Yes, Christ Was Really Born on December 25: a Defense of the Trad Date for Christmas

taylormarshall.com ^ | December 11, 2014 | Dr. Taylor Marshall

[NYer]

The Catholic Church, from at least the second century, has claimed that Christ was born on December 25. However, it is commonly alleged that our Lord Jesus Christ was not born on December 25. For the sake of simplicity, let us set out the usual objections to the date of December 25 and counter each of them.

Objection 1: December 25 was chosen in order to replace the pagan Roman festival of Saturnalia. Saturnalia was a popular winter festival and so the Catholic Church prudently substituted Christmas in its place.

Reply to Objection 1: Saturnalia commemorated the winter solstice. Yet the winter solstice falls on December 22. It is true that Saturnalia celebrations began as early as December 17 and extended till December 23. Still, the dates don’t match up.

Objection 2: December 25 was chosen to replace the pagan Roman holiday Natalis Solis Invicti which means “Birthday of the Unconquered Sun.”

Reply to Objection 2: Let us examine first the cult of the Unconquered Sun. The Emperor Aurelian introduced the cult of the Sol Invictus or Unconquered Sunto Rome in A.D. 274. Aurelian found political traction with this cult, because his own name Aurelianderives from the Latin word aurora denoting “sunrise.” Coins reveal that Emperor Aurelian called himself the Pontifex Solis or Pontiff of the Sun. Thus, Aurelian simply accommodated a generic solar cult and identified his name with it at the end of the third century.

Most importantly, there is no historical record for a celebration Natalis Sol Invictus on December 25 prior to A.D. 354. Within an illuminated manuscript for the year A.D. 354, there is an entry for December 25 reading “N INVICTI CM XXX.”  Here N means “nativity.” INVICTI means “of the Unconquered.” CM signifies “circenses missus” or “games ordered.” The Roman numeral XXX equals thirty. Thus, the inscription means that thirty games were order for the nativity of the Unconquered for December 25th. Note that the word “sun” is not present. Moreover, the very same codex also lists “natus Christus in Betleem Iudeae” for the day of December 25. The phrase is translated as “birth of Christ in Bethlehem of Judea.”[i]

The date of December 25th only became the “Birthday of the Unconquered Sun” under the Emperor Julian the Apostate. Julian the Apostate had been a Christian but who had apostatized and returned to Roman paganism. History reveals that it was the hateful former Christian Emperor that erected a pagan holiday on December 25. Think about that for a moment. What was he trying to replace?

These historical facts reveal that the Unconquered Sun was not likely a popular deity in the Roman Empire. The Roman people did not need to be weaned off of a so-called ancient holiday. Moreover, the tradition of a December 25th celebration does not find a place on the Roman calendar until after the Christianization of Rome. The “Birthday of the Unconquered Sun” holiday was scarcely traditional and hardly popular. Saturnalia (mentioned above) was much more popular, traditional, and fun. It seems, rather, that Julian the Apostate had attempted to introduce a pagan holiday in order to replace the Christian one!

Objection 3: Christ could not have been born in December since Saint Luke describes shepherds herding in the neighboring fields of Bethlehem. Shepherds do not herd during the winter. Thus, Christ was not born in winter.

Reply to Objection 3: Recall that Palestine is not England, Russia, or Alaska. Bethlehem is situated at the latitude of 31.7. My city of Dallas, Texas has the latitude of 32.8, and it’s still rather comfortable outside in December. As the great Cornelius a Lapide remarks during his lifetime, one could still see shepherds and sheep in the fields of Italy during late December, and Italy is at higher latitude than Bethlehem.

Now we move on to establishing the birthday of Christ from Sacred Scripture in two steps. The first step is to use Scripture to determine the birthday of Saint John the Baptist. The next step is using Saint John the Baptist’s birthday as the key for finding Christ’s birthday. We can discover that Christ was born in late December by observing first the time of year in which Saint Luke describes Saint Zacharias in the temple. This provides us with the approximate conception date of Saint John the Baptist. From there we can follow the chronology that Saint Luke gives, and that lands us at the end of December.

Saint Luke reports that Zacharias served in the “course of Abias” (Lk 1:5) which Scripture records as the eighth course among the twenty-four priestly courses (Neh 12:17). Each shift of priests served one week in the temple for two times each year. The course of Abias served during the eighth week and the thirty-second week in the annual cycle.[ii]However, when did the cycle of courses begin?

Josef Heinrich Friedlieb has convincingly established that the first priestly course of Jojarib was on duty during the destruction of Jerusalem on the ninth day of the Jewish month of Av.[iii]Thus the priestly course of Jojarib was on duty during the second week of Av. Consequently, the priestly course of Abias (the course of Saint Zacharias) was undoubtedly serving during the second week of the Jewish month of Tishri—the very week of the Day of Atonement on the tenth day of Tishri. In our calendar, the Day of Atonement would land anywhere from September 22 to October 8.

Zacharias and Elizabeth conceived John the Baptist immediately after Zacharias served his course. This entails that Saint John the Baptist would have been conceived somewhere around the end of September, placing John’s birth at the end of June, confirming the Catholic Church’s celebration of the Nativity of Saint John the Baptist on June 24.

The second-century Protoevangelium of Saint James also confirms a late September conception of the Baptist since the work depicts Saint Zacharias as High Priest and as entering the Holy of Holies—not merely the holy place with the altar of incense. This is a factual mistake because Zacharias was not the high priest, but one of the chief priests.[iv]Still, the Protoevangelium regards Zacharias as a high priest and this associates him with the Day of Atonement, which lands on the tenth day of the Hebrew month of Tishri (roughly the end of our September). Immediately after this entry into the temple and message of the Archangel Gabriel, Zacharias and Elizabeth conceive John the Baptist. Allowing for forty weeks of gestation, this places the birth of John the Baptist at the end of June—once again confirming the Catholic date for the Nativity of Saint John the Baptist on June 24.

The rest of the dating is rather simple. We read that just after the Immaculate Virgin Mary conceived Christ, she went to visit her cousin Elizabeth who was six months pregnant with John the Baptist. This means that John the Baptist was six months older that our Lord Jesus Christ (Lk 1:24-27, 36). If you add six months to June 24 you get December 24-25 as the birthday of Christ. Then, if you subtract nine months from December 25 you get that the Annunciation was March 25. All the dates match up perfectly. So then, if John the Baptist was conceived shortly after the Jewish Day of the Atonement, then the traditional Catholic dates are essentially correct. The birth of Christ would be about or on December 25.

Sacred Tradition also confirms December 25 as the birthday of the Son of God. The source of this ancient tradition is the Blessed Virgin Mary herself. Ask any mother about the birth of her children. She will not only give you the date of the birth, but she will be able to rattle off the time, the location, the weather, the weight of the baby, the length of the baby, and a number of other details. I’m the father of six blessed children, and while I sometimes forget these details—mea maxima culpa—my wife never does. You see, mothers never forget the details surrounding the births of their babies.

Now ask yourself: Would the Blessed Virgin Mary ever forget the birth of her Son Jesus Christ who was conceived without human seed, proclaimed by angels, born in a miraculous way, and visited by Magi? She knew from the moment of His incarnation in her stainless womb that He was the Son of God and Messiah. Would she ever forget that day?[v]

Next, ask yourself: Would the Apostles be interested in hearing Mary tell the story? Of course they would. Do you think the holy Apostle who wrote, “And the Word was made flesh,” was not interested in the minute details of His birth? Even when I walk around with our seven-month-old son, people always ask “How old is he?” or “When was he born?” Don’t you think people asked this question of Mary?

So the exact birth date (December 25) and the time (midnight) would have been known in the first century. Moreover, the Apostles would have asked about it and would have, no doubt, commemorated the blessed event that both Saint Matthew and Saint Luke chronicle for us. In summary, it is completely reasonable to state that the early Christians both knew and commemorated the birth of Christ. Their source would have been His Immaculate Mother.

Further testimony reveals that the Church Fathers claimed December 25 as the Birthday of Christ prior to the conversion of Constantine and the Roman Empire. The earliest record of this is that Pope Saint Telesphorus (reigned A.D. 126-137) instituted the tradition of Midnight Mass on Christmas Eve. Although the Liber Pontificalis does not give us the date of Christmas, it assumes that the Pope was already celebrating Christmas and that a Mass at midnight was added. During this time, we also read the following words of Theophilus (A.D. 115-181), Catholic bishop of Caesarea in Palestine: “We ought to celebrate the birthday of Our Lord on what day soever the 25th of December shall happen.”[vi]

Shortly thereafter in the second century, Saint Hippolytus (A.D. 170-240) wrote in passing that the birth of Christ occurred on December 25:

The First Advent of our Lord in the flesh occurred when He was born in Bethlehem, was December 25th, a Wednesday, while Augustus was in his forty-second year, which is five thousand and five hundred years from Adam. He suffered in the thirty-third year, March 25th, Friday, the eighteenth year of Tiberius Caesar, while Rufus and Roubellion were Consuls.[vii]

Also note in the quote above the special significance of March 25, which marks the death of Christ (March 25 was assumed to corresponded to the Hebrew month Nisan 14 – the traditional date of crucifixion).[viii] Christ, as the perfect man, was believed to have been conceived and died on the same day—March 25. In his Chronicon, Saint Hippolytus states that the earth was created on March 25, 5500 B.C.  Thus, March 25 was identified by the Church Fathers as the Creation date of the universe, as the date of the Annunciation and Incarnation of Christ, and also as the date of the Death of Christ our Savior.

In the Syrian Church, March 25 or the Feast of the Annunciation was seen as one of the most important feasts of the entire year. It denoted the day that God took up his abode in the womb of the Virgin. In fact, if the Annunciation and Good Friday came into conflict on the calendar, the Annunciation trumped it, so important was the day in Syrian tradition. It goes without saying that the Syrian Church preserved some of the most ancient Christian traditions and had a sweet and profound devotion for Mary and the Incarnation of Christ.

Now then, March 25 was enshrined in the early Christian tradition, and from this date it is easy to discern the date of Christ’s birth. March 25 (Christ conceived by the Holy Ghost) plus nine months brings us to December 25 (the birth of Christ at Bethlehem).

Saint Augustine confirms this tradition of March 25 as the Messianic conception and December 25 as His birth:

For Christ is believed to have been conceived on the 25th of March, upon which day also he suffered; so the womb of the Virgin, in which he was conceived, where no one of mortals was begotten, corresponds to the new grave in which he was buried, wherein was never man laid, neither before him nor since. But he was born, according to tradition, upon December the 25th.[ix]

In about A.D. 400, Saint Augustine also noted how the schismatic Donatists celebrated December 25 as the birth of Christ, but that the schismatics refused to celebrate Epiphany on January 6, since they regarded Epiphany as a new feast without a basis in Apostolic Tradition. The Donatist schism originated in A.D. 311 which may indicate that the Latin Church was celebrating a December 25 Christmas (but not a January 6 Epiphany) before A.D. 311. Whichever is the case, the liturgical celebration of Christ’s birth was commemorated in Rome on December 25 long before Christianity became legalized and long before our earliest record of a pagan feast for the birthday of the Unconquered Sun. For these reasons, it is reasonable and right to hold that Christ was born on December 25 in 1 B.C. and that he died and rose again in March of A.D. 33.

Taylor’s new book The Eternal City also makes an argument in defense of the traditional BC/AD dating as being 100% accurate.

---

[i] The Chronography of AD 354. Part 12: Commemorations of the Martyrs.  MGH Chronica Minora I (1892), pp. 71-2.

[ii] I realize that there are two courses of Abias. This theory only works if Zacharias and Elizabeth conceived John the Baptist after Zacharias’ second course – the course in September. If Saint Luke refers to the first course, this then would place the birth of John the Baptist in late Fall and the birth of Christ in late Spring. However, I think tradition and the Protoevangelium substantiate that the Baptist was conceived in late September.

[iii] Josef Heinrich Friedlieb’s Leben J. Christi des Erlösers. Münster, 1887, p. 312.

[iv] The Greek tradition especially celebrates Saint Zacharias as “high priest.” Nevertheless, Acts 5:24 reveals that there were several “chief priests” (ἀρχιερεῖς), and thus the claim that Zacharias was a “high priest” may not indicate a contradiction. The Greek tradition identifies Zacharias as an archpriest and martyr based on the narrative of the Protoevangelium of James and Matthew 23:35: “That upon you may come all the just blood that hath been shed upon the earth, from the blood of Abel the just, even unto the blood of Zacharias the son of Barachias, whom you killed between the temple and the altar.” (Matthew 23:35)

[v] A special thanks to the Reverend Father Phil Wolfe, FSSP for bringing the “memory of Mary” argument to my attention.

[roamer_1]

Oh yes, the Ezekiel prophecy. That ones a head banger in trying to figure out. Whether it’s literal, futurist or even allegorical. Backing up and taking Ezekiel as a whole, it appears that this one was conditional on the peoples spiritual condition and obedience. God left this one unfulfilled because of the failure of man. Once again.

I find the literal to be necessary - How does one assume that the War of Magog is yet to happen without requiring also that which follows it? Every word that YHWH has ever said will surely come to pass. HE declares that, not me. His words do not return to Him empty. Unless, of course, you claim that the Magog war has already happened somehow (Zeke 38)...

The reason it is a 'head-banger' is because of normalcy bias. It is outside of the paradigm that we all have been raised within - Rome still has tentacles deep in Protestantism - Hence the OP.

[Uri’el-2012]

The birth of Christ on December 25 ?
A clear reading of the Holy Word of G-d would lead to another date.

A date commanded by YHvH with clear Biblical meaning and understanding.

Chanukah is a great time for followers of the Jewish Messiah to celebrate.
The eight day Feast of Chanukah echoes of the eight days of the Feast of Tabernacles
Chanukah was most likely when the "light of the world"
(John 8:12) entered human form and tabernacled among us.

Feast of Tabernacles is the birth day of Yah'shua.

This question is answered when you believe and trust
the Holy Word of Elohim in Luke 1.

Yah'shua's birth on Sukkot
(Sukkot is the Feast of Tabernacles or booths,
where we live in temporary shelters.
Sukkot is when YHvH took on a temporary
garment to be with His People
and to die as the Lamb of G-d on Pesach
in order to bring salvation to all
who would call on His Name:
(Romans 10:13 & Joel 2:32)
Yah'shua ( YHvH is become my salvation)).

Ps. 18:2, 46; 27:1; 35:9; 38:22; 88:1;
118:14; 119:174; 140:7; Isa. 12:2; 56:1;
61:10; Mic. 7:7; Hab. 3:18

Sukkot as the date is supported by Elizabeth's
pregnancy of John the Immerser.
The time sequence is outlined by the
Holy Word of Elohim in Luke 1 with Zacharias.

Zacharias served as a high priest and
based on his tribe, we know when he served
(1 Chronicles 24:7-18) and when he was
struck dumb and when John was conceived.

John would have been born on Pesach.
Most Jews believed that Elijah
would come at Pesach to announce
the coming of the Messiah (Malachi 4:5).

Factor in when Miriam visited her cousin Elizabeth,
Elizabeth was six months pregnant (Luke 1:26)
Thus the timing of Yah'shua's birth can be ascertained.

John (1:14) tells us that Yah'shua was made flesh
and tabernacled among us.

The word "dwelt" in the Koine Greek is:

σκηνόω Strong's G4637 - skēnoō
1) to fix one's tabernacle,
have one's tabernacle,
abide (or live) in a tabernacle (or tent),
tabernacle
2) to dwell

Eight days after the beginning of Sukkot is
another Holy Feast Day called Shemini Atzeret.

Eight days after a Jewish male is born he is circumcised.

After the Eighth day comes the the most Joyous day:
Simchat Torah or
the rejoicing in the Torah (The Word of Elohim).

Nine months back from Sukkot is Chanukah
where the light entered the temple.

Biblical Dates for the Birth of Yochanan the Immerser
and for the Conception and Birth of Yeshua HaMashiach

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach

[roamer_1]

You gave me a chapter and exact verse with the words “ten commandments were shouted down”? I don’t think so.

Ahh, I see.. I thought you were saying he didn't speak the 10 commandments - Your argument is with 'shouted' itself - that is mine. He was atop the mountain 'speaking' amidst trumpeting and thundering... down into the valley where all of Israel was assembled, Is that better?

The point being that the ten were transmitted directly from the mouth of YHWH. And that the people could not bear His voice. The rest of Torah was (for that reason) transmitted through Moses. Even so, they are a body of work - there is nothing I can see which separates the ten from the rest. Rather, the BIG TWO are a summary of the TEN, and the TEN are a summary of the rest.

[BipolarBob]

Every word that YHWH has ever said will surely come to pass.

I may indeed have normalcy bias. The thought that God would ever be satisfied with blood sacrifice again is beyond my comprehension. These were types and shadows. They pointed to Christ and did all that was required of them and were fulfilled. As far as this one prophecy, remember they were still in captivity and broken as a nation. This was a 'pick me up" saying this is possible, and it was but did not happen. God gave conditional covenants that expired. Not from any lack on His part, though.

[BipolarBob]

there is nothing I can see which separates the ten from the rest.

Now who has "normalcy bias"? One is a spiritual Law. The other concerned itself with material things - meats, drinks, sacrifices and washings. Even following it down to the last jot and tittle was in vain for Heb. 8:19 tells us it made nothing perfect. It has no bearing on salvation whatsoever. Again, look at it from Gods viewpoint. You won't have an earthly body in Heaven. No real need for food to sustain you. No real need for washings because of the lack of bacteria that couldn't affect your spiritual body anyways. The spiritual Law is forever. The other . . not so much. Eph 2:15, Col. 2:14

[BipolarBob]

My bedtime. Warden said “lights out”. Gotta go.

[RaceBannon]

Ill get to it :)

The one I linked to you, has John the Baptist being on on Passover, Christ conceived on Channukah and born on Succoth

[roamer_1]

I may indeed have normalcy bias. The thought that God would ever be satisfied with blood sacrifice again is beyond my comprehension. These were types and shadows.

He never WAS satisfied by the blood of bulls and goats. Torah says so outright.

They pointed to Christ and did all that was required of them and were fulfilled.

Not according to Zeke.

As far as this one prophecy, remember they were still in captivity and broken as a nation. This was a 'pick me up" saying this is possible, and it was but did not happen. God gave conditional covenants that expired. Not from any lack on His part, though.

Well, we may as well stop right here then. If you are willing to throw away the prophets, there will be no agreement. As for me, I will believe Yeshua, who said that every bit of Torah and the prophets is still in force, until all of it... every-single-bit... has been fulfilled. If YHWH can so easily throw away words he gave to his prophet, if he can write off his promises to Judah and to Israel, then how can you believe he will keep his promise to you? Actually, there is no promise to you without Israel. Gentiles are grafted into a covenant with Israel and Judah.

However, I must give you credit - Yours is a new twist on an old saw - That uniqueness supposes a level of attention superior to your peers.

But dead wrong, IMHO, all the same. I am in my fifties, and I fully expect to see the Ps 83 war, and the Magog war within my lifetime - That one cannot see prophecy coming true right before our eyes is astounding to me.

[roamer_1]

Now who has "normalcy bias"? One is a spiritual Law. The other concerned itself with material things - meats, drinks, sacrifices and washings.

ALL of Torah has a physical and a spiritual aspect.

Even following it down to the last jot and tittle was in vain for Heb. 8:19 tells us it made nothing perfect.

Study Torah and you will find that is not it's purpose, and never was.

It has no bearing on salvation whatsoever.

And it never has.

Again, look at it from Gods viewpoint. You won't have an earthly body in Heaven. No real need for food to sustain you. No real need for washings because of the lack of bacteria that couldn't affect your spiritual body anyways. The spiritual Law is forever. The other . . not so much. Eph 2:15, Col. 2:14

I think you are making assumptions that are not in evidence. And if you care to study the matter, you will find that we are not going to heaven. Heaven is coming here. YHWH made the earth to be inhabited. Do you think He failed in that endeavor?

See, that's the problem with ignoring the front of the Book. One loses track of intent. What was said in the beginning will be in the end. Doesn't that kinda make the beginning important? But then, I guess that's how folks get to where they cannot see the stunning malfeasance of christmas, easter, and haloween (among many others)... How they can claim ten Commandments and in the same breath, not keep Sabbath (which is the most powerfully evident of all YHWH's moedim), which is explicitly defined within the ten...

[BipolarBob]

" I fully expect to see the Ps 83 war, and the Magog war within my lifetime - That one cannot see prophecy coming true right before our eyes is astounding to me."
You do me an injustice to say I do not see prophecy coming true. I do.

"Well, we may as well stop right here then. If you are willing to throw away the prophets, there will be no agreement."
Again, I have not thrown away the prophets. Some prophecies and covenants were conditional. If the conditions were not met, they did not happen. Seems pretty straightforward to me. But if you wish to stop right there then I wish you wellness and prosperity. And will leave it at that.

[roamer_1]

You do me an injustice to say I do not see prophecy coming true. I do

Good! I didn't get that from your treatment of Ezekiel. I meant no offense, but simply that such a condition would be insurmountable.

Some prophecies and covenants were conditional. If the conditions were not met, they did not happen.

True, But study the matter, and I think you will find that as concerns what has been prophesied, that will NEVER apply. This is most easily confirmed in the blessing (or inheritance). It is unconditional, and divided between the brothers (and thereby the tribes), and cannot be gained or lost by any means. Because of it's division, the only portion to be found in Yeshua is the portion of Judah (the rod, the crown, and the scepter) - The rest, and particularly Joseph (through Ephraim and Manasseh,) remain in the tribes to which they were assigned. These things, inevitably MUST come true. Prove that out, and every objection must fall away.

It is too large a thing to annotate here, but follow that out... What you will find is that what you think is conditional cannot be. YHWH will cause all of it to come to pass, not because of reprobate Israel, or backsliding Judah... but because of His own Word. If He said it, it will happen. THE covenant is with a single Seed. But the inheritance intrinsically ties all of Israel to that Seed.

And more to the point, I know of no condition that impinges upon the Kingdom visions whatsoever.

[BipolarBob]

What was said in the beginning will be in the end.
Including the snake tempting Eve?
Doesn't that kinda make the beginning important? But then, I guess that's how folks get to where they cannot see the stunning malfeasance of christmas, easter, and haloween (among many others)...
I don't care much for those and fail to make any connection with them and Genesis.
How they can claim ten Commandments and in the same breath, not keep Sabbath (which is the most powerfully evident of all YHWH's moedim), which is explicitly defined within the ten...
Indeed. How can they. I don't, if that is what you are inferring.

[roamer_1]

Not genesis, but rather, Torah.

Including the snake tempting Eve?

Sure... That certainly has not been resolved. The Seed of woman has had his heel bitten, but He has not yet crushed the head of the serpent.

[roamer_1:] Doesn't that kinda make the beginning important? But then, I guess that's how folks get to where they cannot see the stunning malfeasance of christmas, easter, and haloween (among many others)...

I don't care much for those and fail to make any connection with them and Genesis Torah.

But that is precisely the point... Because it isn't there. I think Torah is the touchstone governing doctrine. I think that is what it is for. That is why those who tried to change it were identified as false prophets. That is why Yeshua cannot have changed it, nor his disciples... And no, it is not fulfilled. Much is yet to come according to both Torah and the prophets.

[roamer_1:] How they can claim ten Commandments and in the same breath, not keep Sabbath (which is the most powerfully evident of all YHWH's moedim), which is explicitly defined within the ten...

Indeed. How can they. I don't, if that is what you are inferring.

I was speaking to the general dichotomies within generic Christendom.

[BipolarBob]

but He has not yet crushed the head of the serpent.

He did on Calvary. He vanquished Satan. He's on borrowed time and he knows it. Rev. 12:12

[roamer_1]

He did on Calvary. He vanquished Satan. He's on borrowed time and he knows it. Rev. 12:12

Oh, no doubt, the jig is up... but his head is not yet crushed... In fact, it could be argued that from our perspective, he is in the height of his power, or approaching that point.

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

Yeah I heard of that position before and use to run with it... but Johnathan Cahn’s seems right on and I am agreeing one his position. It is totally full of Jewish insight. be sure to check it out it will blow you away!

Shalom

[RaceBannon]

I think he is making some jumps
taking the Lamb to His house? Maybe...
I think the link I gave you have a better explanation

In Succoth, God is tabernacling amongst us
Conception at Hanukkah makes Jesus is the light of the world

If all we use is ‘logic’, then Jesus was BORN at hanukkah, being the light of the world, circumcised the 8th day (end of hanukkah), born in winter, a more expensive lamb (GOOGLE LAMBING)

Also, 6 months prevous, even if Lambing is in the spring, mating is in the fall, shepards would be watching the mating, too, not just the birth

I do like Cahn, though, he has some good points, yet the time of GREAT JOY of Christ’s birth, shepards in the field, they could have been outside for any reason, especially if an Angel was coming or if there were wild beasts in the field trying to eat the lambs (My grandfatherr did that for a while and was fired because a wolf got a sheep at night, Israel used to have lions roaming about, remember? To assume that shepards didnt guard the flock at night would be absurd in a time such as that)

[delchiante]

Not sure of Cahn’s view but scripture and His sky tells us when the Messiah was born.

It was when the woman was clothed with the sun and the moon was under her feet.
revelation 12

That is a real astronomical event and this year, occurred on a New Moon Day, September 26th.

2000 years ago because of the earth’s wobbling, that sign was seen earlier in what we call a year..

And studying His sun, moon and stars, one can see His plan without being fully aware of written scripture. if one does read scripture, one can also see it in His sky.

In another 2000 years, the sign will be in a different Gregorian month..

His birth occurred on an appointed day, a New Moon Day ( a specific one)
He was circumcised on the 8th day and that is a weekly Sabbath when the calendar in scripture is used ( most plain detail is found in Ezekiel 46- new moon day, six work days, sabbath, 1+6+1=8th day of month)

His next major life event was His dedication in the temple which was to be after 40 days of His mother’s purification.

If He was born on a New Moon Day, that is the first day of a month. Then the 40 days would land on the 10th day of the next month..

There is one Sabbath that falls on the 10th day. It is in the 7th month. So, the Word that became flesh and dwelt among us and was dedicated in the temple, on the 10th day of the 7th month, the Day of Atonement!

It means He was born on the first day of the 6th month of our Heavenly Father’s calendar (not Rome’s)

The next major event to happen in scripture is His baptism. Only one account gives us His age, 30.
We do have a shadow event after His baptism of Him being led into the wilderness for 40 days.
That is similar to the event that occurred at His birth. So, is it a stretch to say He was baptized on His 30th birthday, a New Moon Day , the 1st day of His 6th month?
It would be hard to argue against any other day. And a pattern starts to emerge.

We know He laid His life for us down on the Feast of Passover. (14th day)
We know He laid in the tomb on the Feast of Unleavened Bread. (15th day)
We know He rose from the grave on the Feast of First Fruits (16th day)
HalleluYah!

New Moons, Sabbaths and Feasts were appointed times, given to Israel , for worship. They were to point to their King and His Kingdom.

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us..

Christendom has robbed YHWH and Yahshua of His appointed days and times to be worshipped in substitution for their own sabbaths and feasts.

Instead of scripture, Rome dictates truth through their own liturgical and world calendar, and is isn’t an accident the calendar is named after a pope (pope Gregory)

Truth is there for His Bride to seek..
But traditions of men is a sweet cup..and Rome is a power and principality with subtle rule over peoples..

[RaceBannon]

Day of atonement?
you went from Christmas to Yom Kippur?
Where did you hear this stuff??

As for signs and seasons and GOD’S festivals, they are GOd’s holy days, not Israel, God’s feasts, not Israel’s

[delchiante]

You may have missed the point..

Yom Kippur is 40 days prior to His birth.

His major life events fell on Appointed times..those appointed times were taught to Israel.. They all were shadows of the coming King.. and not only did He fulfill them spiritually, His major life events occurred on those literal appointed times. And Israel still missed them.. and do today..

And much of that lays at the feet of people who see December 25 and things like easter as truth..

Christmas and december 25 has nothing to do with the birth of the Messiah of Israel..
It is a man made , made up day.

So is easter for that matter..

They are counterfeits of actual days that are in scripture.. and with study and His Amazing Grace, His people can discern Genuine from Pseudo..