Posted on 03/17/2014 2:43:57 AM PDT by markomalley
A radio listener recent wrote me about an interview I did on EWTN Radio with Barbara McGuigan. I mentioned that I had been doing a teaching on dating and modesty at a Theology on Tap Session. At that session I charged the men not to leave that night until they had asked a woman out on a date.
This intrigued the listener who wanted me to expand on this just a bit and what if anything she could do to get the twenty-somes in her family (both male and female) to start dating again. Here is something of the response I penned:
Yes I suppose it was on EWTN Radio’s Open Line show on Valentine’s Day that you heard me. As for what to say, it is difficult. The culture of course is dismal today when it comes to meeting something and something we used to call “dating.”
I was telling the young people, at that theology on tap meeting that, back when I was in high school and college, we used to do something called “dating”.
This strange and currently lesser known behavior involved a young man picking up the phone, or perhaps asking a girl in person, to go I’m something known as a date. This involved an actual activity such as the two of them having dinner together, or going to a movie together, or perhaps some other function, together (as in, just the two of them).
He would ask her and she would either agree to go out with him, or not. If she did, he would actually get into his car, and go to her house, and ring the doorbell. He might even meet her parents if she still lived at home. Then he would actually take her somewhere, such as to dinner, and he would spend money, his own money, on her. He was then supposed to bring her back to her own home at a reasonable time. Perhaps if it went well, she might give him a quick kiss, and agree to see him again.
Of course, I say a lot of this and jest, but what makes it strangely funny is that, although most young people of heard of the dating I’m describing, many seldom experience it with any real frequency. Back when I was in High School and College, the goal was to have a date every Friday or Saturday. Frankly very little was on T.V. Friday nights, since it was presumed that most young people would be “out on dates.”
We are living in a very strange world. At any rate, the first thing I think we can do is tell funny stories like these. When I do so, I hope to tweak the young men into some change of behavior where, instead of just hoping to see certain women at group functions they actually seek to court a particular woman, and even more, search for a wife.
As a priest in Washington DC, I talk with a lot of young women and am shocked that so many of these very beautiful women are seldom asked out by men. It’s just crazy! What’s wrong with young men? If I were still young and dating I’d be asking them out!
Some folks blame pornography and surmise that many men prefer fantasy to real women. Others blame the breakdown of the Church and family that used to help facilitate meeting and dating through dances and other socials. Others blame the hook-up scene (hooking-up is NOT dating) wherein men and women gather more in groups, arriving independently and “hooking up” with whoever. Promiscuity also devastates marriage, since there is very little incentive for men to commit to marriage when they get one of its central motivators (sex) for free. And if marriage isn’t a real priority, why court a woman. And is marriage and courting are unnecessary why date?
Perhaps you can state other reasons. I don’t want to be unfair to men. These are complicated issues. But traditionally it was men who took the initiative and most traditional Catholic girls still feel like that is how it should be.
But frankly, I also have to tell a lot of young women today that, like it or not, they’re going to have to take some initiative. For example, if they see a young man who they would like to ask them out, perhaps they can go right up to him and say, “It’s alright to ask me out.” or, “Ask me out you fool.” Or, “when are you going to get around to asking me to dance?”
Back when I was in school, I had several young women who wanted to signal me that they were interested. They would often send words through one of their friends who would say something like, “She likes you, ask her out.” And in many cases, I would oblige!
My college sweetheart got things started with me that way. I was really surprised she wanted to go out with me, she was so very very pretty, I didn’t think she’d be interested in an ordinary guy like me. I also figured she probably had lots of other suitors. So this was important information for me that she was interested, and I acted on it immediately. I practically ran up to her and asked her out.
I am interested in your thoughts, especially if you’re a young adult. What’s going on here? Ultimately I think its pretty serious since it is tied in with the cultural demise of marriage and also the rise of promiscuity. Help me, nearing “codger” status, to understand the causes, and also venture some solutions.
And actually, “dating” was a step down from going out with a chaperone, or meeting in the parlor. Yes, it was a better way, especially when hormones have the upper hand.
So far my girls have stuck to dating. Another benefit of dating is that breakups are less painful.
I wish I had followed that approach in my teen years, but dating was passe even in the 70s.
what is that picture on your page
Hmmm...maybe too much of a good thing for the ladies?
I so agree! Supervised group events and outings are another good venue. Really, the automobile may be as much to blame as the pill. Modern communications will probably never be reeled back in again, but in-person supervision in youth should be ramped way up, IMO.
Yes, the young men in my family have all been that way on campus too! They are in the minority and I think it is a combination of having less-roving genes and being raised under the moral example of men who likewise have less cad in them.
The holding out for Catholic marriage is probably less common, and most such marriage-material college men seem to end up in exclusive relationships with the very lucky minority of women on campus who manage to attract them. The majority of women are left scrambling in and too often falling prey to the modern hookup culture that especially favors men when both gay men and the exclusive-dater men are taken out of the equation.
Sigh.
The older one's dating experiences have mostly been really bad (sometimes downright strange, like the girl who invited him home to meet her parents, then treated him like a pariah from the moment she picked him up at the airport ?!?), and I think he really doesn't have much enthusiasm left for the dating process.
The other one is a freshman bball player at a small Catholic college. Sweet boy, smart, wants to be a doctor. He doesn't talk about dating much, but if there were someone very special in his life, we'd know about it.
It's sad. This generation seems to have a real problem forming real relationships -- girls just as much as boys.
Why so she can spend a few years with him and then change her mind and get half his money for the next 20 years.
This bible says it is better to stay single if possible.
Parents stopped parenting and became the kids’ friends instead.
A couple of thoughts, first, you need a job to finance a date. Second why pay for a meal when what you want is given away for free. Kids don’t relate face to face much anymore. If you aren’t sexually immoral, a young person is likely to be put at severe temptation when alone with a typical person without such scruples.
I have two sons, 21 & 16. They don’t date either. The girls seem to be either really sexually aggressive or don’t value men.
This includes church girls. Those that aren’t super aggressive are apparently dating Jesus. This is a southern baptist but even there the feminazi’s have had their effect.
Parenting is important of course. Parents have been slacking for years though and not just this generation. ‘Parents’ have also allowed the destruction of our culture and morals.
Get this -- my son's best friend at college -- sweet guy, kind & gentle, *rich* family, and an athlete good enough to come within sniffing distance of the national championship in his sport -- he couldn't get a date either! Women were even nasty about turning him down. What gives??
Well, it takes two to tango. So, no matter how ready your son might be, he does need a worthwhile counterpart.
All I can say is, don't give up! Keep looking for and asking out young ladies who appear eligible! Enjoy the company of those who are nice but not quite right, and gather up as good story-telling the material the ones who are less enjoyable!
My son had first dates with some considerable number of young ladies his freshman year. But I don't recall ever hearing about a second date with any of them. He threw a lot of fish back into the sea. Perhaps he benefited from uniformly low expectations. He had a nice enough time with some of them, but didn't expect much, and though a few of the ladies seemed to welcome a second date, he wasn't sufficiently motivated to follow through with any of them.
But, since everyone knew the rules upfront, since everyone knew he/she would be sleeping alone that night after the date, that there was no chance of anything beyond an invitation for a second date, there was no pressure, and my son enjoyed a lot of these dates, even though they ultimately went nowhere. Even, I think, with the goofier young ladies.
I think he also benefits being at a large, secular college in a substantial metropolitan area with a lot of large (and smaller) colleges. Ironically, he has dated few, if any, Catholic girls. He reports to me that most of them are pretty scary.
“This generation seems to have a real problem forming real relationships — girls just as much as boys.”
I agree. My son benefits from having little fear of rejection, and from having little regard for other folks’ social conventions.
sitetest
“Because the bible says, regarding those who are the object of our passion, “it is better to marry.””
Just “better”? Not the ringing endorsement I would have expected.
“Because the bible says, regarding those who are the object of our passion, ‘it is better to marry.’”
So true. That’s why you do the best you can to make sure the the “object of your passion” is a decent person from the get-go. Then marry. Sometimes that’s not possible to find all necessary information, but you do your best.
The bible also advocates the “best” being full commitment to a life in service to Christ. So marrying becomes the “better” rather than the best.
BINGO!!!
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