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To: Rides_A_Red_Horse
...and many Catholics bow before and kiss the gilded, bejeweled, dessicated remains of dead people.

And even if I agreed, I'd still shrug my shoulders and say, "So?" The one thing that protestant can never do is establish a motive to worship as God the relic of a saint and Mary. Sure they can post pictures, cherry-pick scripture and use it out of context but they can't prove it. And they sure can't prove that the Catholic Church teaches it, because they know it teaches the opposite.

In the end it's all about, "I don't like that." I'm gonna go find me a scripture passage that appears to agree with me etc., ad nauseam.

All they are left is inference and supposition. But given the intellectual rigor (or lack thereof) that the protestant uses in their approach to the Word or God for that matter I'm not surprised that being the equivalent of a gaggle of junior high school girls in the bathroom comes naturally to them in matters of theology.

318 posted on 10/09/2014 5:19:59 PM PDT by JPX2011
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To: JPX2011; CynicalBear; caww; metmom; St_Thomas_Aquinas; verga

John 14:6 - Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

There’s only one way.


320 posted on 10/09/2014 5:22:53 PM PDT by Rides_A_Red_Horse (Why do you need a fire extinguisher when you can call the fire department?)
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To: JPX2011; Rides_A_Red_Horse
>>The one thing that protestant can never do is establish a motive to worship as God the relic of a saint and Mary.<<

The Catholic Church did that by openly admitting they incorporated pagan practices, vestments, and rituals. They don't understand but the motivation comes from Satan.

>>In the end it's all about, "I don't like that." I'm gonna go find me a scripture passage that appears to agree with me etc., ad nauseam.<<

Well, let's see Catholics defend their beliefs with scripture. You could start with a central tennent of Catholicism the assumption of Mary.

330 posted on 10/09/2014 5:49:15 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus in)
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To: JPX2011

It's not the perceived 'worship' of the relics themselves -- but what those relics represent.

For the heathens do not pray to the objects themselves which represent some spirit or 'power', as much as they pray to (and give worship to) that which the object represents.

That is the real issue.

(Deuteronomy 5:8)--"You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth."

Does the info at the link make sense to you?

Though you yourself and more than a few other [Roman] Catholics (particularly in the USA?) may not bow down to images while praying to whichever "spirit" or entity the images or relic represent --- some apparently DO, judging by outwards appearances, and their own words concerning it -- even as the same is on the other hand, at the same time -- denied.

It comes across as having it both ways...

In such passages as;

(Exodus 20:4-5)--"You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. 5"You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me."

what comes to mind (of course?) are the various gods and goddesses so widely and often worshiped by mankind which were not the One God.

Adding junior members as it were, of even heaven (with the junior members having semi-divine individual capabilities and 'authority') does appear, according to the many and varied instances among the sacred texts, to be prohibited.

Being that as it is written --even the hairs of our head are numbered (by God, from His own perspective) and that Christ when He walked the earth was able to percieve the very thoughts of those whom He interacted with --- many (myself included) assume He knows our each and every thought...although I imagine He may tune out much of it. hoo-boy

So why pray to ANYONE other than God the Father?

Did not Christ Himself instruct his disciples to do that very thing? To pray, "in this manner"...?

Where does He say to pray to any other?

Yet the "heathen" and pagan as it were, is known for ancestor worship --praying to them for their guidance...

Can you see what I getting at here?

The Protestant objections to praying to those perceived to be saints and the like, are far from groundless, unless we all think it best that God be something of a pantheon of Gods -- One Big One, and a whole bunch of lesser deity-entities.

It is written for us to boldly approach the throne of grace. Who is on that throne?

If "they" (all other than the Creator Himself) be not divine in some way, capable of hearing and acting on what they hear, then why pray to them ion the first place?

If we wished to send message to them, why not make God the Father the go-between, rather than the other way around, directing prayers to saints or even "Mary" as to whatever it is that troubles us instead of praying directly to God the Father who by spirit of adoption we are allowed to call "Father"?

If we wish to send love, then "Dear Lord, give them my best. It's not much, I admit, but please let them know -- thank you, thank you so very much - hope to see you soon."

Hebrews 4

12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are naked and open to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account. 14 Seeing then that we have a great High Priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a High Priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but was in all points tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.

354 posted on 10/09/2014 6:25:25 PM PDT by BlueDragon
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To: JPX2011
All they are left is inference and supposition.

O...
K...



... a gaggle of junior high school girls ... ...in matters of theology.

430 posted on 10/10/2014 6:10:17 AM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: JPX2011
And they sure can't prove that the Catholic Church teaches it, because they know it teaches the opposite.

'Teaching' and 'allowing' are worlds apart.

431 posted on 10/10/2014 6:11:10 AM PDT by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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