Posted on 11/08/2014 6:51:24 PM PST by SeekAndFind
This is beyond crazy. Mary, the Mother of God, the purest and most perfect of all God’s creation in Heaven and Earth, spoken of as “full of grace” by Angel Gabriel, has “no more grace than anybody else.”
This is precisely the kind of rot that comes through when 2000 years of Church history is ignored, and the work of eminent Catholic theologians as well as leading Protestant theologians who have converted to Catholicism is now questioned and to add insult to injury must now suffer the neophyte ramblings of home schooled Bible scripturalists.
I call this believing you are saved by believing you are saved. I find it to be another form of personal work, with the risk of being a work of doubt, rather than a work of faith. It seems to me to be in direct contradiction to Jesus' commands to watch ourselves to make sure we remain in a state of grace, so to speak, and James' letter, that a man is justified by works of faith (not works of the law), so to speak.
Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season? Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write; These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars; I know thy works, that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead. Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God. Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee. Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy. He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
Sure didn’t take the Protestant Bashers long to show up, now did it?
You're picking a silly fight and flaming a man who has devoted his life as God's servant preaching The Gospel.
How do we know beyond a doubt what GOD says and means? We know because The Holy Spirit was sent not to just the Disciples but the believers. The Church Built Upon The Foundation of The Revelation Of Jesus Christ To Man From GOD Of Which The Gates Of Hell Will Not Prevail. It has no denominational name Protestant nor Catholic. The fact we are given this is the correction to man written/decreed church dogma, writs, etc wrongs.
The others you speak of David Koreshs, Jim Jones, Jimmy Swaggart, Joel Osteen, Sharptons, and Rev. Wrights, Rev. Moons, you tell us what has been their fruits? See the very big difference? Likely not but it's obvious.
What did Christ say about who is His mother? Luke ch 8 v 19-21 addresses this. Those who hear the Word of GOD and obey it are his brother and mother. Christ says it again in Luke chapter 11 27-28. Actually He says "But even more blessed are those who hear the Word Of God and put it to practice. That after a woman yelled blessed is the woman from which you came and were nursed. Mary was blessed in the fact she of all women was chosen of GOD to give physical birth to Jesus.
God assures us that we can. It's not arrogance to believe God and take Him at His word when He promises us something.
It's called *faith* and *trust* and *believing*.
To state otherwise is to call God a liar and say that we know better than Him.
That you may know you have eternal life
John 20:30-31 Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
1 John 5:13-15 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life. And this is the confidence that we have toward him, that if we ask anything according to his will he hears us. And if we know that he hears us in whatever we ask, we know that we have the requests that we have asked of him.
If someone were depending on their own works to save them, sure, it would be presumptuous because nobody can do enough works to merit heaven. That's why we need forgiveness and the perfect righteousness of Christ credited to our account, so that when God sees us, He sees the righteousness of Christ covering us and sees us as righteous as Him.
That's why Catholics don't have assurance of their salvation. Because they are depending on what they do.
And that's why born again believers DO have that assurance because we realize that it's HE who works in us to will and to do according to His good pleasure.
We're safe and secure because while we fail, He won't and can't and will follow through with what He promised us.
When Jesus therefore saw his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thy son! Then saith he to the disciple, Behold thy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.
I find the argument that Jesus had not yet fulfilled all righteousness when he offered himself as a sacrifice to be erroneous.
Eating Jesus, breaking the commands of God in consuming blood, does not save anyone.
Again, an example of Catholic teaching that it's works, what you do, that save you, and not faith, as Scripture teaches.
Only if you're depending on yourself, thinking that you yourself are good enough.
God tells us that we are secure because HE does it.
Security of the believer
John 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
John 10:25-30 Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in my Father's name bear witness about me, but you do not believe because you are not among my sheep. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one.”
1 Corinthians 1:4-8 I give thanks to my God always for you because of the grace of God that was given you in Christ Jesus,that in every way you were enriched in him in all speech and all knowledge—even as the testimony about Christ was confirmed among you—so that you are not lacking in any gift, as you wait for the revealing of our Lord Jesus Christ, who will sustain you to the end, guiltless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 Corinthians 1:21-22 And it is God who establishes us with you in Christ, and has anointed us, and who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.
2 Corinthians 5:4-8 For while we are still in this tent, we groan, being burdened—not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
So we are always of good courage. We know that while we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord, for we walk by faith, not by sight. Yes, we are of good courage, and we would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord.
Ephesians 1:13-14 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.
Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
Colossians 1:13-14 He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
Colossians 3:3 For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
1 Peter 1:3-5 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3156607/posts?page=313#313
2 Corinthians 1:21-22 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.
For which the Greek, from the Byzantine, is:
2Corinthians 1:21-22 ο δε βεβαιων ημας συν υμιν εις χριστον και χρισας ημας θεος ο και σφραγισαμενος ημας και δους τον αρραβωνα του πνευματος εν ταις καρδιαις ημων
The first word in bold above is “bebaion,” the idea of confirmation, frequently used in commercial settings to confirm a bargain. Which of course makes sense of the remaining terms used here, which are also elements of a secured contract.
The second word in bold above is “sphragisamenos,” being sealed is to be marked by the signature, signet ring, or other unique proof of identity, that we belong to God, and this sealing is done by God, who is the one taking action in this verse. We do not and cannot seal ourselves. We do not, by our own powers, have access to God’s “signet ring.”
The third bolded word above is “arrabona,” and indicates what we might loosely refer to as earnest money, but in Hebrew culture conveys more the idea of a pledge of covenant, a security given as a guarantee that the deal will go through, though we only receive part payment at the beginning. See ערב for the related Hebrew stem indicating “pledge.”
Honor your father and mother. His last act of compassion provided for her earthly future care. It was within his means to ask it of John and he did. That is where I am coming from. The Bible does address taking care of ones parents in other passages.
The blood that was forbidden was that of animals...etc in Deuteronomy:
One Place for Worship
…22”Just as a gazelle or a deer is eaten, so you will eat it; the unclean and the clean alike may eat of it. 23”Only be sure not to eat the blood, for the blood is the life, and you shall not eat the life with the flesh. 24”You shall not eat it; you shall pour it out on the ground like water.…
Cross References
Acts 15:20
Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.
NOW AT THE LORDS SUPPER JESUS PROCLAIMED to drink his blood and eat his body in remembrance of him....THE LIFE IS IN THE BLOOD....eternal life is from his blood....shed on the cross.
Communion represents the cross and the blood shed by Jesus, who took our sins on the cross, it says ‘by his stripes we are healed.’. The blood of an animals is NOT what he was talking about at the Lords Supper.
Animal blood was what was being forbidden in Deuteronomy!
In John 6:63 the Bible is talking about living by the SPIRIT and not by the Flesh...we conquer the flesh by the Holy Spirit to keep from sinning, and that has nothing to do with Communion....Jesus body and blood.
You have a lot better background knowledge than me :>} Christ said over and over BELIEVE and preached FAITH. Yet if Billy Graham takes GOD at His Word claiming GOD’s promise he is wrong in some peoples eyes for doing so? I don’t believe he’s wrong rather he is acting in obedience to GOD’s Word.
It's funny that you categorize as "rot" something that you claim is disputed by "2000 years of church history" as if everything the Roman Catholic church teaches today is exactly the same as that of the Apostles. We know this is NOT true and honest Catholic theologians admit it, like here, for example:
John Henry Newman came up with the explanation of "Doctrinal Development" to justify why so many dogmas believed in the modern RCC did not have a presence or basis in either Scripture or the witness of the early church fathers. Some would like to sweep this under the rug and pretend they are members of the same church Jesus established at Pentecost believing the same doctrines and following the same precepts Peter and Paul established for the assemblies they set up, but we DO have more than enough proof this is folly. The succession of the truth rather than of offices is how we know what the church has believed always, everywhere and by all - because we have sacred Scripture that tells us.
It is why a Christian today can know they believe the same doctrines Paul would have taught - because we have the words, the instructions in righteousness so that we can be complete and fitted for every good work.
Only one person was destined to Heaven, that is the Virgin Mary, she alone was full of grace and even she did not “boast” that she was going to heaven.
ALL believers are given the same grace as Mary.
Mary and Grace
The word grace used in this passage in Luke is used in one other place in the Bible and that is Ephesians 1 where Paul is us that with this same grace, God has blessed us (believers) in the Beloved. IOW, we all have access to that grace and it has been bestowed on us all.
http://biblehub.com/greek/5487.htm
Luke 1:28 And he came to her and said, “Greetings, O favored one, the Lord is with you!”
Ephesians 1:4-6 In love he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved.
Greek word “grace”
charitoó: to make graceful, endow with grace
Original Word: χαριτόω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: charitoó
Phonetic Spelling: (khar-ee-to'-o)
Short Definition: I favor, bestow freely on
Definition: I favor, bestow freely on.
HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 5487 xaritóō (from 5486 /xárisma, "grace," see there) – properly, highly-favored because receptive to God's grace. 5487 (xaritóō) is used twice in the NT (Lk 1:28 and Eph 1:6), both times of God extending Himself to freely bestow grace (favor).
Word Origin: from charis
Definition: to make graceful, endow with grace
NASB Translation: favored (1), freely bestowed (1).
All believers are saints and were called saints even in the OT.
To me the whole “highly favored vs full of grace” debate seems like mere semantics. After all, surely anyone who is “full of grace” is “highly favored” and surely no one can argue the reverse isn’t frue. After all, if someone is “highly favored” by God, seems to me such a person would be “full” of his “grace”. God’s grace is unmerited favor anyway.
How many times do we have to say that nobody is depending on their good works to get them into heaven?
What about that statement is eluding you?
There's simply no clearer and plainer way of expressing it.
Salvation is not about works and meriting heaven by them.
It's about forgiveness granted for believing and receiving Jesus and His atonement.
And just WHERE is the distinction made between animal and human blood and where is the consuming of human blood condoned?
The Last Supper is symbolic and a remembrance, just like the Passover meal that they were eating was symbolic and a remembrance of what happened in Egypt. It didn’t literally reenact the night where the firstborn were slain.
For the hundredth time, the books in the Bible you quote did not fall from the skies. They were studied by theologians for several years, several meetings and countless discussions, on which books to include, which to exclude, what arrangement they form etc, all by the early Church Fathers. This is the highest form of scriptural authority as given to Peter and his successors.
This authority is not to you, not to Billy Graham, not to Rev. Moon, not to Joel Osteen, not to the Mennonites, and not to Jehovah’s Witnesses so that we could have an avalanche of multiple “truths” by street preachers right down to the snake handlers of Appalachia and David Koresh. They all claim scriptural authority
Your view of scripture and Marian doctrine has not been tested in the intellectual climate of colleges and universities as have the profound writings of Augustine, Aquinas, Benedict and Cardinal Newman.
The central truths of the Catholic Church is the Credo and the source, center, and summit of all worship is the Holy Eucharist. Without it, all the rest is pablum. Vapid is another word that comes to mind. Indeed, Cardinal Newman himself called the Mass the perfect prayer because it is a Living Sacrifice to the Father. Around this we have the lives of saints and martyrs and stigmatists like Fr. Padre Pio.
This is why some of the most eminent Protestant theologians, like the late Fr. Richard Neuhaus of Lutheran pedigree converted to Catholicism.
Today, we have seen the evolvement of mainline Lutheran, Episcopalian, Presbyterian, and Methodist beliefs where not only homosexual marriage is accepted but also homosexual and lesbian marriages among their own pastors.
This is what I mean by the “rot” that results from a denial of Petrine authority.
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