Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Veneration of Mary in Luke 11:27-28
August 15, 2013 | Annalex

Posted on 08/15/2013 7:03:11 PM PDT by annalex

Once a woman in the crowd surrounding Christ and His disciples cries out to Him:

Blessed is the womb that bore thee, and the paps that gave thee suck. (Luke 11:27)

What is it? We have, clearly, an act of venerating Mary. Note that the Blessed Virgin is venerated properly: not on her own but as the mother of Christ. Yet the reason for venerating is indeed concerning: it is her physiological and physiologically unique relationship with Jesus that is emphasized. That is not yet paganism with its crude theories of gods giving birth to other gods, but it is lacking proper focus and Jesus corrects it:

Yea rather, blessed are they who hear the word of God, and keep it. (Luke 11:28)

The Virgin with the Child on her knees and a prophet pointing at the star. Catacomb of Priscilla, late 2nd c. Source
Note that there is no condemnation here, not even asking the woman to stop; the "yea rather" (μενουνγε) is not a negation. It is used other times in the New Testament without a hint of negation. In Philippians 3:8 "αλλα μενουνγε και ηγουμαι παντα ζημιαν ειναι", "Furthermore I count all things to be but loss" (Textus Receptus 1550/1894, Byzantine/Majority Text 2000 has here "αλλα μεν ουν και ηγουμαι…" which is the same word morphology spelled separately and colliding affirmative "γε" with the following "και"). Romans 9:20 "μενουνγε ω ανθρωπε συ τις ει ο ανταποκρινομενος τω θεω" and Romans 10:18 "μενουνγε εις πασαν την γην εξηλθεν ο φθογγος αυτων" use the word reinforcing the subsequent statement. Some translations obscure this linguistic fact: in King James for example, the same word is rendered correctly, "yea rather" in Luke 11:28, wholly incongruously, "nay but" in Romans 9:20, but in Romans 10:18 the translation is again correct, "Yes verily". NRSV has both correct and elegant translations for all three. (See The Holy Mother and the "ΜΕΝΟΥΝΓΕ")

Having gotten past this linguistic hurdle, we can understand clearly what this passage, Luke 11:27-28, does: it establishes veneration of saints based not on their blood relation to Christ but on their obedience to God. It is in that sense that we venerate Our Lady: given that Christ is the Word of God personified, she heard and kept both Him in person as her Child and His teaching, figuratively. In Mary the essence of sainthood is seen in the flesh as well as in the mind. We could say that by the late second century at the latest, when we find evidence of the veneration of both the prophets and the Mother of God in the catacombs, the two reasons to venerate a saint: his martyrdom as in the case of Polycarp, or his obedience to the Word, as in Mary, -- unite into a single practice.


TOPICS: Catholic; History; Orthodox Christian
KEYWORDS: catholic; mary
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 1,441-1,4601,461-1,4801,481-1,500 ... 2,741 next last
To: WVKayaker

The tireder I get, the more intolerant my posts become. I just do not suffer fools gladly and especially not at 6:40 am.

Where is Leyte? Never heard of it. And yes I know Google is my friend. :)


1,461 posted on 09/13/2013 4:40:57 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1311 | View Replies]

To: jodyel

One of my cats is named Furball.

Though it seems that he (she?) doesn’t know it.


1,462 posted on 09/13/2013 4:41:55 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1454 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

Do not introduce them to annalex or robby or st thomas then or they’ll be acking up perpetually.


1,463 posted on 09/13/2013 4:43:49 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1462 | View Replies]

To: jodyel

No problem.

This thread has gone on for SO long I’d forgotten what the beginning was like!


1,464 posted on 09/13/2013 4:43:52 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1458 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

No, I got it right.

You are awesome!


1,465 posted on 09/13/2013 4:44:25 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1460 | View Replies]

To: jodyel

Boo hoo!

I couldn’t sleep and got up at 4:30 or so to yak at you guys!


1,466 posted on 09/13/2013 4:44:58 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1461 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

How funny.

Did you take a boat ride and eat some good Tex Mex?


1,467 posted on 09/13/2013 4:45:03 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1459 | View Replies]

To: jodyel

Gulf - big fight - WWII


1,468 posted on 09/13/2013 4:45:26 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1461 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

Well, I am going to bed shortly.

Keep whacking ‘em!


1,469 posted on 09/13/2013 4:45:47 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1466 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

Yes, rather disappointing after all the stories of glory and no one leaving the fort. I took one look at it and said...no wonder they got their butts kicked and they all died.


1,470 posted on 09/13/2013 4:47:31 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1457 | View Replies]

To: jodyel
Oh yeah!

Tuesday morning for the ride.

Our boat quit at the very end of the extension by the convention center.

Got a plastic bag fouled in the prop.

The Captain used my pocket knife to cut the stuff away.

(Now I'll have to upload that picture to Photobucket!)

As to the question of ‘good’ Tex-Mex...

I couldn't say. I'm not much of a gourmet. I tend to wolf my food down and not linger on the finer subtleties of taste.

1,471 posted on 09/13/2013 4:49:57 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1467 | View Replies]

To: smvoice

The Hound of Heaven?

Well, I can def be a hound when I need to be. Tenacity is my middle name.

I have one friend who is not born-again yet and I always threaten to drag him kicking and screaming to heaven. And I will too...do not underestimate me! lol


1,472 posted on 09/13/2013 4:50:23 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1456 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

OMG, I have been sitting here since at least 4 or 5 hours ago. I ain’t no wimp! But I do need some beauty sleep.


1,473 posted on 09/13/2013 4:52:47 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1448 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

Just a figure of speech, my friend. One that I hope conveyed exactly how I feel about such stuff as apparitions, Jesus and Mary ending up toast, etc.


1,474 posted on 09/13/2013 4:54:53 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1445 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

Well, heck, I’d like to travel as much as she does. Not fair, but then again I did not give birth to the savior of mankind. I guess RHIP.


1,475 posted on 09/13/2013 4:57:30 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1444 | View Replies]

To: Elsie

Righty-o, but later. Sleep first.

Hold down the fort!


1,476 posted on 09/13/2013 4:58:21 AM PDT by jodyel (tly)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1438 | View Replies]

To: jodyel
http://i591.photobucket.com/albums/ss354/elsieel/SA341_zps9c59b28e.jpg
 
http://s591.photobucket.com/user/elsieel/media/SA340a_zps6cf184aa.mp4.html

 

 

1,477 posted on 09/13/2013 5:00:55 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1467 | View Replies]

To: jodyel
Leyte is an island in the Philippine Archipelago. It is on the eastern side, and I live in a city on the west side of the island (Ormoc City). I love it here, and have been here since the end of February. I deal with Roman Catholics all of the time here, as it is the leading religion. But, Christian churches of all flavors abound. I attend a Baptist church which has a tremendous outreach. They have a Bible College training evangelists and start churches.

I will be here for the rest of my life. It is a comfortable place, with friendly people, and they speak English for the most part. The cost of living is cheap. I rent a 5 bedroom house for 10,000 pesos (about $240) a month. My monthly expenses total around 30,000 pesos including a full time (6 day a week) housekeeper/cook.


1,478 posted on 09/13/2013 5:01:20 AM PDT by WVKayaker ("So we're bombing Syria because Syria is bombing Syria? And I'm the idiot?" - Sarah Palin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1461 | View Replies]

To: jodyel

Love the ‘yet’!


1,479 posted on 09/13/2013 5:02:13 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1472 | View Replies]

To: jodyel

Too bad.

Some of us have a natural beauty!


1,480 posted on 09/13/2013 5:02:55 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1473 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 1,441-1,4601,461-1,4801,481-1,500 ... 2,741 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson