Posted on 10/04/2013 2:11:50 PM PDT by jodyel
Joh 20:16 Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. Joh 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
He was still consecrated for the performance of the First Fruits offering before the Throne. Notice some hours later, when he can be touched... That was after his return... The High Priest is consecrated and in seclusion until the offering is made, then he can go out among the people.
Yeshua’s own words prove that he had to ascend before being touched.
Sigh! I didn’t leave out scripture however did I? James knew, Paul knew, Josephus knew, God knows. Now stop with that nonsense to me.
I am mid-trib - I think there will be martyrdom, and I think that the 'two sticks' will be made one. I think that the two witnesses are a type of Ephraim and Judah, Christians and Jews... and I think that they are raised from the dead and told to 'Come up here', just as the last trumpet (of the seven) begins to sound, is the precise moment of the rapture... I think the Bride is in heaven at the wedding feast while the bowls and vials are poured out, and after the feast, Yeshua, with the bride in tow, returns to earth to establish His Kingdom.
I think that the Fall Feasts will happen in real time, and precisely to the minute (no symbolic timing), just as the spring feasts happened in real time. Hence, while you are looking for years, I am looking for days.
Show where Thomas actually touched Jesus. Do you not think that Jesus knew he wouldn’t really need to touch Him? Your belief is based on speculation.
And who was it that touched Him? Show the book, chapter and verse please. And please don’t use Thomas words because it never say he actually touched Jesus.
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Not so!
Isa.56Without hope?
[1] Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.
[2] Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
[3] Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
[4] For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
[5] Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
[6] Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
[7] Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.
[8] The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him.
No!
>> “Your belief is based on speculation” <<
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No, his belief is from study of Torah.
You leave yourself unable to understand any scripture because you do not know Torah, you do not understand the feasts, and the things that they prophecy.
One cannot possibly grasp any prophecy without Torah and the feasts.
>>I think that the two witnesses are a type of Ephraim and Judah, Christians and Jews...<<
So the anti Christ kills both a type of Ephraim and Judah? And that they lay in the streets for three days while everyone celebrates their deaths and then they are raised?
Revelation 11: 3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
You don’t see the number of problems you have with the above passage?
>> “And please don’t use Thomas words because it never say he actually touched Jesus.” <<
You grasp at straw!
He invited Thomas to touch him, while he had cautioned the women earlier not to touch him.
It is totally absurd to believe that through the 7 sabbaths to Shavuot without being touched!
If you knew the instructions and traditions of Passover and First fruits, and exactly what they meant, you would never say these silly things.
Oh, now you know what I know and don’t know. You clairvoyant or something?
I do know Torah and do know the feasts of God. It that knowledge that helps convince me along with the New Testament that what you teach is contra scripture.
Quite the opposite - The Church was baptized in the Red Sea, It stood at Sinai, and took bread and wine from the hand of Melchizedek. There is only ONE congregation. How can it replace itself?
Again, you seem to forget who is grafted onto whom... who inherits whom...
>> “You don’t see the number of problems you have with the above passage?” <<
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Its you not Romer1 that has problems here.
You failed to note any problems if you saw any.
Your post supports what Romer posted to be his belief reasonably well.
You do not understand the prophecy of Ezekiel at all if what you post is really what you believe.
smoke and nothing else!
If you know the feasts, then how is it that you fail to understand how Yeshua was fulfilling the role of Cohen Gadol?
He had to follow it totally.
And so it shall be after the tribulation. Please show us where any of those were included prior to Christ’s death and resurrection.
BTW: There were TWO ways Gentiles could gain their salvation before the wall was taken down. Do you know what they were?
Actually I don’t add to what scripture says.
>> He invited Thomas to touch him, while he had cautioned the women earlier not to touch him.<<
Again I ask, show where Thomas touched Him. Jesus knew he wouldn’t need to just as He knew those who heard the “eat my flesh” would leave and Judas would betray Him.
>> It is totally absurd to believe that through the 7 sabbaths to Shavuot without being touched!<<
You keep preaching man’s wisdom. I’ll stay with scripture thank you.
>> If you knew the instructions and traditions of Passover and First fruits, and exactly what they meant, you would never say these silly things.<<
The fall feasts are still to be fulfilled but true believers will be taken from this world before they are.
Nice word play game! So the answer is yes in that you do not distinguish between the promises to Israel and the church. Nuff said.
So who are the 12,000 from each tribe during the tribulation?
Why make the Christian believer different from the unbeliever?
Israel had a clear advantage while the Gentiles were at a clear disadvantage.
But not all who are called Israel ARE Israel - Within the microcosm of the nation of Israel is the picture of believers and unbelievers. The circumcision is of no avail. A sinning unbelieving Israelite has no more advantage than an unbelieving gentile.
The Gentile Disadvantage: "Gentiles"; "Uncircumcised", "Without Christ", "Aliens from Israel"; "Strangers from the covenants"; "Without God"; "Having no hope". All of these were Gentile's state before God.
Yet there are examples of believing gentiles within Israel, living among them as brethren... Adopted.
And please DO try to find your 'middle wall' in the Torah. There is no such instruction, beyond the defensive perimeter of the Tabernacle. It is a tradition of men, present in Herod's temple, where the Ark never resided. Folks like to talk about the curtain being torn as signifying access to all to the Holy of Holies - But it also exposed the lie. Part of that lie is the wall of partition.
Here is a Messianic Jewish point of view on the 'wall of partition'.
One must be careful to understand the difference between Torah and Talmudism... Very hard for Christians to do.
I am trying my best to go FROM the BEGINNING to where we are now, but you are trying to mix NOW with THEN, and it won't work. ...clearing throat...2 Tim. 2:15.
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