Posted on 12/03/2014 10:23:22 AM PST by NKP_Vet
In a new video, megachurch leader and author Rick Warren is calling for Christians to unite with Roman Catholics and “Pope Francis,” who Warren recently referred to as the “Holy Father”—a move that is raising concerns among Christians nationwide and is resulting in calls for Warren to repent.
Warren made the comments following his visit to the Vatican last month, where he spoke at an interfaith conference on the “Complementarity of Man and Woman.”
“We have far more in common than what divides us,” he said in the two-minute video released by the Catholic News Service on Wednesday, described as being an outline for “an ecumenical vision for Catholics and Protestants to work together to defend the sanctity of life, sex and marriage.”
“They would all say, ‘We believe in the Trinity; we believe in the Bible; we believe in the resurrection; we believe in salvation through Jesus Christ,” Warren asserted, speaking of the various denominations within Christianity, of which he included Roman Catholicism. “These are the big issues.”
The author of the bestselling book “The Purpose Driven Life” then sought to defend Catholics from those who take issue with the practice of seeking the intercession of Mary and the various deceased persons that have been sainted by the Vatican.
“Sometimes protestants think that Catholics worship Mary like she’s another god, but that’s not exactly Catholic doctrine,” Warren contended. “People say, ‘What are the saints all about? Why are you praying to the saints?’ And when you understand what they mean by what they’re saying, there’s a whole lot more commonality [that we have with Roman Catholics].”
“There’s still real differences—no doubt about that,” Warren stated. “But the most important thing is, if you love Jesus, we’re on the same team.”
He closed by speaking of his belief that Christians and Catholics serve as co-laborers for the cause of defending life and family.
“When it comes to the family, we are co-workers in the field in this for the protection of the sanctity of life, the sanctity of sex and the sanctity of marriage,” Warren said. “So, there’s a great commonality and there’s no division on any of those three.”
But Warren’s comments have raised concern from Christian leaders nationwide, who are now calling the Saddleback leader to repentance. Matt Slick of the Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry (CARM) repudiated each of Warren’s points.
“Sure, there are Catholics who love the real Christ, the one who died on the cross for our sins. That is not the problem,” he said. “The problem is the Roman Catholic Church’s false teachings concerning Mary and salvation.”
“Rick Warren says both the Catholics and the Protestants believe in the Bible. But, there is a significant difference between the Bible of the Protestants and the Roman Catholic Church, which has added seven books,” Slick wrote. “[T]here are numerous problems in the apocryphal books, such as the teaching of salvation by works [and] the offering of money for the sins of the dead.”
“Warren implies that both Protestants and Catholics have the same view of salvation,” he continued. “Though it’s technically correct to say that Catholics believe in salvation through Jesus Christ, they reject justification by faith alone in Christ alone. Instead, it teaches that good works of various kinds are necessary for salvation.”
The Christian apologist then pointed to several Roman Catholic teachings on Mary, mainly from the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC), such as that Mary “by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation” and that “[b]y asking Mary to pray for us, we acknowledge ourselves to be poor sinners and we address ourselves to the ‘Mother of Mercy,’ the All-Holy One.”
“Rick Warren has not only failed to recognize the problems in these serious areas, but he has lent his credibility as a Protestant pastor in support of the Roman Catholic Church,” Slick wrote. “This should never be done by any Protestant pastor who takes the Bible seriously. I must conclude that Mr. Warren does not take the word of God seriously and/or he does not understand the damnable teachings of Roman Catholicism regarding salvation.”
“Rick Warren needs to repent,” he said.
Hi Elsie, I should have given you credit for posting these scriptures on this thread. I just read it here. See my post at 155.
I think where a lot of us think that we shouldn’t judge or condemn comes from the Sermon on the Mount (the greatest sermon ever given, in my book). After reading the scripture you posted, I found it to be correct that we should understand our position in judgment. I shy away from calling it judgment and I call it discernment. I feel that I am allowed to look at any tree and see if I wish to partake of it’s fruit. I don’t call that judgment, I call it discerning. A good tree will produce good fruit and a bad tree will produce bad fruit. Simple. A tree can be a person, a church, many other things such as a website like FR. FR produces good fruit and the huff n puff produces bad fruit (in my humble opinion). You showed me where it is important to instruct and rebuke, but I find it important to do so in order to Glorify our Fathers name and because we love our brother.
Thanks for showing me something I may have needed to know. Thanks again and God bless.
“They just can’t figure out how any protestant could possibly have good things to say about their version of Satan on earth, i.e. the Catholic Church.
No non-Catholic has ever called the Catholic church by that term. Only a Catholic has”
I needed a good laugh this morning and you just gave it to me. But I can tell you one protestant that never called Catholicism a false religion and NEVER told them to convert or they were going to hell, and his name was Billy Graham.
Which canon did/does that?
Every religion/denomination proposes they know the best path. There is a difference however between telling someone that I-95 north is the correct path from Jacksonville to Richmond, and telling them that if they head west they will never be allowed into Richmond.
Of course, all religions/denominations also make a practical admission at some level, that if you head south to Key West and blow the bridges behind you, that your chances of ending your journey in Richmond appear to be zero.
In fact, the Catholic belief in pergatory extends more room to non-adherents than most protestant faiths do. In 24 years of exposure to the RCC I have never once heard it taught that protestants are going to hell; however, when I attended protestant services growing up, I was taught that Catholics were going to hell.
Baptism is no more a part of salvation than the ark was a part of Noah making it through the flood.
If you can’t support your claim that Billy Graham labels Mormonism Christian, you should have it pulled.
You seem unable to prove your bizarre claim that “” Billy Graham is absolutely despised by millions of evangelicals””.
You should have the false claim pulled.
Rick Warren is not going Catholic. He is going apostate to the max. He is all for the one world religion led by the False Prophet of Revelation. He is primed to lead millions of souls to hell with his false teachings. People who follow this guy are going straight to hell unless they repent their ways. Warren, Joel Osteen, Joyce Meyer, TD Jakes, Benny the Henn, Jim Bakker, Joseph Prince, Rod Parsley, Kenneth Copeland, Jesse Duplantis, David Ibiyeomie, and others. These people teach the send us your “seed money”. You plant your “seed money” with them and you will get rich!!! No, the ones who get rich are these false teachers. Many of them do not believe that Jesus died on the Cross for the sins of man. Osteen has had many opportunities to speak that Jesus IS the Son of God, yet he back peddles. Joyce Meyer and her clan live in a personal gated community near St Louis. She and her children each have their individual mansion. They have a huge swimming pool and pool house. All drive the very best automobiles. Everywhere she goes she goes in a limo and flys in her personal jet. All from the money of people sending in their “seed money.” Bakker’s track record is clear. A conviction for stealing from the people who gave. If you research everyone of these people, you will find false teachings, false beliefs, beliefs that do not follow the Bible. Each is misleading people. Each is stealing from the people with this “seed money” theft. Following this mob will break your wallet, and mislead you straight down the road to hell.
Again, no link to prove your assertions means that the charge if totally baseless and can be summarily dismissed as the nonsense that it is.
DECREE ON JUSTIFICATION (anathemas)
http://history.hanover.edu/texts/trent/ct06.html
DECREE ON THE SACRAMENTS (anathemas)
DECREE CONCERNING THE MOST HOLY SACRAMENT OF THE EUCHARIST (anathemas)
http://history.hanover.edu/texts/trent/ct13.html
ON THE MOST HOLY SACRAMENTS OF PENANCE AND EXTREME UNCTION (anathemas)
http://history.hanover.edu/texts/trent/ct14.html
Check your church laws that were established at Trent.
Canon 9. If anyone says that the sinner is justified by faith alone, meaning that nothing else is required to cooperate in order to obtain the grace of justification, and that it is not in any way necessary that he be prepared and disposed by the action of his own will, let him be anathema.
A couple more laws that you might want to consider:
Canon 19. If anyone says that nothing besides faith is commanded in the Gospel, that other things are indifferent, neither commanded nor forbidden, but free; or that the ten commandments in no way pertain to Christians, let him be anathema.
Canon 24. If anyone says that the justice received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works, but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, let him be anathema.
Canon 27. If anyone says that there is no mortal sin except that of unbelief, or that grace once received is not lost through any other sin however grievous and enormous except by that of unbelief, let him be anathema.
Always have seemed to give Jesus the economy class seat while Mary rides first class.
Your analogy falls apart very quickly.
While Metmom and I may disagree on a variety of issues, and belong to different churches, I have no doubt that she is on the right road. We may be in different lanes, but we are going in the same direction. She is has professed that she is saved by grace through faith in Christ alone and that makes her a Christian.
IV Lateran Council, ex cathedra: “One indeed is the universal Church of the Faithful, outside of which no one at all is saved.” No Mary. No works to save us.
Sure, let's do that.
Canon 9. If anyone says that the sinner is justified by faith alone, meaning that nothing else is required to cooperate in order to obtain the grace of justification, and that it is not in any way necessary that he be prepared and disposed by the action of his own will, let him be anathema.
This casts no one to hell, as you claim. Stating that someone who teaches against Church teachings should be strongly disagreed with. You know what anathema means right?
A couple more laws that you might want to consider:
Canon 19. If anyone says that nothing besides faith is commanded in the Gospel, that other things are indifferent, neither commanded nor forbidden, but free; or that the ten commandments in no way pertain to Christians, let him be anathema.
Ditto the above.
Canon 24. If anyone says that the justice received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works, but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, let him be anathema.
OK I'm seeing the trend here. You don't understand what "let him be anathema." means. It means that you should strongly disagree with them and not accept their teaching. It does not mean that their heretical action curses them to hell.
Is there a religion/sect that says that people who teach a falsity (according to that religion) should not be disagreed with?
What else have you got, to answer who/when the Catholic Church condemned someone to hell?
Not certain how my analogy fell apart, as you didn’t actually address it.
You did seem to make a strong defense of Metmom against a charge that was never made, so I guess you fell better?
Anathema=accursed.
That is a bad thing, leading to Hell.
Read your old teaching, not the fluff since Vatican II.
Following BGEA crusades, historically, some Roman Catholics have left the RCC and joined with just regular ol’ believers in Lord Jesus Christ for worship of God and fellowship with like-minded people...and in substantial numbers over the years.
I can see why you would not care much for BG.
Going back to 1215 without context, nice. How do you read that as a positive assertion that the Church is condemning people to hell?
And tell me, what do you believe regarding the ability of someone that is saved and faithful to produce no works? Secondly, how many angels do you suppose can fit on the head of a pin?
It’s your church. They claim to be never changing. Don’t look for me to provide your excuses.
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