" (Matthew 11:28-30).
Yet you refuse to come to me to have life (John 5:40).
Then Jesus declared, "I am the bread of life. He who comes to me will never go hungry, and he who believes in me will never be thirsty" (John 6:35).
On the last and greatest day of the Feast, Jesus stood and said in a loud voice, "If anyone is thirsty, let him come to me and drink (John 7:37).
NOTE: To refuse to "come" [go] to Jesus, as He Himself taught in these verses means we cannot have spiritual life! On the other hand, to go directly to Him is to find salvation for our souls. This vital truth is beautifully exemplified when the dying thief, being crucified next to Jesus, went DIRECTLY TO JESUS, WITHOUT FIRST GOING THROUGH MARY OR ANYONE ELSE, and he found forgiveness and salvation. The exact word for word exchange is as follows:
Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom." Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."
According to John's Gospel account, Mary was at the foot of the cross at this time, yet the thief didn't go first to her to get to Jesus; neither did Jesus make the repentant thief go through Mary to come to Him! Remember that basic truth about salvation. If we are going to get to Jesus to find salvation it will have to be as the dying thief did, that is, DIRECTLY without first going to anyone else! Also, remember that Jesus doesn't change (Heb. 13:8). So, if it worked for that dying thief, it will also work for us, which is also the exact way Jesus taught us to "come" to Him (Matthew 11:28-30; Jn. 5:40; 6:35; 7:37). Finally, remember it wasn't until after the repentant thief came directly to Jesus that the Lord promised him "paradise." Just knowing this vital truth, about getting to Jesus, won't do anyone any good unless they act upon it.
"Our Life, Sweetness and Hope"
Another very common, but very grave misconception about salvation is that Mary is our "Life, Sweetness and Hope." This is a common phrase heard when the Rosary prayer (Hail Holy Queen) is recited. What is God's eternal truth on this subject? Let's go to the Bible for the answer. Remember, it is the Bible that is FINAL SPIRITUAL AUTHORITY: [See Sola Scriptura]
And how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work (2 Tim. 3:15-17).
The Bible contains all we need to know to make us "wise for salvation" through faith in Christ Jesus. Furthermore, it is FINAL AUTHORITY and it ALONE is needed to equip the man of God for every good work, as the aforementioned declares.
So, bearing all this in mind let's go to that same source, which is to be the basis for all Christian teaching and which can make us "wise for salvation" through our faith in Christ Jesus:
When Christ, who is YOUR LIFE, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory (Col. 3:4).
Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the command of God our Savior and of Christ Jesus OUR HOPE (1 Tim. 1:1).
According to Scripture, it is JESUS who is our "Life" and our "Hope." Furthermore, since "Sweetness" carries the meaning of "gentleness" as found in a thesaurus, then the same can be said about the Lord Jesus:
Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am GENTLE and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. (Matthew 11:29).
Dear friend, the Holy Bible declares Jesus, and HE ALONE, is our Life, Sweetness and Hope. Will you go directly to the Biblical Jesus, to find forgiveness of sins and salvation? How different this is from the picture painted in Catholicism! Consider also what has been written and endorsed about Mary:
"Death Through Eve, Life Through Mary"?
"As St. Irenaeus says, ‘Being obedient she became the cause of salvation for herself and for the whole human race.' Hence not a few of the early Fathers gladly assert ...: ‘The knot of Eve's disobedience was untied by Mary's obedience: what the virgin Eve bound through her disbelief, Mary loosened by her faith.' Comparing her with Eve, they call Mary ‘Mother of the living' and frequently claim: ‘Death through Eve, life through Mary' (Catechism of the Catholic Church, p. 125, bold emphasis mine).
Once when Jesus was teaching, the following occurred:
Someone told him, "Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you." He replied to him, "Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?" Pointing to his disciples, he said, "Here are my mother and my brothers. For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother" (Matthew 12:47-50).
Jesus declared to become part of His spiritual family we must do the will of the Father. This is further explained in a parallel passage:
He replied, "My mother and brothers are those who hear God's word and put it into practice" (Luke 8:21).
So to do "the will" of the Father is the same as putting God's word into "practice"!
The True Plan Of Salvation
Furthermore, the true plan of salvation is concisely stated in the Bible as repentance towards God and faith in Christ Jesus (Acts 20:21). We are to produce fruit in keeping with repentance (Matthew 3:8) and prove our repentance by our deeds (Acts 26:20). To "repent" means to turn from your evil ways (Matthew 12:41 cf. Jonah 3:10). Every tree that does not bring forth good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire (Matthew 3:10; 7:19). The Lord Jesus also taught the road to life is "hard" and only a "few" will find it (Matthew 7:13,14, NKJV). The Lord declared there that there are ONLY 2 gates, 2 roads, 2 groups of people and 2 eternal destinies. So don't follow the crowd, since they are on their way to eternal fire, even though they might not know it. [See More On Repentance]
Moreover, many get saved, but afterwards fall away (Luke 8:13; Jn. 6:66; 1 Tim. 1:19; etc.). In other words, after initial salvation we must endure to the "end" to enter the kingdom of God and escape the lake of fire (Matthew 10:22; Heb. 3:14; Rev. 2:10,11). Eternal life comes to the repentant the moment such believe on Jesus for salvation (Jn. 3:16; 6:47; 1 Jn. 5:12,13), but there is another important aspect of eternal life that many are totally unaware of in our day because of a different false teaching which is commonly called "once saved, always saved." According to true, Biblical, grace teaching, eternal life is also a HOPE (Titus 3:7), yet to be REAPED (Gal. 6:8,9) in the AGE TO COME (Mk. 10:30) for only the ones who PERSIST IN DOING GOOD (Rom. 2:7) and DO NOT GROW WEARY AND GIVE UP (Gal. 6:9).
See Section on Eternal Security on THIS Page
Also, remember this: If a saved person sows to please his sinful nature he'll die spiritually (Rom. 8:13; Gal. 6:8,9). The prodigal is a clear example of this (Luke 15:24,32). The end result of sin is spiritual death. DO NOT BE DECEIVED by the "once saved, always saved" teachers (James 1:14-16). We must continue to believe (TRUST) on Jesus for our soul's salvation to enter the Kingdom of God. Jesus described his "sheep" as his "followers" (John 10:27). James stated that faith without works is "dead" (James 2:17). [See Myth of Faith Alone]
In conclusion, the Jesus of our present hour is not a baby that is laying in a manger or an infant that needs to be held in his mother's arms. He is an adult who successfully destroyed the devil's work (1 John 3:8). He is the resurrected "Lord of glory" (1 Cor. 2:8), before whom every knee will bow and every tongue confess that he is Lord (Phil. 2:9-11). Jesus has the ONLY name in which salvation is found (Acts 4:12), is the ONLY mediator between God and man (1 Tim. 2:5) and is the judge of the living and the dead (Acts 10:42; 2 Tim. 4:1; 1 Pet. 4:5). We are advised in Scripture to go directly to Him for forgiveness and to TRUST in Him alone for our soul's salvation.
Blessed Mary
Finally, as stated earlier in this article, Mary is certainly "blessed" because she gave birth to the Messiah (Luke 1:42), but this should not be over-emphasized as a woman once tried to do in Jesus' presence:
As Jesus was saying these things, a woman in the crowd called out, "Blessed is the mother who gave you birth and nursed you." He replied, "Blessed rather are those who hear the word of God and obey it" (Luke 11:27,28).
Those were not the words of some Protestant, but the Lord Jesus Himself! What a shock they are to multitudes, not because they are inconsistent with the rest of Scripture, but because of all the faulty teachings that center around a Mary not taught in the Bible. Remember, Jesus was the real Mary's "firstborn" who taught all to "come" directly to Himself for their soul's salvation. Never throughout the Gospels did Jesus ever make any sinner go through Mary to come to Him. Never! Furthermore, none of the Lord's Apostles, including Peter, ever taught: "Through Mary to Jesus." Why then should we believe it? Moreover, it is JESUS who is "Our Life, Sweetness and Hope." Dear reader, what you do with this information about Jesus will affect you throughout all of eternity! VERIFY ALL SCRIPTURAL QUOTATIONS FOR YOURSELF WITH YOUR OWN BIBLE. God bless you.
The church is true because the church says it's true.
No, claims have been made that ROME's interpretations of Scripture are the most accurate. It has been clearly demonstrated over and over that is not the case.
... belief WITHIN the teachings of the Catholic Church are fraught with error.
But they get a pass as being 'poorly catechized'.
It seems like there is differing opinions of this WITHIN the Church...
As regards the oft-quoted Mt. 16:18, note the bishops promise in the profession of faith of Vatican 1,
Likewise I accept Sacred Scripture according to that sense which Holy mother Church held and holds, since it is her right to judge of the true sense and interpretation of the holy scriptures; nor will I ever receive and interpret them except according to the unanimous consent of the fathers. — http://mb-soft.com/believe/txs/firstvc.htm
Yet as the Dominican cardinal and Catholic theologian Yves Congar O.P. states,
Unanimous patristic consent as a reliable locus theologicus is classical in Catholic theology; it has often been declared such by the magisterium and its value in scriptural interpretation has been especially stressed. Application of the principle is difficult, at least at a certain level. In regard to individual texts of Scripture total patristic consensus is rare...One example: the interpretation of Peter’s confession in Matthew 16:16-18. Except at Rome, this passage was not applied by the Fathers to the papal primacy; they worked out an exegesis at the level of their own ecclesiological thought, more anthropological and spiritual than juridical. — Yves M.-J. Congar, O.P., p. 71
And Catholic archbishop Peter Richard Kenrick (1806-1896), while yet seeking to support Peter as the rock, stated that,
“If we are bound to follow the majority of the fathers in this thing, then we are bound to hold for certain that by the rock should be understood the faith professed by Peter, not Peter professing the faith.” — Speech of archbishop Kenkick, p. 109; An inside view of the vatican council, edited by Leonard Woolsey Bacon.
Your own CCC allows the interpretation that, “On the rock of this faith confessed by St Peter, Christ build his Church,” (pt. 1, sec. 2, cp. 2, para. 424), for some of the ancients (for what their opinion is worth) provided for this or other interpretations.
• Ambrosiaster [who elsewhere upholds Peter as being the chief apostle to whom the Lord had entrusted the care of the Church, but not superior to Paul as an apostle except in time], Eph. 2:20:
Wherefore the Lord says to Peter: 'Upon this rock I shall build my Church,' that is, upon this confession of the catholic faith I shall establish the faithful in life. — Ambrosiaster, Commentaries on Galatians—Philemon, Eph. 2:20; Gerald L. Bray, p. 42
• Augustine, sermon:
"Christ, you see, built his Church not on a man but on Peter's confession. What is Peter's confession? 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' There's the rock for you, there's the foundation, there's where the Church has been built, which the gates of the underworld cannot conquer. — John Rotelle, O.S.A., Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine , © 1993 New City Press, Sermons, Vol III/6, Sermon 229P.1, p. 327
Upon this rock, said the Lord, I will build my Church. Upon this confession, upon this that you said, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God,' I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not conquer her (Mt. 16:18). — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 236A.3, p. 48.
• Augustine, sermon:
For petra (rock) is not derived from Peter, but Peter from petra; just as Christ is not called so from the Christian, but the Christian from Christ. For on this very account the Lord said, 'On this rock will I build my Church,' because Peter had said, 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.' On this rock, therefore, He said, which thou hast confessed, I will build my Church. For the Rock (Petra) was Christ; and on this foundation was Peter himself built. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Christ Jesus. The Church, therefore, which is founded in Christ received from Him the keys of the kingdom of heaven in the person of Peter, that is to say, the power of binding and loosing sins. For what the Church is essentially in Christ, such representatively is Peter in the rock (petra); and in this representation Christ is to be understood as the Rock, Peter as the Church. — Augustine Tractate CXXIV; Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers: First Series, Volume VII Tractate CXXIV (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf107.iii.cxxv.html)
• Augustine, sermon:
And Peter, one speaking for the rest of them, one for all, said, You are the Christ, the Son of the living God (Mt 16:15-16)...And I tell you: you are Peter; because I am the rock, you are Rocky, Peter-I mean, rock doesn't come from Rocky, but Rocky from rock, just as Christ doesn't come from Christian, but Christian from Christ; and upon this rock I will build my Church (Mt 16:17-18); not upon Peter, or Rocky, which is what you are, but upon the rock which you have confessed. I will build my Church though; I will build you, because in this answer of yours you represent the Church. — John Rotelle, O.S.A. Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1993), Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 270.2, p. 289
• Augustine, sermon:
Peter had already said to him, 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' He had already heard, 'Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona, because flesh and blood did not reveal it to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I tell you, that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not conquer her' (Mt 16:16-18)...Christ himself was the rock, while Peter, Rocky, was only named from the rock. That's why the rock rose again, to make Peter solid and strong; because Peter would have perished, if the rock hadn't lived. — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City, 1993) Sermons, Volume III/7, Sermon 244.1, p. 95
• Augustine, sermon:
...because on this rock, he said, I will build my Church, and the gates of the underworld shall not overcome it (Mt. 16:18). Now the rock was Christ (1 Cor. 10:4). Was it Paul that was crucified for you? Hold on to these texts, love these texts, repeat them in a fraternal and peaceful manner. — John Rotelle, Ed., The Works of Saint Augustine (New Rochelle: New City Press, 1995), Sermons, Volume III/10, Sermon 358.5, p. 193
• Augustine, Psalm LXI:
Let us call to mind the Gospel: 'Upon this Rock I will build My Church.' Therefore She crieth from the ends of the earth, whom He hath willed to build upon a Rock. But in order that the Church might be builded upon the Rock, who was made the Rock? Hear Paul saying: 'But the Rock was Christ.' On Him therefore builded we have been. — Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers (Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1956), Volume VIII, Saint Augustin, Exposition on the Book of Psalms, Psalm LXI.3, p. 249. (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf108.ii.LXI.html)
• Augustine, in “Retractions,”
In a passage in this book, I said about the Apostle Peter: 'On him as on a rock the Church was built.'...But I know that very frequently at a later time, I so explained what the Lord said: 'Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church,' that it be understood as built upon Him whom Peter confessed saying: 'Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God,' and so Peter, called after this rock, represented the person of the Church which is built upon this rock, and has received 'the keys of the kingdom of heaven.' For, 'Thou art Peter' and not 'Thou art the rock' was said to him. But 'the rock was Christ,' in confessing whom, as also the whole Church confesses, Simon was called Peter. But let the reader decide which of these two opinions is the more probable. — The Fathers of the Church (Washington D.C., Catholic University, 1968), Saint Augustine, The Retractations Chapter 20.1:.
• Basil of Seleucia, Oratio 25:
'You are Christ, Son of the living God.'...Now Christ called this confession a rock, and he named the one who confessed it 'Peter,' perceiving the appellation which was suitable to the author of this confession. For this is the solemn rock of religion, this the basis of salvation, this the wall of faith and the foundation of truth: 'For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Christ Jesus.' To whom be glory and power forever. — Oratio XXV.4, M.P.G., Vol. 85, Col. 296-297.
• Bede, Matthaei Evangelium Expositio, 3:
You are Peter and on this rock from which you have taken your name, that is, on myself, I will build my Church, upon that perfection of faith which you confessed I will build my Church by whose society of confession should anyone deviate although in himself he seems to do great things he does not belong to the building of my Church...Metaphorically it is said to him on this rock, that is, the Saviour which you confessed, the Church is to be built, who granted participation to the faithful confessor of his name. — 80Homily 23, M.P.L., Vol. 94, Col. 260. Cited by Karlfried Froehlich, Formen, Footnote #204, p. 156 [unable to verify by me].
• Cassiodorus, Psalm 45.5:
'It will not be moved' is said about the Church to which alone that promise has been given: 'You are Peter and upon this rock I shall build my Church and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it.' For the Church cannot be moved because it is known to have been founded on that most solid rock, namely, Christ the Lord. — Expositions in the Psalms, Volume 1; Volume 51, Psalm 45.5, p. 455
• Chrysostom (John) [who affirmed Peter was a rock, but here not the rock in Mt. 16:18]:
Therefore He added this, 'And I say unto thee, Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church; that is, on the faith of his confession. — Chrysostom, Homilies on the Gospel of Saint Matthew, Homily LIIl; Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf110.iii.LII.html)
• Cyril of Alexandria:
When [Peter] wisely and blamelessly confessed his faith to Jesus saying, 'You are Christ, Son of the living God,' Jesus said to divine Peter: 'You are Peter and upon this rock I will build my Church.' Now by the word 'rock', Jesus indicated, I think, the immoveable faith of the disciple.”. — Cyril Commentary on Isaiah 4.2.
• Origen, Commentary on the Gospel of Matthew (Book XII):
“For a rock is every disciple of Christ of whom those drank who drank of the spiritual rock which followed them, 1 Corinthians 10:4 and upon every such rock is built every word of the church, and the polity in accordance with it; for in each of the perfect, who have the combination of words and deeds and thoughts which fill up the blessedness, is the church built by God.'
“For all bear the surname ‘rock’ who are the imitators of Christ, that is, of the spiritual rock which followed those who are being saved, that they may drink from it the spiritual draught. But these bear the surname of rock just as Christ does. But also as members of Christ deriving their surname from Him they are called Christians, and from the rock, Peters.” — Commentary on the Gospel of Matthew (Book XII), sect. 10,11 ( http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/101612.htm)
• Hilary of Potier, On the Trinity (Book II): Thus our one immovable foundation, our one blissful rock of faith, is the confession from Peter's mouth, Thou art the Son of the living God. On it we can base an answer to every objection with which perverted ingenuity or embittered treachery may assail the truth."-- (Hilary of Potier, On the Trinity (Book II), para 23; Philip Schaff, editor, The Nicene & Post Nicene Fathers Series 2, Vol 9.
Great anti-pope verse!
So...
Early church fathers or later church fathers?
Dang!
Dissension among the ranks!
Looks like those 7 Asian churches were NOT the only CATHOLIC ones in trouble!
You typed everything in ENGLISH!!!
5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
12 The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13 When they finished, James spoke up. “Brothers,” he said, “listen to me. 14 Simon[a] has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. 15 The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
16 “‘After this I will return
and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
and I will restore it,
17 that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
even all the Gentiles who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things’[b]—
18 things known from long ago.[c]
19 “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”
The apostles and elders, your brothers,
To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:
Greetings.
24 We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. 25 So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul— 26 men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. 28 It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: 29 You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.
Farewell.
30 So the men were sent off and went down to Antioch, where they gathered the church together and delivered the letter. 31 The people read it and were glad for its encouraging message. 32 Judas and Silas, who themselves were prophets, said much to encourage and strengthen the believers. 33 After spending some time there, they were sent off by the believers with the blessing of peace to return to those who had sent them. [34] [d] 35 But Paul and Barnabas remained in Antioch, where they and many others taught and preached the word of the Lord.
HMMMmmm...
...now just WHERE have I seen this tactic...?
Oh; yeah!!!
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To: Elsie
Acts wasn’t written in English, now was it? That is a great starting point. Second, it isn’t just the literal translation from the original language, rather, it is the understanding of the context, references, and double and triple meanings at the time of writing. As I have quoted Scripture, on several occasions, and on several different threads, the response is generally the same; to claim it isn’t what it says. Case in point, John 6. Jesus clearly says we must eat of His physical body and drink His blood, yet most non-Catholics don’t believe that. |
At 99 Abraham was told that he would have another child Isaac. Isaac was certainly a young man when Abraham took him on a strenuous trip to the hills of Moriah, a place where “God” showed him. (this region was where David bought the threshing floor to build an altar for sacrifice to stop the plague upon Israel. It was also the same region that Jesus was crucified!). Abraham lived to be 175 years old! So he obviously was vigorous and could still do a lot of physical work!
You are merely reasserting my point. I have been asked repeatedly to point to the Scriptural backing for this or that. When I do, all I hear is how the one asking doesn’t either agree with what is written, or has a disagreement with the translation/interpretation.
In any case, and to a previous response, the Catholic Church is the one and only authority on the proper and correct translation and interpretation of Holy Scripture.
Humans are prideful beings, but the Church, is an holy institution. Church members will come and go, as well as be of differing degrees of sinfulness, but the bride of Christ remains pure.
Please also note, discord and disagreements were settled, starting with the council of Jerusalem, with Peter at the head.
None of your lovely quotes diminishes the primacy of Peter, nor do they diminish the Petrine Ministry.
I am happy to provide a number of lovely quotes myself, however, this shouldn’t be a battle of cut and paste. However, for context, here are the relevant passages. I recommend using this link (http://www.usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/catechism/catechism-of-the-catholic-church/epub/index.cfm)as it hotlinks to the footnotes and other relevant materials.
424 Moved by the grace of the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father, we believe in Jesus and confess: “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”8 On the rock of this faith confessed by St. Peter, Christ built his Church.9 (683, 552)
552 Simon Peter holds the first place in the college of the Twelve;283 Jesus entrusted a unique mission to him. Through a revelation from the Father, Peter had confessed: “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” Our Lord then declared to him: “You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of Hades will not prevail against it.”284 Christ, the “living stone,”285 thus assures his Church, built on Peter, of victory over the powers of death. Because of the faith he confessed Peter will remain the unshakeable rock of the Church. His mission will be to keep this faith from every lapse and to strengthen his brothers in it.286 (880, 153, 442, 424)
553 Jesus entrusted a specific authority to Peter: “I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”287 The “power of the keys” designates authority to govern the house of God, which is the Church. Jesus, the Good Shepherd, confirmed this mandate after his Resurrection: “Feed my sheep.”288 The power to “bind and loose” connotes the authority to absolve sins, to pronounce doctrinal judgments, and to make disciplinary decisions in the Church. Jesus entrusted this authority to the Church through the ministry of the apostles289 and in particular through the ministry of Peter, the only one to whom he specifically entrusted the keys of the kingdom. (881, 1445, 641, 881)
881 The Lord made Simon alone, whom he named Peter, the “rock” of his Church. He gave him the keys of his Church and instituted him shepherd of the whole flock.400 “The office of binding and loosing which was given to Peter was also assigned to the college of apostles united to its head.”401 This pastoral office of Peter and the other apostles belongs to the Church’s very foundation and is continued by the bishops under the primacy of the Pope. (553, 642)
Thanks for PROVING that Cathoplicism can't seem to make up it's collective mind on things.
I’m sorry to read this. Please know that the Church is comprised of human beings who are fallible, and thus experiences such as yours can and do occur. This goes for priests too. Just because they are priests doesn’t mean they don’t sin. Some much more than their parishioners! As is your case.
Actually it sounds like the entire parish you grew up in was full of some very mean people.
Please try to forgive and keep everyone involved in your prayers. If not for their sake at least for yours. Forgiveness and prayer is healing for all concerned.
Peace be with you,
Thanks. I’ve given it to God. The priest is dead now and God is dealing with him. I found out later he went on to attack others. Based on the spiritual damage from the whole incident I believe he was beyond imperfect and acting out demonic influence.
Not everyone was mean. Many understood the situation and didn’t agree the way the church handled it, but they were too scared to speak up. Plus back then no one dared go against what the priest or cardinal said.
But the ones who were mean we’re just plain miserable. I’ve already forgiven them. Like I said, it’s all in God’s hands and they’re going to have to answer to Him one day.
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