laimed to have an apparation from an angel teaching them to pray in the spring of 1916. They were asked to pray repeatedly by the angel who appeared to them. This is why the Catholics were convinced that they have to pray repeatedly.Posted on 03/24/2015 8:06:07 AM PDT by RnMomof7
Just last Sunday, a local newspaper paper released an article teaching that the praying of the Holy Rosary is Bible-based. In the first two paragraphs, the writer admittedly says that there is no passage in the Bible teaching nor mentioned about the praying of Rosary.
However, in the following paragraphs, the writer justified the praying of the Rosary basing it on the repetition of historical events of some Bible characters (like Gideon as he mentioned) about Israel’s history.
I don’t know if the writer of this article did some research about the origin of rosary and how it was deeply encouraged for Roman Catholics.
Praying of Rosary was encouraged when Lucia Dos Santos and her cousins Francisco and Jacinta Marto claimed to have an apparation from an angel teaching them to pray in the spring of 1916. They were asked to pray repeatedly by the angel who appeared to them. This is why the Catholics were convinced that they have to pray repeatedly.
The flaw however in the story was that, the angel gave two sets of completely different prayers. The angel appeared to the three children three times.
Then after a year, 1917, it was said that Our Lady of Rosary had an apparitions for 7 times. In her second apparition the Our Lady said:
“I wish you to come here the 13th of next month; that you say the Rosary every day, and that you learn to read. In succeding months I will tell you what else I want.” “I would like to ask you to bring us to Heaven“, said Lucy. “Yes, Giacinta and Francis will be among the few, but you must stay here for a long time. Jesus wants to help Himself of you to make Me known and loved. God wishes you to remain in the world for some time because He wants to use you to establish in the world a devotion to my Immaculate Heart. I promise salvation to those who embrace it, and their souls will be loved by God as flowers placed by myself to adorn His throne.” Lucy asked: “Will I stay here alone”?, “Don’t be discouraged , I will not abandon you ever. My Immaculate Heart will be your refuge and through it will conduct you to God.”
Now here are the flaws of this apparition. First, the Our Lady is telling the children to teach the people to make her known and be loved. Note that the apparition was initiated not by Jesus, nor an angel, but the very person who wants to be made known. It is like, someone came to you and asked you using the name of your friend to introduce her to other people that you know.
The second flaw, Our Lady promises salvation to those who embrace this command. A completely heretical claim, and totally in contrast to what the Bible is saying. The Bible is very clear in saying that “…whosoever believes in Him (Jesus) will not perish but have everlasting life (John 3:16).” Only God can give salvation. This is the Biblical truth that cannot be altered, deducted nor added.
Third flaw, Our Lady claims that her immaculate heart will be our refuge and through it will conduct you to God. This is another contradiction to what the Bible is saying. “Come to me all you labor and are heavily burdened and I will give you rest (Matt.11:28)”, “I am the way the truth and the life, NO ONE comes to the Father except through me (John 14:6)”.
The truth is, there is only one mediator between God and man, it is only Jesus Christ (Hebrews chapters 6,7,8,9, and 10)
This is the statement coming from the third apparition:
“In october I will tell you who I am, that which I want, and I will do a miracle that all can see and believe. Sacrifice yourselves for sinners, and say often this prayer, especially during any sacrifice: “O my Jesus, I offer this for love of Thee, for the conversion of poor sinners, and in reparation for all the sins commited against the Immaculate Heart of Mary.“
The flaw of the third apparition is the claiming of honor which belongs to Jesus Christ, and the idea of co-equality with Jesus. Though she did not claim co-equality, but the fact of showing that people committed sins against her proposes the idea of deity that people needs to be so sorry for not recognizing her. The Bible tells us that there are three persona where we committed sins, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. And now, here comes the Mary, an addition to the Holy Trinity.
“You have seen Hell, where the souls of poor sinners go. To save future souls God wishes to establish in the world the devotion to My Immaculate Heart. If people do what I tell you, many souls will be saved.” Then She said:” If my requests are granted, Russia will be converted and there will be peace. If not, she will scatter her errors throughout the world, provoking wars and persecution of the Church. The good will be martyed, the Holy Father will have much to suffer, and various nations will be destroyed…But in the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The Holy Father will consecrate Russia to me, Russia will be converted, and a certain period of peace will be granted to the world“. “Do you want to learn a prayer?” the vision asked, “Yes we do!” the children responded. “When you recite the Rosary, say at the end of each decade: Oh My Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of hell, and lead all souls to Heaven, especially those in most need of Your Mercy.“
Now let’s look at this additional quotations from the third apparition. This is more like “Our Lady” centered command rather than “Jesus” centered command. Russia will be consecreted to Our Lady of Rosary than instead of Jesus. Notice the number of recitation of the Rosary. At the end of each decade (10), there is only one calling for Jesus help.
This is quoted from the last (6th) apparition
“I am the Lady of the Rosary, I desire here a chapel in my honor to be built, that people continue to recite the Rosary every day. Will the war finish. The war is going to end, and the soldiers will soon return to their homes.” Then Lucy asked: “may I ask you for cures and conversions, will you grant them?”. “Some yes, others no. It is necessary that they ask pardon for their sins, that they don’t offend God our Lord, and that he is already too much offended.” “Do you Want anything else from me?” Lucy asked. “I do not want anything more.“
The flaw of the 6th apparition is that the Lady of the Rosary is asking for a chapel in “HER” honor, and not Jesus’ nor the Father’s honor. We have to note that taking glory which supposed to be for God is a serious sin, this is idolatry.
The apparition is completely directing people in a wrong path. It is completely in contradiction with what the Bible is saying. The Bible warn us about these kinds of apparitions in Galatians 1:8 “But even though we (referring to Paul and his companions) or an angel from heaven, which should preach to you any gospel other than that which we preached to you, let him be cursed.” This is a strong warning that we should be careful in believing apparitions especially if it gives another teachings that what the Bible already have taught us.
Just some additional observations concerning the apparition of Our Lady of Rosary. Our Lady appeared “6” times. In Hebrew culture (the Israelite culture), 6 is the imperfect number. A number usually associated with evil things. Thus, the number of the Beast in the Book of Revelations tells us that it is 666.
Another observation is the dates of the apparition. The apparition dates are significantly on the 13th of every month of that year. Even until, Roman Catholics believe that 13th is always associated with evil things like Friday the 13t h bad luck and not placing 13th floor on buildings. Not to mention all the horror movies that happens on Friday the 13th.
Now let me ask you, do you really believe that these apparitions comes from God? These apparition and commands are completely in contrast to what the Bible teaches us. They are “Our Lady of Rosary” centered rather than “God” centered. The apparitions promotes glory and honor for “Our Lady of Rosary” rather than the glory of God. And finally, even culture related things are in contradiction to the apparitions. Not to mention its lack of Apostolicity and Biblical support.
Does not matter if it is bible-based. It works real well. And you know them by their fruit.
Only by a very fractured exegesis of verbiage. Your interpretation of my language certainly does have a strange bent.. I reviewed my post and saw nothing of an anti Catholic OR anti-Protestant slant. Maybe you would like to enlighten me as to the anti-Catholic phraseology?
I did see a portion that could have punctured the epidermis of certain thin skinned people who presume more than they should. I can see how this would elicit a response from such an one.
Perchance are your shoes fitting properly?
Not to mention the shoe fits part...
Quote the personal attack part.
(Good that you agree, zero hero!) : )
I didn’t ask for your logic.
I know what you are asking. What I am asking is how can you deny that Mary is the mother of God incarnate when scripture very clearly describes Mary as giving birth to the Word made flesh, the only Son of the Father, Jesus Christ, who is to be called the Son of God?
What is your logic if not Nestorianism?
The demeanor of the poster says more about his own confession than the post says about yours. When he is being rude or mean it drives people away from his confession and towards yours. That is of course if you can resist the urge to meet fire with fire, in which case neither confession is appealing to the lurkers. The poster who “turns the other cheek” wins every single time.If the other guy is throwing spitwads at you on an “open” thread it probably means he has run out of ammunition. Take it as a backhanded compliment. You won, walk away.
Spiritual maturity is not a prerequisite for posting on the Religion Forum. If the other guy is being childish, be patient with him.
Abusive spammers contribute nothing other than their spam and they don’t last long on Free Republic.
Want to explain why this matters so much to you
It doesn’t really matter to me what you think. It’s just that I was astonished when I first read that some FReepers do not believe that Mary was the mother of God incarnate.
How do you come to that conclusion when Luke 1 and John 1 so clearly shows us that she is?
If you don’t want to answer that question, fine. I’m off to prayer group.
My concern comes from the following: "Please: NO profanity, NO personal attacks, NO racism or violence in posts." Now do those rules trump the RF arcana or not?
I have often wondered about the dead as has everyone at one point or another. In the parable Jesus answers the question of speaking to the dead and the dead speaking to the living in verse 29.
“29 But Abraham *said, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.’”
Abraham does not say He will talk to the Lord about it. Why not? God speaks to us through His word given through the prophets and the apostles. As for the dead speaking, those before the throne do ask God how long it will be for Him to avenge their deaths (Rev 6) but shows that they are trusting Him to fulfill His word. They just wanted to know when (like the animals living under the curse waiting for the return of the King). Christians are to pray to the Father for His will to be done. We can ask for nothing more and nothing less. Imagining myself in His presence would I have to ask Him to help my living family? No, because He knows what to do before we do and the orders are given before things happen on earth. I think we are to pray now because now we are in the spiritual war. Satan is here and we are God’s soldiers. In heaven we are not in the war, we are being comforted.
I read the words of the rosary once but I pray according to what Jesus said to pray. I do add details, mainly names and thoughts of those suffering (search the internet for prayer requests and be prepared to be overwhelmed with the suffering), but I am praying to my Father, in the Name of His Son. I also talk to Him throughout the day.
For you, I suppose, there are no limits, mr. rabble rouser.
Freedom to attack allows freedom to remove.
Whenever you see posts that contain profanity, personal attacks, racism or violence hit the abuse button to alert the Moderation staff.
In the broad (Biblical) sense, yes. As Roman Catholicism narrowly defines them (where the church has to confer officially sanctioned sainthood), no.
In the New Testament, a "saint" is a person identified by their holiness (note the close sound of even "holiness" and halios -- the underlying Greek word for "saint").
It is used in a corporate plural sense almost 100% of the time (IoW, the focus is NOT on the individual person). A "saint" is a "holy one among holy ones"; to make it about individuals rips it out of its New Testament context.
And the way it was used by Paul shows it was simply another interchangeable reference to "Christian." Examples of that:
* 7 To ALL who are in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. (Romans 1:7) [Roman Catholicism might have you believe that not ALL in Christ who were in Rome when Paul wrote this were not called to be saints]
* 15 Greet Philologus and Julia, Nereus and his sister, and Olympas, and ALL the saints who are with them. (Romans 16:15) [Roman Catholicism might have you believe that an abundance of "special" saints were in this one household]
* 21 Greet EVERY saint in Christ Jesus. (Phil 4:21) [This verse kind of shatters the Roman notion of "sainthood"]
13 distributing to the needs of the saints (Romans 12:13)
So...beyond THESE clarifications, my previous comment stands: It applies to many in Christ beyond Mary -- and who have yet to be conferred special "sainthood" status by the Romans.
I would say Mary, knowing him more intimately than any other, would rank near the top.
I HAD to chuckle very heartily at this statement.
Why? You're telling me that Roman Catholics are suddenly prioritizing who has most intimate knowledge of the Divine One as "THE priority" to approach in interceding for them?
Well, if THIS were truly so...
... do I even need to point out...
... that if we're praying to Heavenly Father as Jesus indicates to do (Mt. 6:6, 9; 26:53; John 14:12, 16; 16:26; most of John 17)...
...that's it's JESUS who "knows" the Father "more intimately than any other"
-- and that if you were at all consistent in applying that notion equally across the board --
-- you'd start, continue and end your prayers to the Father thru Jesus His Son, your personal Intercessor?
Even here, Jesus had a sense of spiritually weaning His disciples...didn't Jesus say?
In that day you will ask in My name, and I do not say to you that I shall pray the Father for you... (John 16:26)
IoW...Jesus is teaching us ALL to be TRUE adopted children who approach their "Abba" Father DIRECTLY --
...And when I say "directly" as a child WILL approach their FATHER directly...
And in John 16:26 Jesus is encouraging His disciples not to to slough off in only letting the Son pray on our behalf, but to approach Him directly...
...albeit NOT in any authority of our own, or of Mary, or of some "saint," but "in My name."
Discuss the issues all you want but do not make it personal.
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