Replies

>>>6,000,000 is a minimum; use a larger number like 9,000,000 if you prefer. Either is considerably larger than the 250,000 to 1,100,00 estimated Jews killed in the 66-73 war.<<<

How do you feel about the estimated 60 million killed by the Bolsheviks, and even more killed by the communist Mao?

>>>>This does not fit Mark 13:19-20. The 132-135 war was more significant: it did not include “this generation” as defined by preterists and there were 400,000 to 500,000 killed and the Jews began a long dispersion outside the land of Israel, not to regain sovereignty until this past century.<<<

I am certain you factored in the long, internal civil war of 66-70AD (Jews killing Jews on Jerusalem soil, a defilement in itself,) the long famine, cannibalism, a hail of 100 lb stones raining down at random, and the abominable temple defilements, as factors in determining which is the worst tribulation. Glad to see you have it all figured out.

>>> The critical point was that the Jewish Christians separated from their brethren according to the flesh when Simon Bar Kochba was apparently declared the Messiah by Rabbi Akiva (Mark 13:21-22 warned them).<<<

So did the Jewish Christians in A.D. 70. What is your point? Are you implying “this generation” was in the A.D. 100’s. Were there not a lot of false Christs and false prophets around A.D. 70? I would speculate there were far more at that time since all the Jews were expecting the messiah from the Daniel seventy weeks prophecy. Of course, since the city was leveled, all the trees cut down for miles around, and “Zion” was ploughed like a field, there was little evidence left.

Anyway, I am glad you figured it out. But this is really going to upset the dispensational crowd when they find that all this prophecy has been fulfilled. They are expecting to fly away like Superman shortly before a third of mankind is killed, a third of all the ships in the sea are sunk, a third of all trees are burned up, a third of the waters are contaminated, and all green grass is burnt up. One would think all those Christians would want to stay behind and help. Of course, the word “shortly,” to them, means thousands of years, and there are no prophetic signs, which explains why their most popular pastors are begging for donations and building mega-churches, instead of selling all they have and giving to the poor.

>>>Many Jewish Christians were persecuted and martyred, both by other Jews during the war, and the Romans afterward. No wonder they were not preterists and he Catholic Church has preserved a different doctrine of eschatology than the schismatic reformed churches. <<<

I fail to see your logic. Are you implying the Christians that were killed by the Romans and Jews were killed by preterists? That places the New Testament in an entirely different light. If the early Christians were killed by preterists, then I have to rethink my position on whose blood the blood of the apostles was required.

>>>No wonder they were not preterists and he Catholic Church has preserved a different doctrine of eschatology than the schismatic reformed churches. Msgr Charles Pope, of the Archdiocese of Washington, sums it up: “The glorious Messiah’s coming is suspended at every moment of history until his recognition by all Israel” which he explains has not happened yet. His words are like honey, not poison like preterism.<<<

At least you have made it crystal clear that you are not a Protestant.

My fellow Jews are hopefully going to realize, before it is too late, that the false prophecies of the dual-covenant crowd is the real poison that is leading many away from the glorious realm of the kingdom of Christ and the promise of eternal life. God help them learn the truth.

Philip

Per your 824, the point I made is that historically there was more consequence from the Third War in 132-135, where we have significantly larger forces at war on both sides, probably twice as many casualties, a named false mtessiah that most of the Jews followed, whose name we still remember, and an exile of the Jews from the land of Israel. It is only due to preterism's need to have a 70 date that they must try to force the prophecies to fit it. They do not all fit; the chastisement of "this generation" only in 70 does not fit; 132-135, which we even still call the Bar Kochba Revolt, also fits; as will any time the Jews choose a false messiah to fight for/with them. 70 does not fit as the worst time of Jacob's Trouble; it was very bad, but there has been worse, and there is more to come. As for the Gentiles killed throughout WWII and its aftermath, the numbers were horrible but the prophecy in question was for Israel. I'm sure many thought WWII and the Holocaust of the Jews, 6 million or more systematically slaughtered just for being physically descended from Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, including Jewish Christians like yourself, was the worst so far, but the end was not yet. Does it really make sense to you that schismatics who rebelled against the Catholic Church in the 16th Century to reform or "redo" the faith once delivered to the saints would then produce a Reformed Theology than keeps reforming itself with new "doctors" into a Preterist Theology that says "I used to love her, but it's all over now, over now?" At least Calvin and Gentry have not called themselves Prophet like Joseph Smith, and their books are not yet treated as scripture although I wonder sometimes.

I fail to see your logic ... killed by preterists ?

No, no, no, the unbroken chain from the Apostles through their fathered disciples testifies that all the prophecy has not been fulfilled. The martyrs in the next three centuries were still waiting for the imminent return of the LORD Jesus Christ, the glorious Messiah, who said And I will poor upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. God is going to require a day of repentance from national Israel, every Jew who survives the Time of Jacob's Trouble, and then, and only then, all Israel will be saved. Only our Father in heaven knows the day and hour, and when it happens everyone will know. There will be no doubt, no more books from Gentry, no more reforming theology, just an overflowing of riches from the national redemption of Israel, and the certain judgment and rule of our Messiah on this earth, and the next new one.