Posted on 11/21/2013 11:02:12 AM PST by redleghunter
Paul calls for an examination in another passage and I want you to notice this. It's the last chapter of II Corinthians, Chapter 13, and verse 5, I want you to note what it says, Il Corinthians 13:5, just the first sentence, "'Examine yourselves, whether you are in the faith; (prove it, is what he's saying) prove yourselves." You say to someone "are you a Christian?" 'Yes.' What do you base that on? 'Well so many years ago I made a decision.' That means nothing. The Bible never verifies anybodies salvation on the basis of the past, It's always on the basis of the present, And if you don't have the evident proof of real salvation in your life now, there's a very real possibility you're not a Christian at all, no matter what happened in the past. So examine yourself, to se whether you are in the faith prove yourself. You say John' how do do that? How do I know if I'm really a Christian? I believe! (Maybe you've even been baptized.) I go to church, I, think I'm a Christian.' Look with me Matthew Chapter 5 and let's find out. When Jesus had arrived on the scene, the Jews had already decided what right-living was all about. They had already built their own code. They had already developed their own system, and they had it pretty cu and dried and pretty well laid out that this is what it was to be holy, and it was all external, it was all self-righteousness and works, and Jesus came and shattered that thing and He said I want to give you a new standard for living.
(Excerpt) Read more at gty.org ...
This also isn’t a word of knowledge I’ve received, but according to Scripture, you may very well regret your outbursts of “KNOWING the WORD”. But continue on, if it makes you FEEL “valuable” or “religious” or “in the KNOW”. THe outward man just loves to revel in those outward experiences. Happy Thanksgiving.
Not you. I didn’t read this thread yet. As far as I can see you just found ‘that’ site tonight while it is the religion of some. BTW - thanks for finding it. While pinged to the thread the other day, I just started it at the bottom and your post and the link was right there.
wailing and gnashing..wailing and gnashing..
We all have the same Bible and if ‘that’ site doesn’t send off alarms, I can’t help anyone with Scripture for those who need help don’t BELIEVE anyway. They post Scripture while being in deception - they are too busy DIVIDING THE WORD wrongly JUST as ‘that’ site has.
Your understanding is not according to Scripture. The site supplied Scripture to backup their deception and you have seen it 'their way'. Nothing new under the sun.
you may very well regret your outbursts of “KNOWING the WORD”
Into threads now? Not surprised, what else do you have left?
THe outward man just loves to revel in those outward experiences
You are doing a good job of reveling. Carry on - I'm sure you have a lot more convincing to do - the time is short.
Honestly, your “knowledge” of Scripture is not worth the time it would take to bring you up the dispensation of the grace of God. So get your yams out of a wad, and relax. You know as much as you can handle.
People keep bringing up Pentecost but they don’t perhaps realize that Pentecost happened almost 20 years before the council at Jerusalem. All of Paul’s writings were after that council.
Where is it that the Torah says a man must be circumcised in the flesh in order to be saved?
The question that needs asked in that regard is, who was Paul talking to at that point and was it before the council at Jerusalem. It was at the council of Jerusalem that Paul was freed if you will. I can just imagine that prior to that time Paul would have been a little apprehensive to just “go off on his own” and freely preach what he believed he had been given by Christ. It was a the council of Jerusalem that Peter even told the rest that he “realized” there was a change and it was at that time that they “gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them”.
Peter earlier in the chapter gave a hint when he was talking saying “And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.” Then said “Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?” That tells us the entire council had been called for the purpose of discussing all the “rules” that had been taught. In verse 2 there had been a “disputation” about what rules which was the reason they called for he council. It’s obvious from that that Paul was teaching something different then the Jewish disciples (not just the apostles) were teaching.
It wasn’t a “different gospel” because the gospel is one. It was a different dispensational teaching. Paul said “For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles, If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God, which is given me to youward: How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery, as I wrote afore in few words.
He also told us there would be another dispensation to come. Eph 1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him
See post 409.
All those posts from you and not one scriptural reference? What do you base your comments on? Show the scripture that shows the error as you see it.
Absolutely true, CB. I’m at a loss for what is missing in the understanding. THREE of us have made our position clear, with Scripture. Hope you had a GREAT Thanksgiving!
Nowhere, I believe...
It was also at that Council that Peter and the 11 realized that the nation Israel was NOT going to accept Christ as their Messiah, and thus the eminent return of Christ to set up the Kingdom. They realized that something else was taking place, that explained the continued absence of Christ: Paul. And his message of the grace of God, the dispensation of the grace of God. THAT explained Christ’s absence, when, on the day of Pentecost, everything had been in place, according to the prophecy of Joel, and the kingdom was offered to Israel. Acts 15 marks the fading away of Israel and her prophecies, and the ramping up of the dispensation of grace. See Gal. Chapter 2. What was not clear at the beginning of Acts, the day of Pentecost, the stoning of Stephen, and the raising up of Paul, was made CLEAR at that council. And so the revelations from Christ to Paul continued, the body grew, Israel faded, until Acts 28 when she is blinded and set aside and officially becomes Lo Ammi, “not my people”. What Peter, James and John learned about the grace of God and the preaching of the cross, and the shed blood of Christ for the remission of sins they learned from Paul, Gal. Chapter 2.
Nowhere, I believe...
Then how, pray tell, did you come to the conclusion below?
[...] the fierce debate over whether Gentiles had to be circumcised and keep the Law of Moses to be saved. #380
One of the things I believe is that too many Protestants as well as the Catholics think that the “church” has basically replaced Israel and that Israel is no longer a nation that God will deal with separately again. Without the understanding that there are still seven years of the 490 years promised them and those seven years will be the seven year tribulation they can’t understand.
That HAS to be it. There can simply be no other reason the wailing and gnashing begin at the SAME point on God’s timeline. It’s a shame too. There is so much to be learned about the Church the BOdy of Christ, and OUR time here on earth. But, what can you do, except continue to give the Scriptures for the Body. And pray.
I believe it is part of the process of God working in the sinner who believes. God is doing the work of convicting the heart of the sinner.
Paul already completed a missionary journey before the Jerusalem council. Are we to surmise the gospel on his second and third journies were different from the first? I thought it was at Paul's conversion he received the new gospel setting up the Grace dispensation? Several times I have asked for when this new revelation was put into action and so far I have received the following:
-Acts 9
-then I was told Acts 28
-then I was given the impression after Acts 28 while Paul was imprisoned in Rome (prison epistles)
-then I was given the impression it was Acts 13
-now I am hearing Acts 15
Please choose one and we can examine together.
An additional note, I will add it was put forth by not one by a few that Paul never preached repentance. As we see from Acts in three places he did and so did Peter. So the article Iscool posted is in error when it says "Paul did not preach repentance." So let us put that aside since it has been refuted, meaning the repentance issue. It is now established both apostles preached repentance as part of their call to sinners to put on Christ.
I also pointed out in several posts that the Finished Work of Jesus Christ is the very definition of Grace. So I asked for anyone else to chime in if they have a better definition or find what I posted is in error or inaccurate.
God furnishes grace, yet we (by the power of this grace) turn to God (and away from sin).
I don’t know why this has to be made into rocket science.
God has to laugh at brouhahas like this. Wire-drawn arguments about what is about as big as the side of a barn.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.