Posted on 12/10/2014 6:32:20 AM PST by marshmallow
"Christian unity" is one of those terms that stir up a whole spectrum of—sometimes emotional—opinions.
On the one hand, we know that Jesus prayed to the Father concerning future believers "that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you" (John 17:21a, NIV).
On the other hand, charismatics know it is almost pointless to discuss the gifts of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 12, 14) with Baptists or most anyone else from a mainline denomination. And Protestants of just about any stripe get riled up when they hear Catholics talking about papal infallibility or their adoration of the Virgin Mary.
It's on this latter point that Rick Warren, senior pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, California, and successful author, has waded into a hornet's nest of controversy by telling a Catholic News Service interviewer that Protestants and Catholics "have far more in common than what divides us" and that Catholics do not "worship Mary like she's another god."
Regarding Warren's view that Catholics do not worship Mary, Matt Slick, writing on the website of the Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry, goes into great detail with material from Roman Catholic sources that say Mary is "the all holy one," is to be prayed to, worshipped, that she "brings us the gifts of eternal life" and she "made atonement for the sins of man."
If that's not putting her in the place of Christ as a god-like figure to be worshipped, then what is it?
"We believe in Trinity, the Bible, the resurrection, and that salvation is through Jesus Christ. These are the big issues," Warren says. "But the most important thing is if you love Jesus, we're on the same team."
To Warren's point about being on the same team, Slick.....
(Excerpt) Read more at charismanews.com ...
uh oh....that's gonna hurt.
If it didn't deal with such important matters it would be comical. We'd be making fun of them as much as we do Obama.....opps don't say that...majority of catholics vote dimocrat!
I see that protestants do not venerate Mary the way that Catholics do. But, I see nothing wrong with using Blessed as an adjective for Mary, as in Blessed Mother.
“Is that the John Henry Newman that says Catholicism incorporates paganism?”
Did you exchange wedding rings with your spouse at your wedding? Exchange vows? Bride wore white? Bride had a bouquet?
If you did any of that, congratulations, you incorporated pagan practices into your life - probably into your religious life if it was a religious ceremony. And, if you did, then that means you might want to remove that beam from your eye.
The Word was not “Jesus” until he became man.
Jesus is the Word. He is one divine person, existing from eternity with a divine nature, and with a human nature at a point in time.
When he became man, he had a mother. She was not his mother from eternity, but in time he became man, and she became, at the same instant, his mother.
Mary is the mother of the man, Jesus, who is the second Person of the Trinity, who is God. He is ONE PERSON, not two.
Therefore, Mary is the mother of God.
Oh really?
My Queen! my Mother!
I give thee all myself, and,
to show my devotion to thee,
I consecrate to thee my eyes,
my ears, my mouth, my heart, my entire self.
Wherefore, O loving Mother,
as I am thine own,
keep me, defend me,
as thy property and possession.
Amen.
How many of those do we need to post? You can proclaim all you want that Catholics don't pray TO Mary but we ain't buying the Catholic lie.
“Dude....you can’t base it on Scripture or “tradition” by your own church’s statement....on a catholic website.”
The Church is a website - that’s your claim? Catholic.org is not the Church. Catholic Encyclopedia Online is not the Church. So, not only are you wrong about the issue, but you’re wrong about the source your blaming.
Stay focused.
“What’s left? I hope De Nile isn’t cold tonight!”
You would know - that’s probably why you’re not dealing with this:
Also, was Elsie right or are you right about “sleep” or is sola scripture just nonsense? Which is it?
Stay focused.
What part of "thou shalt not do so unto the Lord your God" do you not get?
“We are told in various ways by Eusebius that Constantine, in order to recommend the new religion to the heathen transferred into it the outward ornaments to which they had been accustomed in their own. (Cardinal Newman, Developement of Christian Doctrine, pg 373)
Where do we use those in the worship of God?
Exchanging wedding vows in public - that’s from pagans.
Bride in white - that’s from pagans.
Wedding bouquet - that’s from pagans.
Honeymoon - that’s from pagans.
Maid of honor - that’s from pagans.
Groomsmen - that’s from pagans.
How many pagan practices did you indulge in at your wedding, CynicalBear?
“Where do we use those in the worship of God?”
CynicalBear, did you use pagan practices?
Cue the manatee meme.
. . . I can easily understand the primitive Christians, who on the whole were not educated men, making use of paintings, sculptures, poems etc of heathen parentage in a Christian sense . . . What is far more wonderful is what is brought out by various authors, the fragments of the great doctrines of Christianity in classical mythology, to say nothing of the far East . . . For myself I have no difficulty in referring it, as so many Christian writers do, to a primeval tradition which is universal. Such a tradition must have been, if there was an Adam, a father of men, in direct communication with his Creator -- and Scripture certainly countenances the hypothesis. [1]
[1] The Letters and Diaries of John Henry Newman, Vol. XXVIII, p. 257; Letter to Sir Henry Cole, 23 Oct. 1877)
Except the Greek doesn’t. Departing from the original language is what gets us with false doctrines.
None of those are used in worship services. Now Catholics on the other hand use many pagan practices, vestments, etc in their worship services in direct disobedience to God’s command.
“Cue the manatee meme.”
No, we need a meme of a HUGE beam sticking out of hypocrite’s eyeball. . . while wearing a wedding dress.
“Departing from the original language is what gets us with false doctrines.”
How many years of Greek and Hebrew do you have under your belt?
stay on task here. You keep trying to deflect which tells me you can't defend this mess.
The use of temples, and these dedicated to particular saints, and ornamented on occasions with branches of trees; incense, lamps, and candles; votive offerings on recovery from illness; holy water; asylums; holydays and seasons, use of calendars, processions, blessings on the fields; sacerdotal vestments, the tonsure, the ring in marriage, turning to the East, images at a later date, perhaps the ecclesiastical chant, and the Kyrie Eleison, are all of pagan origin, and sanctified by their adoption into the Church.[Cardinal Newman - Development of Christian Doctrine, pg 373]
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