For that, there's this.
Posted on 01/24/2015 3:23:43 PM PST by NYer
What has happened to that 6000+ reply thread that was going?
For that, there's this.
This one took over.
Catholics believe that Mary was saved out of time. God is not constrained by time. Mary was an exception. I believe that God can make exceptions if He wants to. If He were going to make one, isn't it reasonable that it would be to create a perfect vessel in which to dwell? None of the others called from the womb were to hold God within their bodies.
I have no problem with non-Catholics not believing this, but I don't see any reason why I shouldn't believe it.
I am not and will never be 'sola scriptura'. I believe in the traditions handed down by the Catholic church because I do not see them as contradictions based on my reading of scripture.
Thank you so much for keeping the tone of your posts so pleasant.
Love,
O2
Catholics do that all the time. I really do not think they care what the Bible says. I really feel sorry for y’all. By the way, some Catholics on here hate Protestants with hatred I have never seen before. The impression I get is that traditions are way more important that the Bible.
it appears so.
Absolute PROOF of reincarnation!
Ok; now just show WHY we Prots should 'believe' them?
What vital things are we MISSING that'll keep us outta Heaven by NOT accepting them?
Nah, she got tired of the lies. She believes what the Bible says, thankfully.
So why haven’t told us who’s sins Mary died for?
I understand that is what Catholics believe. The problem is that there is absolutely nothing in Scripture to support that idea. And since that concept is in opposition to Scripture, which says "all have sinned and come short of the glory of God", that would seem to make this one of those traditions that have to be abandoned...
Peter was not the Rock. Christ was. “On Christ, the solid Rock I stand.”
Yes.
Nothing.
Catholicism provides what Catholics must have to enter Heaven.
What you believe is your business. When you ridicule what I believe, that is my business.
As to your belief that God has spoken words that are not in the bible, do you believe that some unwritten words may have been passed down by the Apostles and their disciples?
(This is a trick question, given that for many years after Christ there was no written bible).
Love,
O2
They don't believe Mary died - they believe she was assumed bodily into Heaven. Now we know that this type of thing happened at least twice in the Old Testament - Enoch and Elijah. But you would think that something that significant would have merited at least a passing mention by the authors of the New Testament, particularly by John, since he was the apostle to whom Jesus entrusted Mary. Out of the 5 books written by John, never was anything written about Mary to suggest she was taken directly into heaven without seeing death. Neither did John write anything about Mary being sinless or her being a mediator, etc. Kind of a major omission, don't you think?
Catholics did not write the Bible. Some assembled it in 397 AD.
Actually that's not correct. The official position of the Roman Catholic Church is that they don't rightly know. But then they have writings that describe how the apostles were present at her death an assumption but use that officially or something. But then to add to that they have the feast of the "dormition" of Mary. Dormition = death. So on any given day you could get any of those positions from a Catholic. Any wonder why Catholics don't know for sure if they are saved?
>>Now we know that this type of thing happened at least twice in the Old Testament - Enoch and Elijah.<<
And was well documented like you said. But consider this. Ever wonder who the two witnesses will be who are killed and left in the street for 3 days?
>>Out of the 5 books written by John, never was anything written about Mary<<
Not only that but there is absolutely no information either from secular writers or religious writers about her after the day of pentecost. Not one word about where she spent her last days. Evidently she was inconsequential to anyone from that time.
Yes, I am who I am and my name doesn't matter. However....that is Absolutely, positively FALSE teaching with regard to the Catholic Church! The early Christians were absolutely NOT Catholics. Some of them chose to become Catholics when Constantine decided that religion could help merge the Roman Empire. He allowed religious tolerance with the Edict of Milan in AD 313 (since it was, at that time banned by the Roman Empire). Then, in 325 AD, Constantine called the Council of Nicea in an attempt to unify Christianity. His church was a mix of Christianity and Roman Paganism. This is the church that wen on to become the Catholic CHurch under the Roman Empire. This is when the Roman Papacy was created with the support of the Roman Emperors.
Nah, it is sad that Catholics believe lies based on traditions.
They did not write the Bible.
They use the Bible as their guides which is more than some Catholics do. I will stick wih them.
I doubt I can convince you otherwise, but neither will you change my mind on this one.
Jesus saved Mary before she was born and before He was born. She needed Him just like everyone else. She just got him before anyone else did. It would only be a contradiction if God is limited by time.
Doesn’t this support the concept of being saved? That if you are truly saved you will not choose sin? Why does Mary not sin when other humans who have been saved do? The non-Catholic answer to that is that ‘they weren’t truly saved’. The Catholic answer to that is that none of us are truly saved (at least that we know of) until we die. In spite of original sin being wiped away by Baptism, the effects it had are still present in that we still are likely to give in to sin as long as we are alive. Until we are dead, we continue to have our own free will, and we will always be at risk of falling into sin or turning away from God. But Mary was cleansed of original sin before she was born, so she was spared that weakness.
So if Mary was truly saved, she is not a contradiction, but a fulfillment of scripture. She shows what happens to all of us eventually when we are finally saved, body and soul in Heaven with God.
Like I said, I understand that you cannot accept this tradition. I very happily do not see the same contradictions.
Love,
O2
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